Soldato
Well looking at that I'd say RT is irrelevant as no card is providing an acceptable frame rate.Reason we aren't looking at RT?
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RTX 4070 12GB, is it Worth it?
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At native, yup but good thing we got dlss and fsr 2 included and for ada owners, frame generation.
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The AIB models from MSI were more expensive. Plus the MSRP in USA was $329.00. Plus 20% VAT in UK, not sure if your price is accurate. In spite of the exchange rates.
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Soldato
True but my understanding of frame gen is its xxxx. Is judgement is based on reviews I've seen.
Reviews from when and which ones? The only ones who identified the real issue at launch with the stupidly high latency was df where fps was so high, they were hitting the vsync lock of their monitor refresh rate and fps caps didn't work then so vsync kicking in was doubling or even trebling latency, I think this has been fixed now. Latency increase is still there due to the nature of how it works but Nvidia have improved this or rather reduced the latency hit along with improving the other main issues I.e. hud looking broke in movement.
Cp 2077 is probably the best show case for frame generation, even ltMatt is impressed with it
No doubt it will improve further too as has been the case with dlss.
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This gen was no different to last gen in terms of delivering on 4k at release, games move on after a couple of years and the newer games released become ever more demanding.I think what's happened is a new tier of 4K capable graphics cards has been created (the RTX 4080 and 4090, plus the 4070 TI in some games and the Navi31 GPUs). This tier is only going to be expanded in the future, with cards like the RTX 4090 TI and possible Navi31 + v-cache GPUs. It looks like the 4090 can just about handle minimums of 60 FPS in demanding games like Hogwarts Legacy (depending on which reviews you look at).
A 4K capable teir wasn't really something that existed before, even the RTX 3090 and 3090 TI struggled at 4K in demanding games. This is why both companies think customers will pay, because 4K is still very much a premium/ luxury option. You pay through the nose for high memory bandwidth cards. Remember the high production cost of the Radeon VII and Vega 64 GPUs? AMD struggled to make money with these.
The other (relatively) new thing is RT hardware, since this was introduced costs have definitely increased (compare to the GTX 1000 series) - You definitely don't get it free and it might be a good thing for consumers if high end cards without the RT cores were introduced (not bloody likely). Maybe avoid cards with lots of RT cores?
I also think the size of the market for 4K cards has grown a lot in the last couple of generations, there are more people willing to buy (almost entirely because of Nvidia).
So, sticking with 1440p capable cards is where we will see the (somewhat) more affordable cards being released - which was standard for the older generation graphics cards like the GTX 1000 series, and RDNA gen 1). To say things have remained the same in the last 5-6 years wouldn't be accurate, games have got significantly more GPU intensive (as graphic details have increased) at 1080p, 1440p or higher.
A 4080 for instance is no better than a 3080 was at release for the games at the time despite costing almost double. The 4090 was a decent step up this time though.
I paid £279 for a zotac 970 at launch in 2014. A 4070 should not be 2.75 times more expensive.
Caporegime
That's £401 today. Not £750.
£280 in 2014 → 2024 | UK Inflation Calculator
This inflation calculator uses the official UK consumer price index. An inflation rate of 3.44% per year means £280 in 2014 is worth £392.87 in 2024.
www.officialdata.org
Soldato
Not that I agree with the pricing but I'd argue £401 is a bit low with the way pricing of materials have gone, not saying £750 is justified either. That calculator is also just taking a single inflation point where every part of the supply chain will have been increased prices at inflation or above and they'll all want to keep their margins... I'd have said £500 range would have been a more realistic 'inflation adjusted' price now, still expensive but better than £750 being passed around.That's £401 today. Not £750.
£280 in 2014 → 2024 | UK Inflation Calculator
This inflation calculator uses the official UK consumer price index. An inflation rate of 3.44% per year means £280 in 2014 is worth £392.87 in 2024.
1.62 / 1.22 * 401 = 532. Helping out with that £/$ collapse correction for you. Alright, I guess inflation already takes into account a little of that, but not the majority.
Add to that the cost of 200W card circuitry vs 150W. And the cooler. People simply wouldn't accept a cooler as bad as the blowers on those £280 970s any more. And finally I'd say that the 970 was probably the best value card Nvidia had ever released. I remember being a bit gob smacked at the time how good it was on ancient 28nm silicon.
But yeah, not really anticipating a £550 4070. The competition from AMD just doesn't seem to be the threat to Nvidia it used to be. Nvidia probably know in advance just how much silicon AMD have bought up.
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Given there’s barely a fag paper between those two cards in terms of performance I’m genuinely interested to know how Nvidia could actually squeeze anything in! Jokers! Plenty of lube needed for both Byers and Nvidia attempting to squeeze it in!!
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Soldato
Paid £187 for a Zotac 970 blower-after selling on the 2 free games that came with it.
£237 70 series with 2 free games, now it's reportedly £750 with 2 free kicks tae the baws!
£237 70 series with 2 free games, now it's reportedly £750 with 2 free kicks tae the baws!
Soldato
Nope I paid £799 for a 4070 Ti bundled with a small SSD. Surely the 4070 can't be priced so close, pricing is greedy.
I have a good memory I can guarantee it was launched at £260
Not just blower cards either.
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Soldato
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Paid £187 for a Zotac 970 blower-after selling on the 2 free games that came with it.
£237 70 series with 2 free games, now it's reportedly £750 with 2 free kicks tae the baws!
Even better than that it's not even a 70 class card!!!
3.5 x the price and a lower spec card, but you do get some smudgy fake frames. So that's good.
Caporegime
Even better than that it's not even a 70 class card!!!
3.5 x the price and a lower spec card, but you do get some smudgy fake frames. So that's good.
Yep,it uses the AD104,which is the equivalent of the GA106 last generation(because Nvidia inserted a 103 series tier dGPU into the desktop line-up this generation). So the RTX4070TI 12GB is essentially the RTX3060 12GB at twice the price.
The worst thing is if Nvidia,had "only" priced it at £450 as an RTX4060TI 12GB,instead of the £300ish of the RTX3060(which it was meant to be at),they would have looked OK and still engineered a big price increase.
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Soldato
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Considering the 970 was £260, the price you paid for the 3070 was a joke. It's an 84% increase!
The 4070 is only a 56% increase.
The 20 series pricing was a sign of things to come, yet humanity waited until 40 series to protest.
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LOL, I didn't realise they were that low. £260 is about £330 in today's money so the jump isn't as big but yeah certainly puts it into perspective.
Fortunately selling my Vega 56 for £300 made the upgrade rather cheap.
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The customer base voted with its wallet with the 20 series and the sales were atrocious in comparison to the 10 series and before. This is why the 1060 and 1070 are still amongst the most used cards in the steam gpu charts. The 20 series poor sales was the reason Nv priced the 30 series more sensibly and if it was not for the pandemic, global supply chain issues and idiot miners we would have all been better off.
I hope the consumers are voting with their spending choices and the 40 series sell really poorly. Just because people on this forum have 4090s 7900s etc etc does not mean the new gpus are selling well across the entire market. Will have to wait for reliable sales figures to come out of somewhere for that info.
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