RTX 4070 12GB, is it Worth it?

[Bencher]

Adding you to ignore mate, you are just clueless but evidently very much an experienced troll. Cio, adios, byeeeeeeeeeeeee.

Adding you to ignore mate, you are just clueless. Ciao

 

[KungFuSpaghetti]

Mate, if I can make do with a heavily overclocked gtx 1060 6gb, you can manage trust me....

The real way to get around it, is just pick and choose your games wisely. I was feeling so tempted/forced to buy a new GPU now for the release of Diablo 4, but you know what, I played the beta A LOT, and by turning textures down to medium and putting FSR2 on balanced, I was running butter smooth like 70-90 FPS mostly, never dropping below 60fps even at 1440p, and the game looked stunning even still!

So now I don't feel forced to upgrade and I am happy to make Nvidia/AMD work MUCH harder for me to upgrade, because when I do, I am spending £650-£850, BUT I need to see serious PROGRESS and VALUE for money in terms of price performance @ that price tier, where as right now I see NO improvement at all and skimped VRAM being given for the money, so its a pass from me.

I will pick and choose my games, I have a huge catalogue waiting to be played, currently waiting for Diablo 4, but Borderlands 3, Overwatch 2 and DeadByDaylight all run perfectly and keep me happy, just adjust your gaming habits when your hardware is a little behind and you are golden. Just my 2c.

Totally agree with everything you're saying, I'm just impatient and have the money to drop now. Doesn't help that the 3060ti was never the card I wanted, I was after the 3080FE, but never managed to get one even with the telegram reminders etc... had I managed to get one this gen wouldn't have even been a consideration to be honest.

I try to target 144fps which my screen refreshes at, but generally happy worth anything over 100fps, so I'll just turn settings down to achieve it and hold out. This gen is such a massive let down, I was going to go AMD this round despite bad experiences with them, but their pricing was just as bad if not worse. All in all an absolute **** show from both red and green... save us Intel!

 

[Murphy]

There are people who defended Turing V1 on here too and those who waited got a better deal in Turing V2. With all the problems in the PC market and general economy,it is a buyers market for those who have the money. PCMR needs to dispel the Pandemic/Mining indused madness in prices we got stuck with,and stop being so weak willed. If these companies wan't to price fix things between themselves let the stock rot on the shelves.

This is what i find so baffling, people defending these silly prices by saying things like Oh so many transistors, inflation, materiels, etc, etc. I just don't understand it, are they trying to validate a purchase or something, is it like a Stockholm syndrome type of thing?

 

[Bencher]

It doesn't have more transistors than a 3090ti as only 227mm2 of the 295mm2 die is in use so 27b transistors and some of that is being taken up with the cache so it likely has only has 22b or less which is why the performance sucks.

That is what I'm saying all along. That the problem is not the size of the die, the problem is because of the cut down memory bus they had to take half of the die with a huge cache

 

[KungFuSpaghetti]

This is what i find so baffling, people defending these silly prices by saying things like Oh so many transistors, inflation, materiels, etc, etc. I just don't understand it, are they trying to validate a purchase or something, is it like a Stockholm syndrome type of thing?

Yeah I don't get that either, that's a very anti consumer mindset. All that matters in relation to all that crap is gross margin, which from everything I read, nvidia has HUGE margins, which makes transistor count and all that garbage irrelevant.

If stock doesn't sell, are nvidia in a position to thumb the consumer, dig their heels in and just write it off? I don't think I've ever seen founders edition cards remain in stock so long, and considering how much better built they are and sought after just confirms they made a big pricing error across the board.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

This is what i find so baffling, people defending these silly prices by saying things like Oh so many transistors, inflation, materiels, etc, etc. I just don't understand it, are they trying to validate a purchase or something, is it like a Stockholm syndrome type of thing?

Yeah I don't get that either, that's a very anti consumer mindset. All that matters in relation to all that crap is gross margin, which from everything I read, nvidia has HUGE margins, which makes transistor count and all that garbage irrelevant.

If stock doesn't sell, are nvidia in a position to thumb the consumer, dig their heels in and just write it off? I don't think I've ever seen founders edition cards remain in stock so long, and considering how much better built they are and sought after just confirms they made a big pricing error across the board.

They were sold a lifestyle like Apple uberfans:

BBC: Loving Apple looks like a religion to an MRI scan

Later today, BBC 3 will be airing Secrets of the Superbrands, a documentary about the relationship between consumers and the brands that shape our behavior, our desires and our lives. Series creator Alex Riley let slip an interesting tidbit in a preview post about the series: "The Bishop of...

www.engadget.com

But even Apple sales are not so great now,so PCMR defending what Nvidia/AMD are doing are worse than Apple uberfans who PCMR mocked for decades.

I have been telling people for years on here,gamers are some of the weakest willed consumers in the modern era. It's why microtransactions,etc work so well.

At least gamers using consoles and smartphones are doing so on relatively cheap hardware. Not sure what PCMR uberfans are smoking though as we have to pay for overpriced hardware too?!

 

[Bencher]

This is what i find so baffling, people defending these silly prices by saying things like Oh so many transistors, inflation, materiels, etc, etc. I just don't understand it, are they trying to validate a purchase or something, is it like a Stockholm syndrome type of thing?

Nobody defended the prices. You are making stuff up. I specifically said 3 times now Tha the 4070 sucks. That has nothing to do with die size though which is what I'm saying.

This is what I find baffling, people making stuff up cause they can't argue with what you actually said

 

[gpuerrilla]

There are people who defended Turing V1 on here too and those who waited got a better deal in Turing V2. With all the problems in the PC market and general economy,it is a buyers market for those who have the money. PCMR needs to dispel the Pandemic/Mining indused madness in prices we got stuck with,and stop being so weak willed. If these companies wan't to price fix things between themselves let the stock rot on the shelves.

We have shifted in time, it is no longer a scapegoat to use the miners and scalpers which have clearly evaporated for some time now. All we are left with to attack are the prices, because availability is in abundance and last gen is also in stock and overpriced. In most other sectors, when you have these conditions the prices adjust. It is quite clear both AMD and nvidia are manipulating the market in some shape or form, but they can also massage the supply chain controlling prices in other ways.

The only option left for the consumer to make a statement is to not buy any products. It will move, we are coming to the end of the launch FOMO buyers and are now approaching the lower stack offerings which would be the x060 and x600 some six months in.

 

[Sgt_Major]

This is what i find so baffling, people defending these silly prices by saying things like Oh so many transistors, inflation, materiels, etc, etc. I just don't understand it, are they trying to validate a purchase or something, is it like a Stockholm syndrome type of thing?

I have said this many times, the way some people defend Nvidia and defend their blatent greed, you would be forgiven for thinking they are all share holders with heavy investment in Nvidia stocks.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

We have shifted in time, it is no longer a scapegoat to use the miners and scalpers which have clearly evaporated for some time now. All we are left with to attack are the prices, because availability is in abundance and last gen is also in stock and overpriced. In most other sectors, when you have these conditions the prices adjust. It is quite clear both AMD and nvidia are manipulating the market in some shape or form, but they can also massage the supply chain controlling prices in other ways.

The only option left for the consumer to make a statement is to not buy any products. It will move, we are coming to the end of the launch FOMO buyers and are now approaching the lower stack offerings which would be the x060 and x600 some six months in.

It's mass indoctrination by marketing,so people can't believe these companies don't give two ***** about them. So now it's become some sort of Stockholm Syndrome,to the extent they become anti-consumerists. It was predicted decades ago,companies would try and do this sort of nonsense. So instead of rationally looking at these things,they look at these companies from a more emotional aspect so end up blaming themselves or other consumers instead of the companies.

A famous example is "you are holding the phone wrong" and I saw some educated people believing it! I remember there were AMD uberfans defending the Zen3 price hike too.

I have said this many times, the way some people defend Nvidia and defend their blatent greed, you would be forgiven for thinking they are all share holders with heavy investment in Nvidia stocks.

Or idiots.

 

[Murphy]

Nobody defended the prices. You are making stuff up. I specifically said 3 times now Tha the 4070 sucks. That has nothing to do with die size though which is what I'm saying.

This is what I find baffling, people making stuff up cause they can't argue with what you actually said

Except that's what you've been seemingly doing post after post for days on end.

 

[gpuerrilla]

It's mass indoctrination by marketing,so people can't believe these companies don't give two ***** about them. So now it's become some sort of Stockholm Syndrome,to the extent they become anti-consumerists.
...
Or idiots.

I would go one step further and the sickness is so embedded we get people gloating how their purchase was so much better as the price they got it for was superior to someone else's. They are still part of the ecosystem but cannot see it. Confirmation when offloading for gains, so you get sub scalping between gamers. This fuels the disease as they get another one, contributing to the planned obsolescence. Only winner here is the brand.

 

[Bencher]

Except that's what you've been seemingly doing post after post for days on end.

Nope, I said 4 times now that the 4070 sucks. 4. Four. Lol

 

[KungFuSpaghetti]

Except that's what you've been seemingly doing post after post for days on end.

Most of this thread is showing as ignore for me lol

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

I would go one step further and the sickness is so embedded we get people gloating how their purchase was so much better as the price they got it for was superior to someone else's. They are still part of the ecosystem but cannot see it. Confirmation when offloading for gains, so you get sub scalping between gamers. This fuels the disease as they get another one, contributing to the planned obsolescence. Only winner here is the brand.

Because social media has been used to indoctrinate people into this - so some sort of FOMO peer pressure. Yet at the same time personal debt has been increasing over the last decade.

 

[Bencher]

I have said this many times, the way some people defend Nvidia and defend their blatent greed, you would be forgiven for thinking they are all share holders with heavy investment in Nvidia stocks.

Wait till you see the way people hate on nvidia and defend amd. That's some crazy stuff, being a share holder doesn't even begin to explain it.

 

[gpuerrilla]

And whataboutism returns. Lets stick to the brand this thread is about.

 

[Joxeon]

That is what I'm saying all along. That the problem is not the size of the die, the problem is because of the cut down memory bus they had to take half of the die with a huge cache

Well its still down to the die size since Nvidia would have knew the bus and extra cache taking up die space would have a negative impact on performance then they should have used a bigger die to compensate or at least used the full die rather than cutting it down 25% so this one is all on Nvidia.

 

[Bencher]

Well its still down to the die size since Nvidia would have knew the bus and extra cache taking up die space would have a negative impact on performance then they should have used a bigger die to compensate or at least used the full die rather than cutting it down 25% so this one is all on Nvidia.

Well that applies to every card though. Any card given a bigger die could be faster. I'm saying, a card with the die size / density of the 4070 should have been much much faster, so clearly the die isn't the issue. They just massively cut down the bandwidth. I'm not sure on what the huge amounts of cache accomplish besides fixing the bandwidth issue. Does it have any specific use case for path tracing and FG? Maybe, in which case nvidia was "forced" to put huge caches. I've no clue.

But bottomline is, the 4070 is very mediocre in performance. It looks good against the competition, but that's because the competition is amds gpu division. So yeah, not a great achievement.

 

[TNA]

You are kidding right?, that's the whole point, the massive node improvement they got going from Samsung 8NM(more like advanced 10NM lol) to advanced TSMC 4NM is HUUUUUUUUGE. They give us NONE of those gains, sure you might get a few more transistors, but they cut down the die size significantly so you do not benefit much, except with the 4090, and even then its cut down more than a 3080 was to a 3090ti LOL.

The 3070 die size is like 1/3 bigger than the 4070 die size, the 3080 is like 45% bigger die size than a 4080, the 4080 is cut down by a HUUUGE margin over the 4090 this time around. They are fitting more transistors onto a die yes, and pushing the clock speeds higher, yes, but but at the same time giving you less silicone so they can cut costs and create cheaper GPUS cause more die's per wafers yielded, all the while pushing prices UP UP UP, even though their economy of scale has improved. They turned the node jump into pure profit for them and zero gains for us, offering us increased prices and stagnated price/performance while also skimping hard on ram, AGAIN!.

You either do not have a clue or are trolling hard...

Pick one.

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