Star Wars VIII : The Last Jedi [WARNING: SPOILERS]

The problem with the TLJ is the ending, Rey is invincible and Kylo is spoilt kid. If Rey got terribly hurt or wounded i think i would have felt a lot more emotion for her, or if she closed off from the force after she found that her parents are a nobody the story would setup for her coming back in episode 9 with ghost luke helping her. We all know whats going to happen in the next episode an uprising of the rebels and Rey & Kylo fight and both die bringing balance to the force
 
That would be soooo boring if the entirety of the next film was just Rey coming back to power. Why would she close off from the force having learned her backstory? That makes no sense. She says she feels something inside that she needs to explore. Her parents don't come into it. We have just had a film focussed largely on set up, let's not wish for another! In any case, how does Kylo even know her story. If they were nobodies, how could he know? I don't think we've heard the last about her backstory.
 
Nearly fell asleep half way through this, the girlfriend loved it but I think it's because it appealed to a more emotional audience.

That being said I've never been a huge star wars fan, I enjoy the space elements of it with the huge crafts and battles but I've never bought in to the story line or characters.
 
The response from the director and Disney is starting to sound a lot like another company a few years ago.

In 2012, Bioware released Mass Effect 3.
Was it enjoyable? Yes.
Did it also have fans divided? Yes.
Was ALL the fans who were saying the ending is pure crap (and caused the whole series/game to be bad) wrong and just being trolls? Nope. (Otherwise there wouldn't have been all that extra stuff trying to "fix" the ending slightly)

The only thing is, the words "Artistic Integretiy" hasn't been utilised just yet. Disney and the director sounds like they're just burying their heads in the sand and hoping everything just goes away, and stuff that won't is brushed aside as being trolls only.

Dissapointed in how it's all been handled.
 
Meddling-Monk said:
The response from the director and Disney is starting to sound a lot like another company a few years ago.

In 2012, Bioware released Mass Effect 3.
Was it enjoyable? Yes.
Did it also have fans divided? Yes.
Was ALL the fans who were saying the ending is pure crap (and caused the whole series/game to be bad) wrong and just being trolls? Nope. (Otherwise there wouldn't have been all that extra stuff trying to "fix" the ending slightly)

The only thing is, the words "Artistic Integretiy" hasn't been utilised just yet. Disney and the director sounds like they're just burying their heads in the sand and hoping everything just goes away, and stuff that won't is brushed aside as being trolls only.

Dissapointed in how it's all been handled.
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Because what they should have done is listen to the "shouty minority" pulled the film from the cinema and then spent 6 months reshooting various scenes just because a few people with far too much time on their hands, wishing they were back in the melancholy of youth, went into the film with pre conceptions of what was going to happen, and then got upset because it didn't go the ay they expected and suddenly it's a crap film?
 
stoofa said:
Because what they should have done is listen to the "shouty minority" pulled the film from the cinema and then spent 6 months reshooting various scenes just because a few people with far too much time on their hands, wishing they were back in the melancholy of youth, went into the film with pre conceptions of what was going to happen, and then got upset because it didn't go the ay they expected and suddenly it's a crap film?
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I wouldn’t say the number of people saying it’s bad is a minority, shouty or otherwise.

It’s also a lazy argument to say the bad reviews are because “it wasn’t what people expected”. It’s because it was a bad concept, poorly executed. Are you saying it was good or very good? What did you like about it?
 
stoofa said:
Because what they should have done is listen to the "shouty minority" pulled the film from the cinema and then spent 6 months reshooting various scenes just because a few people with far too much time on their hands, wishing they were back in the melancholy of youth, went into the film with pre conceptions of what was going to happen, and then got upset because it didn't go the ay they expected and suddenly it's a crap film?
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Nope. They should be putting out fires by reassuring fans that "they" (director and Disney) get the points by fans. But there's a good reasoning for it (whatever they did wrong): explain it as lightly as possible; allude to future stuff. And it's all good and done.

What they've done so far is: It's the fans fault for not recognise greatness (even the parts that don't do anything or can be cut but clearly didn't or silly plot for plot sake). Screw them, we don't need to acknowledge that the film has issues, because it's just a minority that's being vocal and trying to sabotage us.

More often than not, a few simple words that "do not" ignore the fans concerns raised do wonders. Especially if it helps explain things.

This is exactly what Bioware did NOT do. They just blamed the fans. Not wanting to take any flak about anything, despite that poor ending.
 
stoofa said:
Because what they should have done is listen to the "shouty minority" pulled the film from the cinema and then spent 6 months reshooting various scenes just because a few people with far too much time on their hands, wishing they were back in the melancholy of youth, went into the film with pre conceptions of what was going to happen, and then got upset because it didn't go the ay they expected and suddenly it's a crap film?
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It was nothing about pre conceptions for me. It was just a terrible movie.
 
NewGamer11 said:
I wouldn’t say the number of people saying it’s bad is a minority, shouty or otherwise.

It’s also a lazy argument to say the bad reviews are because “it wasn’t what people expected”. It’s because it was a bad concept, poorly executed. Are you saying it was good or very good? What did you like about it?
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Of course it's a "shouty minority". Have you seen what the film took in the opening weekend alone? That alone tells you just how many people went to see it - it is very much a minority who are moaning.

*Edit*
Even if the average cinema goer paid $25 (or same in local money) to see the film, that means 18m people saw it over the opening weekend.
Sorry, I am not seeing that kind of number of "upset" people.
 
stoofa said:
Of course it's a "shouty minority". Have you seen what the film took in the opening weekend alone? That alone tells you just how many people went to see it - it is very much a minority who are moaning.
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Logic is... wrong. What a film takes doesn't mean that it's any good, majority or minority (which is not what I'm saying, I'm saying it has issues, but apparently you, Disney and the director don't want to know). Equally, doesn't mean that the moaning is minority or indeed majority.

And what you're doing is exactly what Bioware, and now this director and Disney are doing. Not acknowledging that there are any issues and brushing "anything" that is bad that is perceived by fans and viewers off. Which will only keep the fire burning.

I fear for Star Wars at this rate. It was badly handled when the backlash happened for Mass Effect 3, when good management and handling for fans could have done wonders.
 
stoofa said:
Of course it's a "shouty minority". Have you seen what the film took in the opening weekend alone? That alone tells you just how many people went to see it - it is very much a minority who are moaning.
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Logic is....wrong. Of course people went to see it. How would they be able to comment on things in the film without having done so?

What did you like about the film?
 
Well i saw the film on Saturday, come out thinking that was an entertaining film but it wasn't Star wars. I hope in the final one they explain certain part of the overall story.
 
inflames said:
Well i saw the film on Saturday, come out thinking that was an entertaining film but it wasn't Star wars. I hope in the final one they explain certain part of the overall story.
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Same here (not on Sat though, last Thursday), liked it. But a lot of it had issues, with regards to established stuff, which you can fudge (lore wise) sure. But you certainly need to explain it properly in the same movie (or game), which TLJ certainly doesn't do.

Mass Effect 2: Arrival DLC established that the breaking a Mass Relay is akin to a Supernova, and will destroy the system and nearby ones too most likely. Mass Effect 3 Ending? Shows the Relays breaking. ALL OVER THE GALAXY. Did we just destroy the Milky Way? According to the Extended Endings, no, but the original didn't have this explanation. And even the Extended Ending had bull according to lore; the Mass Effect relays were basically unknowable, but now we had the knowledge to suddenly "fix" them. Yeah... Right!.
 
TFA was basically a retelling of A New Hope. People complained they wanted something new and different and movies and filmmaking have moved on. TLJ is something new and different and not like previous Star Wars films. People complain that it's not like a Star Wars film and are upset by this.
 
Actually, just to add. There is a chance that they will explain the “flaws” in the story in Ep 9 and I’ll look daft but since Johnson has already said he doesn’t know what Jar Jar Abrams and the other writer are planning it seems more likely it will be a “McGuffin” explanation rather than a decent one.
 
I don't think I mind if things are different, I loved the Winter Soldier and Ragnorak which both stretched the moulds of their franchises. The problem as others have pointed out is that TFA for all its faults introduced lots of plot elements that you could reasonably expect to be picked up, finding Luke, Rey's parents/background/jedi uber powers, Snoke, Maz and the lightsabre. All of these were pretty much discarded with no care or attention. I think if the odd element was under developed in an otherwise cohesive film no one would care. But what we were given was an artless thoughtless plotting of an average movie that carelessly treated its direct prequels plot. I avoided as much info on this film as possible so I could go in blank having watched TFA twice (once on release on once when BR came out) and was so disappointed. Rian Johnson wasn't bold he was careless, he didn't forge a new direction he was directionless. If I expected things from the plot it's because Lucasfilm had teased me with them in TFA. If Abrahams can rescue the trilogy from the bind RJ has put him in he'll be a genius. So sad really.
 
I think the problem with the TLJ is that there now seems to be no over-riding vision of what this trilogy's arc is going to be. A new director came in, threw away the existing plans from TFA, and all the things that were lined up from TFA just seemed to get binned.
Finding Luke and returning the lightsaber, Rey's origins, Snoke's evil plans, Kylo's conflict, Finn at death's door, etc. All lined up from TFA, just thrown away in TLJ.

Disney are going to have problems if they let every director come back and just chuck away whatever they like. It will make the films disjointed and almost not related to each other.
 
I generally enjoyed it. The sound track and effects were very impressive. I was a bit long though - could have definitely edited 15 mins out of it at least. The humour was a bit cheesy in places, and Mark Hamil still can't act, but it was the same in the original films too. The problem is some people take Star Wars far too seriously. It's a kids film franchise, not a documentary or piece of art house cinema.
 
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