Summer Transfer Window 22/23

Ajax sell players every year, it's literally their business model. VdB is still competing with Bruno unless ETH does something interesting like moving one out wide (which might happen if Rashford doesn't find some form) It was highly unlikely he was going to walk in and start over Bruno.

Rangnick didn't fancy a lot of players and the ones that he did fancy played dreadfully under him. I'm not sure I'd be placing any value on what he did at all here.
 
C Kent said:
"It's the owners fault that a succession of managers have brought **** players, had **** training methods, had **** tactics. We just need another couple of billion to spend on transfers and everything will be rosey'
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You seem keen to try and absolve the Glazers of any blame? Ultimately it's their fault, however you look at it. Spending lots of money on players without any sort of a plan or structure does not yield results. Look at Everton for another example.

I don't think it's right to let the manager have the only say in who we sign, but if that is the plan, they have failed to back him. There doesn't seem to be any form of functioning recruitment department, so that must be the plan...
 
Robbo said:
You seem keen to try and absolve the Glazers of any blame? Ultimately it's their fault, however you look at it. Spending lots of money on players without any sort of a plan or structure does not yield results. Look at Everton for another example.

I don't think it's right to let the manager have the only say in who we sign, but if that is the plan, they have failed to back him. There doesn't seem to be any form of functioning recruitment department, so that must be the plan...
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Not at all, but yet again the cheer leader in charge of the narrative absolves the players/manager of any blame, its happened time and time again in the past few years. Neville's constant takes on the issues are full of contradiction, moaning about the Superleague being all about money and yet 30 minutes later he's tweeting about how you should be throwing down 300 million on a couple of players to get you challenging again, hell you only have to look at how him and his buddies run Salford to see he's full of ****.

What do you think the extra 20 odd million a year the glaziers take out would achieve in on the field success? Now the narrative is that the glaziers dont put any of their own money into the club, well der, that's the whole point of ffp, so clubs are self sustaining without having to reply on owners etc pumping clubs full of their own money. Speaking of, hes wanting someone to come along and bank roll a few more billion into the club and ignore ffp rulings? Why is that. Yes the glaziers are ****, but you've had 7 managers since ferguson left and bar Maureen and the season you finished with 80 odd points not one has come close to challenging.
 
C Kent said:
Not at all, but yet again the cheer leader in charge of the narrative absolves the players/manager of any blame, its happened time and time again in the past few years. Neville's constant takes on the issues are full of contradiction, moaning about the Superleague being all about money and yet 30 minutes later he's tweeting about how you should be throwing down 300 million on a couple of players to get you challenging again, hell you only have to look at how him and his buddies run Salford to see he's full of ****.

What do you think the extra 20 odd million a year the glaziers take out would achieve in on the field success? Now the narrative is that the glaziers dont put any of their own money into the club, well der, that's the whole point of ffp, so clubs are self sustaining without having to reply on owners etc pumping clubs full of their own money. Speaking of, hes wanting someone to come along and bank roll a few more billion into the club and ignore ffp rulings? Why is that. Yes the glaziers are ****, but you've had 7 managers since ferguson left and bar Maureen and the season you finished with 80 odd points not one has come close to challenging.
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But throwing money at the on-pitch problems is just one aspect. OK, all of the managerial appointments haven't been great, who is to blame for that? The Glazers and their puppet, Woodward.

Neville is asking for more structure, not simply more money. We don't need more money blindly investing in the team until the structure is in place to support that. That being said, of course the squad needs more quality, and we've also lost a number of players who have yet to be replaced.

The Glazers and the club should not be sat looking at what people like Neville and the fans are saying, they should be employing the brightest minds in football to overhaul the way the club operates. It's not rocket science.
 
Robbo said:
But throwing money at the on-pitch problems is just one aspect. OK, all of the managerial appointments haven't been great, who is to blame for that? The Glazers and their puppet, Woodward.

Neville is asking for more structure, not simply more money. We don't need more money blindly investing in the team until the structure is in place to support that. That being said, of course the squad needs more quality, and we've also lost a number of players who have yet to be replaced.

The Glazers and the club should not be sat looking at what people like Neville and the fans are saying, they should be employing the brightest minds in football to overhaul the way the club operates. It's not rocket science.
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Why wasn't this an issue pre Ferguson/Gill retiring? You had 10 years of success under them and it's only a problem in recent years because other clubs have caught up and surpassed you. If somehow had carried on being top of the tree the vast majority of man u fans wouldn't have a problem with the ownership.

What's the solution in your eyes? Who would you want as owners?
 
C Kent said:
Why wasn't this an issue pre Ferguson/Gill retiring? You had 10 years of success under them and it's only a problem in recent years because other clubs have caught up and surpassed you. If somehow had carried on being top of the tree the vast majority of man u fans wouldn't have a problem with the ownership.

What's the solution in your eyes? Who would you want as owners?
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Gill and Ferguson were extremely capable football operators. The latter is arguably the greatest in history.

It may be a more widespread issue recently, but people were protesting against the Glazers before they even took over.

In an ideal world, Jim Ratcliffe would be a logical owner, I have no idea whether that's a realistic prospect though.

If the Glazers won't sell, and I don't think they will, they just need to start appointing smart football operators, rather than ex-bankers. Rangnick clearly knows a lot about building clubs from the football side of things, but the second he gave them his opinion (the club needs open heart surgery), everyone turned on him.
 
C Kent said:
What do you think the extra 20 odd million a year the glaziers take out would achieve in on the field success?
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The 20m is just what they have taken as dividends. That 20m is nothing to the interest paid on the debt. I read something last year that their ownership has cost them 1.1b since they took over.
 
C Kent said:
So either a van Der beek or a Martinez per season, dont think that would have helped you a great deal. Coincidentally how much has the commercial side of the business grown over those 20 years?
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About in line with other clubs, although recently other clubs have started to grow faster. You don't think 80m a season extra could have an impact?
 
Shamikebab said:
About in line with other clubs, although recently other clubs have started to grow faster. You don't think 80m a season extra could have an impact?
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I think it was far far greater than other teams during the 1st decade of their ownership - when you were successful and it's only slowed down recently. Again, ever since Ferguson and Gill retired.

Given your transfer record over the past 10 years? No
 
Shamikebab said:
I think it's 1.5bn actually
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Was reported on sky as close to 2bn the other day.

Avg = 100m a season

While debt has increased and cash reserves have fallen around 500m to 30m in the last 5 years according to the latest accounts.

GNev was ranting about it yesterday, that £2bn that’s been taken out could have (should have) been used to upgrade the stadia and training ground. Also pointed out that if he, J.R, Karney and kelly Cates owned the club, they could have spent even more money than the glazers as they haven’t put a single penny into the club only taken out massive amounts.
 
C Kent said:
Given your transfer record over the past 10 years? No
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As people have pointed out it isn't just transfers. Investment in the stadium, facilities and staff has been completely substandard. Even now reports are coming out that ETH can't authorise transfers because if FdJ decides to move then we won't be able to afford him. Money is absolutely a big factor. Glazers have cut the purse strings (which isn't even their money) and aren't backing ETH for a rebuild.
 
Are you really trying to downplay 1.5bn? Crikey.

They could have spent £80m a season on hiring the best football people, improving the stadium and facilities, etc. All of that has been abandoned.
 
Shamikebab said:
As people have pointed out it isn't just transfers. Investment in the stadium, facilities and staff has been completely substandard. Even now reports are coming out that ETH can't authorise transfers because if FdJ decides to move then we won't be able to afford him. Money is absolutely a big factor. Glazers have cut the purse strings (which isn't even their money) and aren't backing ETH for a rebuild.
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You've just splashed out 60 million plus on a 4ft CB, I'd be wary of giving him more money too :D
 
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