Supplements the debate/discussion thread

Nope.

Look at the ingredients, the amount present, their bio-availability, and effective doses.

Yes, they can still be better than nothing, but ones diet would have to be absolutely shocking. Here, energy is probably better spent fixing the broader problem because it certainly isn't solved by some cheap multivit.
 
Errghghghghg!!!!

I am on a huge supplement come down after yesterday. Bought some creatine and was able to select my own free gift. I chose DORIAN YATES NOXPUMP.
I have used Nitric Oxide pre work out supplements before, once to good affect and once to none at all (Hemavol), but this was a whole different kettle of fish.

I can only explain the first 15 minutes driving to the gym as dangerous, with little to no concentration to the road itself, followed by a queesy stomach which soon passed.
I only did a mild workout as my gym buddy was unable to make it, last minute, but still I was lifting more than usual and even though it was a shorter work out, I could feel my tshirt tight around the muscles, so the Nos part was working.

What followed was something I can only attribute to experiments in my youth with uncontrolled illegal substances. I was wired, scatty, over sensitive, clenching my jaw, and unable to sleep.

I don't know what is in this stuff, or whether you would consider it good or bad, but it for me was strong, and not something I could take before a workout 3 times a week.
Admittedly I don't take any stimulants at all, I don't drink any tea or coffee, and I can feel the affects of even a few cups of that. However I am 14stone and 6ft3 so it's not like there isn't a fair amount of me, that said this wasn't a placebo affect.
I had to push my gf away from me in the evening as I couldn't stand being touched without freaking out a little.

I did drink it on an empty stomach which might not have helped, but today I feel overly dehydrated, similar to a very mild hangover.

Anyone else tried it?
 
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icecold said:
Multivits are generally a waste of time. Cheap ones even more so.
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they are a waste of time because the types of people that buy them are the types that will worry about their health and be eating a good diet anyway.

same goes for the probiotic yoghurts there is no scientific evidence showing they do anything for people who have a good diet already as they should already have the good bacteria
 
Can anyone recommend me a good mass gainer? I'm a hard-gainer and after Ramadan will be going back to the GYM. Currently at 57kg so not heavy at all (lost weight due to fasting), it's quite hard to eat so much in the 4 hour window we get.

Used to have USN hyperbolic mass and that was great, gave good gains just thought I'd ask for any other recommendations to up my calorie intake a little?
 
Freefaller said:
Buy loats of oats, and blend them and add them to your shake, or just eat shed loads more. :) Eat calorific foods like avocados, and good fats like salmon, nuts etc... :)
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I've read a lot upon adding oats to shakes. Is there a certain g which is good in providing the calories and not making the shake lumpy? Am I just better off getting a whey shake and adding the oats to that?

Avocados/salmon, nuts are the usual. It's just because of Ramadan my eating has gone down a lot. Can't really eat a lot in 4 hours and then sleep and the early shifts at work.
 
100g for one person might be ample, where as someone else may need 300g.

It's completely individual and without knowing your calorie intake now its just a stab in the dark by saying eat more.

Hard gainers don't exist :p
 
Maxeh said:
100g for one person might be ample, where as someone else may need 300g.

It's completely individual and without knowing your calorie intake now its just a stab in the dark by saying eat more.

Hard gainers don't exist :p
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Calorie intake right now for me must be around 2k, normally I'm 2.8/3k which I still don't think is enough for me.

The reason I mentioned hard-gainers is I can eat and eat yet it'll take a while for me to see results. I'll definitely try the oats and pick a decent branded whey mix.

I'm quite lean to begin with not much body fat at all. Yet when I was taking the USN I noticed my waist size went up :o.
 
Usually when people say "around this many calories" its way out.

Log your food for a couple of weeks, see what your intake is and how your BW is being affected.

Mass gainers are a waste of money, make your own shakes if you want to, 1,000+ calorie shakes can be made very easily and gives no one an excuse of being a hard gainer ;)

3,000 really shouldn't be difficult to hit or be expensive with some careful shopping/planning.

Let us know how it goes :)
 
To gain weight, eat more. It really is that simple.

If you live with your parents get your mum to cook some good food for you and eat whenever you can. Eat till you are full.

I know that oats are huge favourite on this forum, but sorry guys, it doesnt work well for hard-gainers who have small stomachs and active lifestyles.
Oats are something I eat when shedding body fat, NOT when gaining.
Oats when mixed with fluid, will expand in your gut and give you a "full" feeling. You will often see this fact used to market porridge (feel fuller for longer). The marketing men push porridge as a way to reduce weight (NOT gain weight).

Here's a typical article about oats.

When you are gaining weight, oats are about the last thing I'd eat, especially if you are hard gainer. Soup is another food which has proven to be great when shedding body-fat, ie. it fills your gut without adding too many calories - soup is great when shedding bodyfat, but useless for gaining weight.

I'd focus on eating food rich in fat.

My fave weight/strength building food is toast, then butter, then tuna in mayo. Each slice of this has about 250 calories on it. Have 2 of those every day and you've got an additional 500 calories/day to your normal diet.

Try eating foods you enjoy and like the taste of. If you like the taste you will eat more of it. If you hate the taste, then you will eat less (and not gain weight). Use protein shakes to supplement your normal diet and you will definitely add weight.
 
the reason people suggest oats is because they're cheap and an easy way of bulking which is easier than 100ml of olive oil which is about 900 cals.

We've already suggested good fats.

There is also no such thing as a hard gainer.

You just need to eat the right foods, and eat enough of them.

3k cals is easily achievable healthily with good macros etc... Heck 3 meals a day with snacks is easy to hit 3k cals. Most people do not suffer from metabolic syndrome.

Weight gainers/mass gainers are a waste of time, loaded with sugars and poor nutritional profile.

MCTs, fats and complex carbs are going to the best way of getting the calories, notwithstanding proteins are also still important.

I know you're on Ramadan, but if you want to keep your calories high you'll have to eat the right foods which you can eat over a short period of time, and also perhaps get up early before you have to start fasting to get another meal in.
 
Had horrible side effects with 'stimulants' and 'preworkouts' when I used Jack3D a few years ago. Jitters, Palpitations and narrowing of vision (blood pressure? unsure). Never using them ever again.

Purely just Water, fruit and normal food for energy. Trying to increase my healthy protein amount (chicken, nuts etc) but it's a struggle. All my Whey has now expired, so debating whether or not to get more. Always found it didn't really agree with my digestion very well and always felt chunky/bloated after a few shakes (like a few days/week later).
 
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RedvGreen said:
Had horrible side effects with 'stimulants' and 'preworkouts' when I used Jack3D a few years ago. Jitters, Palpitations and narrowing of vision (blood pressure? unsure). Never using them ever again.

Purely just Water, fruit and normal food for energy. Trying to increase my healthy protein amount (chicken, nuts etc) but it's a struggle. All my Whey has now expired, so debating whether or not to get more. Always found it didn't really agree with my digestion very well and always felt chunky/bloated after a few shakes (like a few days/week later).
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A lot of bru-haha goes into the amount of brotein to consume, but depending on your stats, somewhere between 1.2-1.4g/kgbw per day is probably fine... so don't go crazy about it.

I get the same from whey, too (and weirdly the isolate... :confused:) and so don't use it anymore... if I do need brotein, I use soy as it's a bucketload cheaper, too.

Practically speaking, so many people underestimate the impact a good diet and sleeping regime can have on a workout: eating like a horse and sleeping for at least 8hrs a night led to the best workouts I'd ever had. :)
 
arknor said:
they are a waste of time because the types of people that buy them are the types that will worry about their health and be eating a good diet anyway.
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Perhaps, but that's not really what I'm talking about. Actually, I know of quite a few people who take multivits because they know their diet is poor. Either way, the more important issue is that many contain ingredients that absorb poorly and show little to no benefit when taken.

reiyushin said:
I take a multivit - ON optimen - I don't know or care if it's a placebo but I feel better when I take them :)
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Doesn't seem terrible, but it's expensive! Decent amounts of B vits, which could be why you feel better.
 
Maxeh said:
Guilty of taking a multi vit "just because", even though my diet is good it's an attempt to cover all the bases.

This is the one I take, thoughts?

http://www.geneticsupplements.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=60_79&product_id=73
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Yes it's as useless as any other multi-vit out there.

100% RDA of Zinc - ingredients = zinc oxide of which your body will utilise approx 0.1% of, if that
33% of RDA Magnesium - ingredients = magnesium oxide of which your body with utilise 0.1% of, if that

You get the picture... But you're just just covering the bases, like everyone else. Feel free to **** your money away ;)
 
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