Supplements the debate/discussion thread

I've gone back to doing a cycle of Rhodiola rosea which is a fantastic herb IMO. Love herbs and natural medicines. I take RR for short times from time to time and really does help, but only in short bursts (4-6 weeks at a time). I'd recommend it to anyone that feels a little low, exhausted, generally need a bit of a boost.
 
odevans said:
I think I got my words mixed up there, the texture is normal, just the taste that reminds me mucus. Chocolate smooth is lush! Have you tried the chocolate mint? Damn that's nice!

Having your shake with full milk greatly increases protein synthesis. Micellar casein (milk protein) has also been proven to be the best protein when it comes to preventing muscle wastage. There are other benefits too, in a bit of a rush at the moment though, as I'm trying to get as many carbs down my throat - got to squat 200kg for 3 today. Wish me luck!
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Adding leucine will help boost protein synthesis - personally I don't feel milk is necessarily sensible unless you're after calories. If you have to use supps and whey, I'd add leucine to it rather than using milk (unless, as I stated, you're after cheap/quick calories).
 
Leucine doesn't taste great, but put in in fruitjuice it's fine - it's one of the few EAAs supplements that actually has had significant scientific research behind it, and after all it's a normal element found in our diets - it's critical to protein synthesis, basic science really!

If you're getting decent protein with that extra leu boost (adding HMB and/or OAKG to really boost things!) does have tangible effects - however, more so on guys at their peak of training with a good regime already in place.

However, as ever, it's expensive (well cheap for a supp but adding everything together), and only really will affect such a tiny %age of your performance that you won't see an over night effect like most supps. People forget these things aren't like gear, they have a tiny effect on you, but with good diet, training and lifestyle they have an effect, but on a small level that is hard to quantify.
 
I think I eat about 180g (max) of protein a day and holding steady, if anything also developing strength and endurance still. SPW saw me last Sunday and I think he'd agree that whilst still looking like I carry a decent amount of muscle mass, I'm also looking leaner but just as strong as I was. :) Then again I'm only eating around 2.8-3k cals a day at the moment and it's doing me fine. :) Dropped down to below 15st for my summer holiday, and now 4 months later I'm back up to 15,8 with low body fat - I'm at my lowest I've ever been at just around 15%. Striations in the shoulders are clear to see, vascularity is hugely increased especially around the shoulders.

I've gone more and more off the idea of hyperloading with stupid amounts of protein - if you're not increasing your protein synthesis then it's pointless increasing the amount of protein to unnecessary levels.
 
The way I see it, is our bodies can only synthesise so much protein in one go - furthermore it depends on our hormone activity and physical activity, and muscle mass (for protein synthesis). There's just no need to go mad with protein. The RDA of 50g is well under for people in this game of course - certainly more so when it comes to higher lean body mass values... but unless you're a 300lb mass monster there's just little point in consuming that much protein. Your body WILL NOT synthesise all of it, end of. You're wasting your time and getting calories in that will just turn into glycogen/glucose but in a very expensive way. So effectively you're buying very expensive carbs.
 
Also you can't compare ourselves too much to wild animals like lions, as they have evolved to eat meat/flesh and as such they're bodies are more adept to dealing with such diets. Ours typically used to be fats and protein, with some carbs though from rice and bread. Howevever carbs are ok, it's just the refined carbs that are appalling for you - keep away from refined carbs and you'll be fine - you need some carbs IMO as they are the energy source for your body. Fats, carbs and protein are all absolutely required, protein bias is good and necessary compared to regular non training people - but it's not the be-all end-all of what your diet should contain.
 
SkScotchegg said:
B1C3P you say you eat 350-400g, how tall are you and how much do you weigh, and what is your bodyfat percentage? I'm just curious.

This question goes out to whoever has an answer for me = how would I know if something is wrong with my kidneys? I feel healthy, would I be in pain or something?

EDIT: Freefaller how big are you aswell, height, weight, bodyfat, and how big is your chest and arms?
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Posted lots of pics in the past - they should give you an idea of what I'm like. I'm just shy of 6'1", weigh around 100kg +/- 2kg - it really does depend. Fairly low bodyfat, I was measured recently at 15% which I'm more than happy with - not bothered about being super lean. Not sure of chest size, but I wear 48" jackets as 46 is a little tight. Erm arms are over 18" I think, legs are over 27", waist is just under 36".
 
Oh I agree entirely with you with over doing the protein :) I'm not an advocate for 10kgs of protein shakes and reliance on them etc... I agree that excessive protein depending on your physique is absolutely not good long term, 100% in agreement and something I've stated many times in the past. :)

Fats and carbs are often over looked also - you NEED both. Carbs aren't as evil as people make out - they just need to be the right ones.
 
Indeed. Also, protein WILL turn into a glycogen so it's effectively an expensive way of performing gluconeogenesis as the protein cells have to be converted twice effectively which can be taxing on the body.

When you have excess proteins they will be broken down in to aCoA, pyruvate an/oxaloacetate. The latter 2 can undergo conversion to glucose - which happens, then will just be stored, and when the glycogen levels are maxed out you will start storing fat too.

A very expensive way of getting energy if you ask me!
 
Basically yes, I was probably going into too much details. You're right pryuvate is turned into acoa before the krebs cycle, but also within the krebs cycle (I was just splitting the main elements that it turned into, not necessarily the sequence, my bad!) - I was just giving a simplistic overview of proteins turning to energy. :) I wasn't going to go through all the ATP cycle and fatty acid synthesis to palmitate etc... as it all gets quite complicated! :D (for me anyway :p)

In essence too much protein = very convoluted way of getting energy which will be more likely to be stored as fat if it isn't used!
 
sedm1000 said:
Suspect that the issue is going to be more about absorption - there's only so much that can be taken up by the gut - the rest is going to feed your flora, rather than you.
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Yes but what isn't absorbed won't just flush straight through you, it will count as calories, and depending on your genetic make up may even manifest itself as visceral fat.
 
I don't think it's THAT unknown, but you do raise an interesting point. However, the basic facts are that excessive calories whether they be fat/protein/carb based will at some stage store themselves as fatty tissues as that's how our bodies work. In which manner and by what mechanism it does is a good point as you say if the uptake paths are saturated does it pose the question of how long your body stores the elements. That I think is fair to say will be different for different people, hence why some people react differently to different foods/elements and store fats in different ways and different places. It's hormonally controlled as well - it's vastly complex (as I'm sure you know, probably better than me) but fascinating how our bodies adapt don't you think?
 
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