Thailand develops HIV vaccine

[Orcish-Horde]

Sigh...think outside the box for a second

Next time you get in an accident, no fault of your own, in a foreign country and need a blood transfusion...think back to what i said.

If you are thinking you will never visit a 3rd world country, hospital in THIS make blunders, a LOT of them and only a FRACTION get on the news. Think about that.

But that would not be a result of your own actions, were as with sexual intercourse it would be as a result of your own actions. Outside the box... the quicker people with HIV die the less chance they have of spread it.

 

[Mr Jack]

Completely useless stat basically, most likely the average amount of people getting the infection is say, 7% of the population, so they just assumed 7% of that 16k people tested would get it, when only 4% ended up with HIV 3 years later, boom, its a miracle.

More than likely simply being picked for the trial led to them to learn more about HIV in the first place, how to prevent it and stopped more people getting it.

Wow! You really took those few seconds to read the article didn't you?

Half of the volunteers were given the vaccine, while the other half were given a placebo - and all were given counselling on HIV/Aids prevention.

Look Ma! Placebo controlled trial!

 

["andy"]

theres people who have been purposefully or even acidentally given HIV by skanky criminals.

raped , stabbed with a needle , bitten. it does happen

do they deserve it too ?


famously there was those doctors/nurses in libya who knew they had the virus and infected upto 500 people. do those 500 people deserve to die from HIV ?

 

[Van Hellseek]

But that would not be a result of your own actions, were as with sexual intercourse it would be as a result of your own actions.

Double you tee eff.

 

[Moley]

I am the source. I've been there and talked to them about it (not all of them obviously, but enough to form a general opinion).

OK thats fine, now can we have some corroboration please? I pretty sure you wouldn't want us to just take the word of just one person now would you?

 

[I get around]

Good, finally some progress is being made.
Anyone who says people who contract aids deserve to die, need to grow up, selfish pigs. "it's their lifestyle choice" yeah so thousands and thousands of people deserve to die because you don't agree with their lifestyle?

 

[Raymond Lin]

But that would not be a result of your own actions, were as with sexual intercourse it would be as a result of your own actions. Outside the box... the quicker people with HIV die the less chance they have of spread it.

Its not about who's action. The point is that a sick person is a sick person, all should be treated the same. When you start alienating a class, it is start of, to put it bluntly, almost Nazi like regime.

 

[meghatronic]

Its not about who's action. The point is that a sick person is a sick person, all should be treated the same. When you start alienating a class, it is start of, to put it bluntly, almost Nazi like regime.

What about immigrants, legal or otherwise, that have not paid a cent into the NHS? Contributed nothing to society etc. Why should they get HIV treatment when NHS trusts won't pay for breast cancer drugs for people that have worked here all their life and contribtued etc. My point was, it is never, ever clean cut .

Good, finally some progress is being made.
Anyone who says people who contract aids deserve to die, need to grow up, selfish pigs. "it's their lifestyle choice" yeah so thousands and thousands of people deserve to die because you don't agree with their lifestyle?

That only extends so far. If you KNOW you're children will have HIV, yet have children anyway.... that isn't a lifestyle choice, that's sick. If you KNOW you'll infect someone, yet have sex with them, that isn't a lifestyle choice, that is positively evil. If you KNOW you'll contract HIV from sharing needles with someone infected, that isn't a lifestyle choice, it is retarded. There is risk, then there is stupidity.

 

[Van Hellseek]

OK thats fine, now can we have some corroboration please? I pretty sure you wouldn't want us to just take the word of just one person now would you?

Why are you asking for a source anyway? Do you really find it difficult to believe that many Thai women (many of whom have little, if any, official form of education) do not understand the risks?

(or rather, do not understand the scale of the problem and associated dangers).

 

[Amp34]

http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/2009/fatal-infection/

1. That is quite funny...
2. That doesn't include the numbers dying, for example bird flu is second only to aids in "danger"...
3. It doesn't include non disease related (well mostly non related) things such as Cancer and Heart Disease, both of which will have a near 100% fatality rate without treatment. No you can't be vaccinated as such but $1trillion may hugely benefit people with these bigger killers as well. Oh and that's forgetting malaria, which is still one of the biggest killers on the planet, and an illness that can be blamed on anyone as it is completely natural.

Umm... why not?

"oh I better get vaccinated against Tetanus in case I get stabbed"
"oh I better get vaccinated against measles in case I catch it"
...

No, it's more like "oh I better get vaccinated against Tetanus in case I get scratched by a rusty nail or thorn", the number of people catching tetnus from stabbing is probably tiny. In case of "catching it", well that isn't related either.

Aside from the point that this "vaccine" may not even really do anything, and that $1trillion may not effect a cure for anything I am in two minds. One side of me says we need to help these people, but the other part says this world is already overpopulated, mostly due to our medicine and science, which when used in continents like Africa cause huge population explosions, which causes massive issues for the environment and other living things on this planet. AIDS/Malaria/starvation can be seen as pretty natural processes for keeping populations down, whilst also creating natural selection, whereas medicine is doing the opposite, it's keeping people alive, even the unfit, and causing/will cause the human species to stagnate.

The other problem with spending Trillions on vaccines and treatments is that they essentially don't "do" anything. Yes less people are dying at 40, and living until 70, but then they die of Cancer, Heart disease and other more age related diseases or body/mind wasting illnesses (such as Altsheimers), which were very rarely a problem even 70 years ago, but are now becoming the main killers.

Aside from all that it's interesting to see another possible "cure" for HIV, however at the moment it's just another of those news articles that come out multiple times a year that state someone has found a possible cure for cancer, HIV etc, which you then never hear of again after further trials...

 

[Raymond Lin]

What about immigrants, legal or otherwise, that have not paid a cent into the NHS? Contributed nothing to society etc. Why should they get HIV treatment when NHS trusts won't pay for breast cancer drugs for people that have worked here all their life and contribtued etc. My point was, it is never, ever clean cut .

ALL treated as equal, there are no discrimination, and it is the way it SHOULD be.

Even in the states, where they don't have the NHS. If you put someone with a gun shot wound in front of a doctor, with heath insurance or not, whether he is police officer or a bank robber. It's save the life first, consequences later (money or Law).

 

[meghatronic]

ALL treated as equal, there are no discrimination, and it is the way it SHOULD be.

Even in the states, where they don't have the NHS. If you put someone with a gun shot wound in front of a doctor, with heath insurance or not, whether he is police officer or a bank robber. It's save the life first, consequences later (money or Law).

It is not the way it should be, to be honest. Unless I'm in a liberal mood. I'm not paying my NI to a charity.

And, you have to be ******* me about the US thing. I've had a friend (NY) turned away from A&E because she didn't have health insurance, she had a broken collar bone ffs!

 

[Raymond Lin]

It is not the way it should be, to be honest. Unless I'm in a liberal mood. I'm not paying my NI to a charity.

And, you have to be ******* me about the US thing. I've had a friend (NY) turned away from A&E because she didn't have health insurance, she had a broken collar bone ffs!

Guess I will have to agree to disagree.

Clearly there is nothing more i could say to change the mind of some people on here and I am starting to repeat myself and wasting time.

 

[meghatronic]

Guess I will have to agree to disagree.

Clearly there is nothing more i could say to change the mind of some people on here and I am starting to repeat myself and wasting time.

You're not wasting your time, I understand your viewpoint, and value it. But I don't agree with it. I also admire your niceness, for want of a better word.

But when you've had a friend's mother die because they couldn't afford to privately buy cancer medication (not cost effective for this NHS trsut), yet immigrants get ******* everything handed to them - even £100,000 a year plus TB medication, it leaves a bitter after taste in your mouth.

All people are not equal - in right wing shocker. A life is a life, yes. But I'd rather save the life of my friends mother than Cedric from Zimbabwe who arrived here 2 weeks ago.

 

[Killerkebab]

What about immigrants, legal or otherwise, that have not paid a cent into the NHS? Contributed nothing to society etc. Why should they get HIV treatment when NHS trusts won't pay for breast cancer drugs for people that have worked here all their life and contribtued etc. My point was, it is never, ever clean cut

This amuses me. After so many people in this country love the NHS and like to point at a country like the USA which has so much money and is unable to offer free healthcare to the population like you all are... and then we turn around and start considering dropping it for certain subsets of the population.

 

[meghatronic]

This amuses me. After so many people in this country love the NHS and like to point at a country like the USA which has so much money and is unable to offer free healthcare to the population like you all are... and then we turn around and start considering dropping it for certain subsets of the population.

Effectively ALL the NI you've ever paid in your entire life will pay for drug treatment for one drug-resistant TB patient. TB is no longer a native problem. Any TB cases here are a consequence of immigration. Why should your hard earnerd (maybe ) money pay for this person's treatment?

(to be fair, I'm baiting a bit - I'm not this dead inside)

 

[Killerkebab]

More to the point, why shouldn't the money go towards this person? They live here just like I do - who are we going to refuse treatment to next? Someone whose parents immigrated here?

 

[meghatronic]

More to the point, why shouldn't the money go towards this person? They live here just like I do - who are we going to refuse treatment to next? Someone whose parents immigrated here?

As there is only so much money to go around, was my point. Cf. my example above.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love a united world (a la Star Trek), but it just won't happen. We have to start looking more after our own house. It's like paying aid to countries when our own country was verging on bankruptcy. It borders on idiocy, masquerading as good will.

 

[Killerkebab]

We are looking after our own house. The immigrant has chosen our country and has been allowed to become a part of her. Why should we turn around and decline free treatment to them, something that we give to all our other citizens?

 

[meghatronic]

We are looking after our own house. The immigrant has chosen our country and has been allowed to become a part of her. Why should we turn around and decline free treatment to them, something that we give to all our other citizens?

Sorry, I should've clarified.

I was referring to illegals or those that came here with pre-existing (and expensive to treat) diseases and conditions.

Those immigrants that come here to genuinely work are fine, providing 1) They work honestly in a job a native can't fill, pay tax and integrate. 2) They do not abuse our systems and laws, 3) They do not send their earnings home (devaluing our economy), 4) They do not bring their entire extended family here (who may not work as they do) and finally 5) They respect our country, our ways and are ****** grateful.

Difficult to tick all those boxes to be honest. Natives don't even. Hence my misanthropy. Although AUS and NZ seems to agree with me for the most part.