*** The AMD RDNA 4 Rumour Mill ***

[Mercurial]

I think it's more significant than that.

<Snipped lots of very good and relevant points of evidence>

If I'm right, this could be a weird generation AMD leading Nvidia in benchmarks by a huge margin, but their cards being priced slightly higher than the Nvidia (naming) equivalent.

I think you have nailed what's happened since CES in this post, the performance information and pictures of the AIB designs all point to a targeting of a higher price tier, it would also explain the delay waiting for Nvidias full release. Pricing will be really interesting.

Although Nvidia seem to have their own issues...

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

The branding slide points to them aiming the 9070 a half tier up from the 7900 GRE and the 9070 XT slightly higher than the 7900 XT. It seems reasonable to assume this has at least some correlation to intended pricing, i.e. $599-$649 and $799-$849.

Leaked benchmarks don't point to the performance you would expect at these prices. But there was the story about pre-release drivers being nerfed. If that's the case, and final performance is 20% better, then the MLID benchmarks would put the 9070 at 30% faster than the 7900 GRE and 9070 XT at 30% faster than the 7900 XT. That's performance that would justify the above prices, especially with the RT improvements and FSR4. It would also explain the cooler designs on the announced cards.

Those prices look "justified" compared to Nvidia shrinkflation but are not at all justified compared to what AMD already had before with RDNA3/RDNA2/RDNA1.

If we look at TPU reviews,the 7900GRE is only 10% faster than an RX7800XT. That is a very poor starting point.

The RX6700XT was 33% faster than the RX5700XT and the RX7800XT almost 50% over the RX6700XT. The RX5700XT was over 60% faster than an RX580.

An RX7900XT is only 30% faster than an RX7800XT.

$599 for an RX9070 would mean almost £600 which means AMD is NOT going after mainstream gamers.

The RX7800XT started at £480. That means,whatever replaces the RX7800XT will be well under 30% faster and one of the worst generational updates since the RX580.

Also a 60 series AMD card will be well over £400!

Either that means a cut-down 192 bit dGPU with 12GB of VRAM,or something based on Navi 44 with a 128 bit memory bus will replace the RX7800XT.

These companies seem to be in a cartel now and price-fixing relative to each other.

 

[Game]

The RX6700XT was 33% faster than the RX5700XT and the RX7800XT almost 50% over the RX6700XT. The RX5700XT was over 60% faster than an RX580.

shouldn't you have the 7700xt in that to replace the 7800xt it being like for like

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

shouldn't you have the 7700xt in that to replace the 7800xt it being like for like

The RX7800XT was really the RX7700XT. Die sizes are very similar.

The RX7900XTX was an RX7800XT and the RX7900XT was the RX7800. The RTX4070 was a worse shrinkflation. It used the die of a 60 series card but was priced two levels up.

AMD pushed the tiers up one level. Nvidia two.

Plus even if you ignore the naming - the RX7800XT was £480 at launch and is now below £450.

Having an RX9070 which is around 30% faster at £600,would mean the RX7800XT replacement would be gimped a lot.Either a 12GB card at the price of an RX7800XT or a 128 bit Navi 44 with doubled VRAM.

The RX9060XT would be £450+ and the RX9060 over £300 which means AMD,like Nvidia will have pushed their entry level cards well over £300! Where are the sub £300 cards then?

Gamers need to stop entertaining all this relative pricing - it's starting to wreck the market for a lot of us mainstream gamers.

Just look what has happened to Samsung and Apple smartphone pricing? It's gone insane. A basic S25 is over £800 on offer,and it's pushed up A series pricing to where the S series used to be.

 

[humbug]

The RX7800XT was really the RX7700XT. Die sizes are very similar.

The RX7900XTX was an RX7800XT and the RX7900XT was the RX7800. The RTX4070 was a worse shrinkflation. It used the die of a 60 series card but was priced two levels up.

AMD pushed the tiers up one level. Nvidia two.

Plus even if you ignore the naming - the RX7800XT was £480 at launch and is now below £450.

Having an RX9070 which is around 30% faster at £600,would mean the RX7800XT replacement would be gimped a lot.Either a 12GB card at the price of an RX7800XT or a 128 bit Navi 44 with doubled VRAM.

The RX9060XT would be £450+ and the RX9060 over £300 which means AMD,like Nvidia will have pushed their entry level cards well over £300! Where are the sub £300 cards then?

Gamers need to stop entertaining all this relative pricing - it's starting to wreck the market for a lot of us mainstream gamers.

Just look what has happened to Samsung and Apple smartphone pricing? It's gone insane. A basic S25 is over £800 on offer,and it's pushed up A series pricing to where the S series used to be.

At least the 7800 XT was priced like a 6700 XT.

 

[melmac]

No no you don't understand, the amount of nonsense a manufacturer can get away with is directly corrolated to how much marketshare they have. /s

In the interim period between now and GPU releases, I need a new pair of running shoes as I'm marathon training. I'd better go and look up which of Asics, Adidas or Nike have the most marketshare so I know which ones to buy.

But that's exactly what people do. Nike have the most market share. And it's not even close to second place, Adidas are the second biggest shoe company and they are far, far behind Nike. People buy their shoes, even though they might not be the best shoes at any particular sport.

People get used to buying a certain brand and people don't like change. Shoes are perfect example, there is a lot more competition in that Market, yet Nike continue to dominate because of that Mind share. Now that is slowly changing because other brands have upped their game and started making some amazing shoes, far better than Nike's for cheaper. But that's what they have to do, they can't get away with making inferior products because people will just go back to Nike.

It's the same with AMD and Nvidia. People can't cry about but, but Nvidia's making mistakes, Nvidia have worse products etc. etc. To get back in the GPU game, AMD will have to be better in every way than Nvidia. There is no point in continue to do what they are doing.

And that's why people are disappointed with the all the crap that's gone on this month. It's not just that AMD are releasing in March. It's the whole series of events leading to AMD releasing in March.

It's for the neutrals like myself, Cat the Fifth, TNA etc, that this whole thing has been a let down. All the neutrals were hoping that AMD would get this right. There was genuine optimism that the cards coming were going to be decent. But, AMD managed to steal away all that. They had cards out with reviewers, they have products out in store. They were obviously coming in January, yet Nvidia's CES event made them change their own event and move the launch of their cards back to March. I mean, that does not inspire confidence.

And people are making excuses, oh it's just see what Nvidia has, oh it's to build up stock, oh it's just to make sure of the pricing. Nonsense, It shows that AMD don't have any confidence in their own product. It shows that they messed up again.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

At least the 7800 XT was priced like a 6700 XT.

Slightly higher,but at least it was a decent uplift over the previous generation.But honestly with JHH thinking gamers have $10000 PCs,I think AMD must be thinking the same then. They are totally out of touch of what most gamers actually buy - just look on Steam. Most cards are under £500.

All these companies are doing is finding ways to shrinkflate and push pricing up. Then find new ways to lock new features out of older generations. It's leading to stagnation in mainstream systems. These same systems are now barely better than price comparable consoles! A PS5 PRO is overpriced at £700,but most £600 to £700 pre-built systems use an RTX4060 or RX7600 at around that price. Go back a few years ago,such a system would outclass a console in most ways.

 

[melmac]

Nvidia first 5000 release is January 30th, March is 4 weeks and 2 days away from that date. Dont know what people are crying about.

I'm sure they will tell everyone the reason why they have a March release but lets be honest, AMD never gave any release date, was all just rumours from Videocardz etc



Maybe they are making sure they have a lot of stock ready this time?

It's simple really. Nvidia's upcoming line up is sort of 'meh' and it's expensive. Their announcement at CES was also very 'meh'

Yet, despite this, their announcement forced AMD to change all their plans. AMD was due to launch in January.

Doesn't matter the reason why they pushed back, pricing/performance, it just looks terrible.

 

[humbug]

Slightly higher,but at least it was a decent uplift over the previous generation.But honestly with JHH thinking gamers have $10000 PCs,I think AMD must be thinking the same then. They are totally out of touch of what most gamers actually buy - just look on Steam. Most cards are under £500.

All these companies are doing is finding ways to shrinkflate and push pricing up. Then find new ways to lock new features out of older generations. It's leading to stagnation in mainstream systems. These same systems are now barely better than price comparable consoles! A PS5 PRO is overpriced at £700,but most £600 to £700 pre-built systems use an RTX4060 or RX7600 at around that price. Go back a few years ago,such a system would outclass a console in most ways.

I do think AMD / Nvidia's costs have also gone up but i agree with you, everyone is trying to push prices up, get us used paying more for everything, this includes AMD.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

I do think AMD / Nvidia's costs have also gone up but i agree with you, everyone is trying to push prices up, get us used paying more for everything, this includes AMD.

Problem is at least with Nvidia they keep implying that,but their margins also go up massively. The whole Pandemic had companies and whole industries making up excuses to overcharge. Now they want to keep doing this at a higher rate and you can see "inflation" everywhere. At some point,people won't be able to pay any more(especially if interest rates start rising again),so makes me wonder what happens in a few years time.

 

[melmac]

Yet in NVIDIA land it would seem gibbo is having to do special voucher codes because stock is so tight. So reading between the lines, basically little to no NVIDIA stock. That's a great launch. Maybes some people should turn their frustrations to that? Tiny stock with high prices. Hmm. But yet again we get the same few people piling in, simply cause we have to wait 5 more weeks for AMD. And probably won't be buying an AMD card anyway. These people never change.

This is whataboutism at it's finest. It's the same "But but but Nvidia" by every AMD fan. But lets run with it. It does look like Nvidia's going to be short of stock, so yet another launch they have messed up. They messed up the 4xxx launch too, with the high prices and power cable issues. And yet it's another messed up launch by Nvidia that AMD aren't going to capitalise on.

They messed up their own 7000 launch by having low stock, terrible pricing and driver problems.

January would have been a fantastic time for AMD to launch their new cards, especially now with Nvidia having low stock. That's why this delay is even worse. And just for the last time. It's not solely about waiting a 5 weeks. It's the reasons why we have to wait 5 weeks. It's the whole changing of AMD's plans and the unprofessional way they have gone about. How can anyone have confidence in AMD when don't have any in their own product.

 

[Gerard]

Mba card looks interesting, like. Looks like a sort of mesh top to it, unless that's just an issue with the render.

 

[Firegod]

This is whataboutism at it's finest. It's the same "But but but Nvidia" by every AMD fan. But lets run with it. It does look like Nvidia's going to be short of stock, so yet another launch they have messed up. They messed up the 4xxx launch too, with the high prices and power cable issues. And yet it's another messed up launch by Nvidia that AMD aren't going to capitalise on.

They messed up their own 7000 launch by having low stock, terrible pricing and driver problems.

January would have been a fantastic time for AMD to launch their new cards, especially now with Nvidia having low stock. That's why this delay is even worse. And just for the last time. It's not solely about waiting a 5 weeks. It's the reasons why we have to wait 5 weeks. It's the whole changing of AMD's plans and the unprofessional way they have gone about. How can anyone have confidence in AMD when don't have any in their own product.

So we can't call out Nvidia's mistakes because it is always whataboutism. But if AMD slip up, its a free for all. Is basically what you are saying. It is up to AMD when they launch, just because you think it is wrong not launching in Jan. It is all rumours at the moment. Has someone at AMD told you they don't have confidence in their own product? Where you hearing that from?

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Looks like the RX9070XT was meant to be launched/announced today:

Somebody didn't get the memo: AMD ad claims you can enjoy gaming on Radeon RX 9070 XT already - VideoCardz.com

AMD says you can ‘play now’ with Radeon RX 9070 series So RDNA4 was supposed to launch today after all? RX 9070 XT ad (translated), Source: AMD/Reddit If we needed any proof that the Radeon RX 9070 series was supposed to be announced today, this is probably our best leak yet. An advertisement on...

videocardz.com

But it seems some of their PR people didn't hear of a change in plans,so now we have an ad campaign saying "immediate availability".

 

[uscool]

If they can release, they should to grab the sales from people that cannot wait. We have a good idea of the NV price/performance so waiting 2 months seems pointless and they will miss a lot of sales as people will just buy NV cards on day one.

We don't know if it's 2 months , rumours suggest 5070ti is around 20th February, AMD could release early in March?

 

[Shogun_Krayt]

Looks like the RX9070XT was meant to be launched/announced today:

Somebody didn't get the memo: AMD ad claims you can enjoy gaming on Radeon RX 9070 XT already - VideoCardz.com

AMD says you can ‘play now’ with Radeon RX 9070 series So RDNA4 was supposed to launch today after all? RX 9070 XT ad (translated), Source: AMD/Reddit If we needed any proof that the Radeon RX 9070 series was supposed to be announced today, this is probably our best leak yet. An advertisement on...

videocardz.com

But it seems some of their PR people didn't hear of a change in plans,so now we have an ad campaign saying "immediate availability".

Their people are probably too distracted setting up bots to scalp some RTX 5080s

 

[Firegod]

We don't know if it's 2 months , rumours suggest 5070ti is around 20th February, AMD could release early in March?

It's crazy. People on here say, AMD must release first otherwise no one will buy their card. Say AMD did launch first, what will people do.... I think they'll say Ooh I think I'll wait a bit and see what NVIDIA release and undercut AMD by. Thanks NVIDIA for not releasing first. Smart move. You know it! So now we switch it around. NVIDIA launch first, the narrative changes directly to an AMD meltdown... but whyyyyy AMD you can't surely launch afterwards. That's not allowed. Noooooooooooo!

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

It's crazy. People on here say, AMD must release first otherwise no one will buy their card. Say AMD did launch first, what will people do.... I think they'll say Ooh I think I'll wait a bit and see what NVIDIA release and undercut AMD by. Thanks NVIDIA for not releasing first. Smart move. You know it! So now we switch it around. NVIDIA launch first, the narrative changes directly to an AMD meltdown... but whyyyyy AMD you can't surely launch afterwards. That's not allowed. Noooooooooooo!

The RX480 launched before the GTX1060 and was one of the most popular cards AMD made in the last 10 years. AMD got to 30% sales share against Pascal with only 2 designs!

 

[Firegod]

The RX480 launched before the GTX1060 and was one of the most popular cards AMD made in the last 10 years! AMD got to 30% sales share against Pascal with only 2 designs!

I'm referring to this release.

 

[greatash]

It's crazy. People on here say, AMD must release first otherwise no one will buy their card. Say AMD did launch first, what will people do.... I think they'll say Ooh I think I'll wait a bit and see what NVIDIA release and undercut AMD by. Thanks NVIDIA for not releasing first. Smart move. You know it! So now we switch it around. NVIDIA launch first, the narrative changes directly to an AMD meltdown... but whyyyyy AMD you can't surely launch afterwards. That's not allowed. Noooooooooooo!

I'd have a 9070XT if they launched this month at a reasonable price. Ya snooze ya lose AMD.