Poll: The EU Referendum: How Will You Vote? (May Poll)

[flowrider99]

And on the flip side the election will come down to the migration crisis and a turkish influx of migrants because of visa free movement in the Schlangen area... None of which are relevant at all to the UK.

In reality it's unlikely in both cases, but it's always good to put people who may vote differently to you down isn't it...

On an unrelated, more useful note.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/28/economists-reject-brexit-boost-cameron



And

https://www.theguardian.com/science...ers-2020-target-free-access-scientific-papers



Another big plus for the EU that is unlikely to ever have been decided by a British government.

Before the Greek philosopher, Eratosthenes, proved that the world is spherical virtually everyone believed the world was flat.

 

[LiE]

I do like Daniel Hannan's speech.

https://youtu.be/FC9nDCmqjn8

 

[Skunkworks]

He should be front & centre rather than Boris.

 

[McBain]

As has been mentioned multiple times, and even backed up by leave voters posting actual Cameron quotes. He talked about instability, leave campaigners seem to have taken that as meaning WW3...

He specifically spoke about stability, and peace. Pretty obvious what he was referring to.

 

[bayo000]

I can't believe you've asked that ridiculous question.

You are a special one aren't you? Do you really think that people will stop coming here after the exit? As long as lifestyle is better here then wherever they are from, people will try to come here. I guess if the hit to economy turns out to be quite bad in case of exit then perhaps migrants will stop trying to get here.

 

[Tefal]

If the EU is such a daft economic experiment, why do just 5% of economists think we will better off out? Why do world leaders or financial institutions share the view with a huge majority of economists? Your view is in direct opposition of reputable sources, experts, studies which naturally begs the question, how did you come to your conclusion?

You didn't use facts or reputable sources to shape it, so what did you use? That's the elephant in the room of this whole Brexit mess and I think, at this point, most people - even yourself - know what nature of the elephant is.

Probbaly because economists nearly always recomended whatever keeps thingd stable

 

[antijoke]

Can't wait until the June voting thread as I've changed my mind, I'm in.

 

[Destination]

He should be front & centre rather than Boris.

Much as I am likely to vote remain, he really should be front and centre for that campaign, I have said it from the start that when you see Farage Boris that idiot Gove and Galloway on the same platform, saying the same thing it is very, very hard to reconcile the view they might be right, or be worth supporting.

This man speaks well, destroyed Chukka, made very well laid out points, and looked good in the role, well done him.

 

[McBain]

Can't wait until the June voting thread as I've changed my mind, I'm in.

What's made you change your mind if you don't mind me asking?

 

[antijoke]

Basically it comes down to consumer rights, someone I was talking to mentioned it and I'd never even given that a thought, it's quite a big win for us the lowly mortal.

And if you think about it, what exactly do we get for leaving?

 

[mjt]

Basically it comes down to consumer rights, someone I was talking to mentioned it and I'd never even given that a thought, it's quite a big win for us the lowly mortal.

And if you think about it, what exactly do we get for leaving?

lol

It's good someone's woken up and smelt the coffee

 

[antijoke]

lol

It's good someone's woken up and smelt the coffee

Because of all the fud and lies being spread by both sides I just stripped it down to what matters to me.

 

[mjt]

Because of all the fud and lies being spread by both sides I just stripped it down to what matters to me.

Good for you. A lot people won't bother to do that.
I totally agree the whole thing is a mess with misinformation and lies being peddled from both camps.
It's a shame that the remain campaign had to stoop to such levels. It says a lot about the state of politics in the UK unfortunately.

 

[Zethor]

What you need to do is actually read what I wrote and reply to that, and not imagine things. But that you feel the need to deliberately mis-represent says a good deal about your confidence and faith in your position. I said the Euro was a daft economic experiment, not the EU (FYI: the Euro and EU are not the same thing). The Euro was always a terrible idea, and it is inflicting significant economic damage to the prospects of the many million of individuals locked into long term unemployment by the failure of economies such as France, Germany, Spain, Italy and Greece to reform. If you think I need to quote sources to support this, then with respect you are not following things closely. Do you think the Euro is wonderful?

Yes i misread, the EU is not a draft economic experiment, it's an unholy mess, according to you. As for the Euro, it's good for producers that export within the EU but not great for those that don't export much and have a strong tourism industry (Spain, Italy, Greece). The latter would have had a smoother recovery without the Euro but Germany? Long term unemployment and failure to reform? Haven't heard that one before but it is a clueless statement, unless Germany was mentioned in that list by mistake. France's problems have nothing to do with the Euro either.

Regarding a lot of economists thinking something is the correct thing to do, a lot of economists supported the UK entering the ERM. Look at what happened. Many economists supported the Euro and some even dared to suggest the UK give up the pound, and look at what is happening to those economies who adopted the Euro. If you know a tiny bit of monetary economics, then you will know of the dangers of a 'one-size-fits-all' interest rate. If you think the EU's average economic growth record is good, and the long term unemployment rates acceptable, then your comparative knowledge of economic history is not up to scratch.

What do you mean by 'many economists supported the Euro'? How many? Was the percentage anywhere near 90%, like one for those who oppose Brexit?

What we are failing to get from those in favor of remaining in the EU is comprehensive reform agenda. To think that somehow 'all in OK in the EU' is to live not just on another planet, but another universe, or even outside it.

We're not debating an EU reform, we're debating Brexit.

What of democracy? Some seem to be arguing that less democracy is good for growth. That is largely the position of the remain camp (because that is the result of further integration), and this runs counter to history. More democratic accountability goes hand in hand with improved economic circumstances. The late Tony Benn might have been wrong on a whole load of things, but one thing he got absolutely right was that the EU was not a democratically accountable organization. Surely you are not suggesting less democratic accountability is 'good for growth'? If you are, then your view is in direct opposition of reputable sources, experts, studies which naturally begs the question, how did you come to your conclusion?

Integration is a natural consequence advanced democracies sharing borders and this isn't a particularity of Europe as it has been happening in North America too. The US and Canada have a free trade agreement and their citizens move across the borders without issues. Mexico is not an advanced democracy so instead of debates about integration, the debates currently revolve around building walls.
I didn't mention growth in my reply. Your position re Brexit can't be explained by economics because the evidence that being an EU member is beneficial is overwhelming. That leaves sovereignty and immigration so which of those is behind your position?

 

[scorza]

Basically it comes down to consumer rights, someone I was talking to mentioned it and I'd never even given that a thought, it's quite a big win for us the lowly mortal.

And if you think about it, what exactly do we get for leaving?

Fair enough, clearly you've thought about it and have come up with a reasonable viewpoint unlike most of the remain voters who regularly post in this thread. I disagree btw - those consumer protections can also be taken away and I can't help but notice that the companies that have complained the loudest about European consumer protection laws e.g. Ryanair, are also cheer leading the campaign to stay in the EU (despite not being British).

I would say that our prize for leaving is that we regain sovereignty of our country again. For me nothing is more important than that.

 

[Jokester]

Your position re Brexit can't be explained by economics because the evidence that being an EU member is beneficial is overwhelming.

I would like to see a graph of GDP growth per head of population for the past 20 years, plotted against the population growth.

 

[Zethor]

I would like to see a graph of GDP growth per head of population for the past 20 years, plotted against the population growth.

Britain compared to the rest of the EU or?

 

[scorza]

Your position re Brexit can't be explained by economics because the evidence that being an EU member is beneficial is overwhelming.

Yes but beneficial to whom? David Cameron will say something like the EU adds £4k to everyone's income in the country, but in fact he's just looking at something like total GDP and dividing it by the number of households in the country. The reality is that for the average person, the EU adds nothing - it adds a lot to the 0.1%ers I agree but for me, I just don't see it. Of course, those on low incomes actually lose out by being in the EU - as the head of the remain campaign admitted - wages would be higher outside of the EU.

EU = big government, big business, big academia. Time to make the system work for the people instead.

 

[Gilbert Coquard]

I'm probably going to vote to leave.

One thing I've never understood is the whole warranty thing. EU countries are supposed to get 24 month warranty's, but we only get 12months.

When my Xbox one broke just after the 12month warranty ran out, I attempted to get Microsoft to fix it saying it was within the 2 year warranty and stated EU law etc, but they said It was purchased in the UK so only has 12months. had to pay for them to replace it in the end.

 

[Chris Wilson]

If the EU is such a daft economic experiment, why do just 5% of economists think we will better off out? Why do world leaders or financial institutions share the view with a huge majority of economists? Your view is in direct opposition of reputable sources, experts, studies which naturally begs the question, how did you come to your conclusion?

You didn't use facts or reputable sources to shape it, so what did you use? That's the elephant in the room of this whole Brexit mess and I think, at this point, most people - even yourself - know what nature of the elephant is.

Forgetting the economic side of things for a moment, many people know this is as much a social experiment as economic, and they don't like the way things are heading.