The Rangers Saga and Fallout Thread

Metalface Mark · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:30

steve1873 said:
LOL. You've been listening to Jim Spence haven't you? He is the only person I have hear try to justify Sky continuing to invest in Scottish football at the current levels by using SkyBet. A huge percentage of the Scottish viewers using SkyBet are Rangers supporters for god sake!!!

Jim Spence is a good guy, unlike Traynor, Young and the other succulent lamb brigade.

Metalface Mark · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:31

JUMPURS said:
Don't forget, when Celtic went to Seville in 2003 with players the calibre of Henrik Larsson, Chris Sutton and Stan Petrov, we did so when the SPL had a BBC contract.

Amazing really to think that and also that no clubs went bust that year.

steve1873 · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:38

Metalface Mark said:
Amazing really to think that and also that no clubs went bust that year.

Wee bit of a difference in the financial environment affecting every facet of life and business in 2012 don't you think? Or is that not relevant?

JUMPURS · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:39

Metalface Mark said:
Amazing really to think that and also that no clubs went bust that year.

How many clubs have went bust after being demoted into the first division from the SPL?

I mean, they all depend on a guaranteed 1 visit each from celtic and rangers fans. And without any of that TV money. They must being going bust every year.

Metalface Mark · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:51

steve1873 said:
Wee bit of a difference in the financial environment affecting every facet of life and business in 2012 don't you think? Or is that not relevant?

Not really relevant, attendances are consistent now as they were in that season.

steve1873 · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:52

JUMPURS said:
How many clubs have went bust after being demoted into the first division from the SPL?

I mean, they all depend on a guaranteed 1 visit each from celtic and rangers fans. And without any of that TV money. They must being going bust every year.

Do clubs relegated to the 1st division retain the same playing squad? Or do they have to make severe cutbacks?

Given that they do need to make cutbacks, and the cutbacks would affect SPL clubs, do you not agree that the standard of Scotlands top division? Or face the risk of financial meltdown?

steve1873 · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:53

Metalface Mark said:
Not really relevant, attendances are consistent now as they were in that season.

And clubs costs are consistent as well are they?

JUMPURS · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:53

steve1873 said:
Wee bit of a difference in the financial environment affecting every facet of life and business in 2012 don't you think? Or is that not relevant?

Can a football club not trim its operating costs? If not, how can Rangers ever think to continue since they operate at such a massive loss??

Or can maybe, clubs just change what they spend?? So then they only spend what comes in. I know it is a novel idea in certain parts of Scottish Football though.

Metalface Mark · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:53

steve1873 said:
Do clubs relegated to the 1st division retain the same playing squad? Or do they have to make severe cutbacks?

Given that they do need to make cutbacks, and the cutbacks would affect SPL clubs, do you not agree that the standard of Scotlands top division? Or face the risk of financial meltdown?

Would clubs not be able to make the same cutbacks if the TV deal was reduced? You are not talking much sense Steve!

JUMPURS · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:54

steve1873 said:
Do clubs relegated to the 1st division retain the same playing squad? Or do they have to make severe cutbacks?

Given that they do need to make cutbacks, and the cutbacks would affect SPL clubs, do you not agree that the standard of Scotlands top division? Or face the risk of financial meltdown?

So you mean a club would cut its cloth according to its income??

Is there a rule in the SPL that said this cannot happen?? If not, then what is stopping clubs changing their operating costs?

McMav · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:57

JUMPURS said:
So you mean a club would cut its cloth according to its income??

Is there a rule in the SPL that said this cannot happen?? If not, then what is stopping clubs changing their operating costs?

It would depends on players contracts would it not. Cant just fire a player.

JUMPURS · 1 Jun 2012 at 14:58

McMav said:
It would depends on players contracts would it not. Cant just fire a player.

And i thought you could buy and sell players during two transfer windows a year. D'Oh!

McMav · 1 Jun 2012 at 15:00

JUMPURS said:
And i thought you could buy and sell players during two transfer windows a year. D'Oh!

Need to find a buyer first though eh. clubs havent exactly been battering the doorsa down at most clubs to sign players eh?

JDeeLFC · 1 Jun 2012 at 15:05

In all honesty, id like to see a full UK league. I know the idea has been tossed out loads by current english leagues but it would be much better. I know that Gers and Celtic offered to go into the 1st division. That would also help save Rangers due to the increased opportunities for prospective buyers etc.

Metalface Mark · 1 Jun 2012 at 15:08

Most clubs will already have their budgets set for this year based on a worse case scenario, I know my own club has done this and anyone not doing this would be stupid. Most players are on at most a two year deal these days and Scottish football is not exactly rife with expensive players anyway.

Metalface Mark · 1 Jun 2012 at 15:08

JDeeLFC said:
In all honesty, id like to see a full UK league. I know the idea has been tossed out loads by current english leagues but it would be much better. I know that Gers and Celtic offered to go into the 1st division. That would also help save Rangers due to the increased opportunities for prospective buyers etc.

It wont ever happen.

McMav · 1 Jun 2012 at 15:15

Metalface Mark said:
It wont ever happen.

Well it wont unless the FA's all merge into one GBFA.

JDeeLFC · 1 Jun 2012 at 15:21

It will if they go in at conference level.

Metalface Mark · 1 Jun 2012 at 15:28

McMav said:
Well it wont unless the FA's all merge into one GBFA.

Which would never happen.

JDeeLFC said:
It will if they go in at conference level.

Fifa have already stated the old firm cant go into England, if they want to play in England they would have to relocate into England and start in the very bottom rung.

jas72 · 1 Jun 2012 at 15:31

Metalface Mark said:
Its not fair though, Rangers have made a point of wanting punishments for sticking to the rules, if this is the case then a newco has no right of passage into the third division, and since we are sticking to the rules from now on, would have to have three years set of accounts before it can apply, as Gretna had to.

Rules will be rules as you all keep pointing out

I presume you think by your statement that HMRC will accept the CVA?

Again we have someone splitting hairs.

Rangers will not be a newco in that sense they were around since 1872. :rolleyes:

They won't be formally liquidated thus demotion to div 3 would be a possibility, they won't lose their licence to play.

I'm not a legal expert and I'm only stating what I've read on various sites.

They have over 100 years of accounts to show... again the problem with club and company.

In my opinion it would be very short sighted of HMRC NOT to accept a CVA considering the potential income in future years.

Still there are some that say that HMRC don't have any guidelines on this matter and are free to do as they please. I would harbour a guess that one of the most regulated civil services in the UK is HMRC where there would be little freedom.

I would hope that HMRC acts responsibly to

a) get the best result for the taxpayer

b) look to potential future income from the company in administration

taking these two points into account there can only be one answer.

Accept a CVA. Get some cash now and have income generated in the future.