Today's mass shooting in the US

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C Kent said:
Bless, it's cherry picking how it defines a mass shooting :cry:
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VincentHanna said:
Well it's was a black kids 16th birthday party in a 'black neighborhood' so it's entirely likely.

According to this website though, mass shooters tend to fall in line with racial demographics:

www.statista.com

Mass shootings by shooter’s race in the U.S. 2024 | Statista

Between 1982 and September 2024, 82 out of the 151 mass shootings in the United States were carried out by White shooters.
www.statista.com www.statista.com
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A source that claims there was 142 mass shootings in the US over more than 40 years...

Between 1982 and April 2023, 74 out of the 142 mass shootings in the United States
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Which should immediately raise suspicions about what they are including under the heading of 'mass shootings' given that their figure amounts to an average of under 3.5 such incidents per year. Which, even given the escalation in recent years (and hence lower figures in years before), seems exceptionally low....


For example the Gun violence archive has a larger number (160) for 2023 alone by their figures and the defintion they use!

www.bbc.co.uk

How many US mass shootings have there been in 2024?

Explaining some of the key statistics behind gun ownership and attacks linked to guns in the US.
www.bbc.co.uk

Mass shootings on the rise​

There have been at least 160 mass shootings across the US so far this year. These include attacks the attack at a 16th birthday party in Alabama, in which four died, at a school in Nashville, where three children and three adults were killed, and a mass shooting in Kentucky last Monday, which left four victims dead.
Figures from the Gun Violence Archive - a non-profit research database - show that the number of mass shootings has gone up significantly in recent years.
In each of the last three years, there have been more than 600 mass shootings, almost two a day on average.
While the US does not have a single definition for "mass shootings", the Gun Violence Archive defines a mass shooting as an incident in which four or more people are injured or killed. Their figures include shootings that happen in homes and in public places.
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VincentHanna said:
Statistica used data from here

www.motherjones.com

US mass shootings, 1982–2024: Data from Mother Jones’ investigation

The full data set from our in-depth investigation into mass shootings.
www.motherjones.com www.motherjones.com
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Clown world nonsence

www.motherjones.com

A Guide to Mass Shootings in America

Here is Mother Jones’ groundbreaking database, now documenting 151 public attacks since 1982.
www.motherjones.com www.motherjones.com

Our research focused on indiscriminate rampages in public places resulting in four or more victims killed by the attacker. We exclude shootings stemming from more conventionally motivated crimes such as armed robbery or gang violence.
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So if the shooting mentioned in the previous post was attributed, by Mother Jones, as being 'gang related violence' it would not be included in their figures!
 
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Caracus2k said:
Clown world nonsence

So if the shooting mentioned in the previous post was attributed, by Mother Jones, as being 'gang related violence' it would not be included in their figures!
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Ding ding ding! The quoted 'source' by vinny is the very definition of cherry picking data to push a narrative, as I said its *********.
 
Just to highlight how stupid the mother Jones figures are....

They exclude the infamous bank heist shootout in the North Hollywood district of Los Angeles, California, United States on February 28, 1997

Where two heavily armed and armored bank robbers, Larry Phillips Jr. and Emil Mătăsăreanu, and members of the Los Angeles Police Department engaged in an extended shootout with high capacity rifles with nearly 2,000 rounds expended (the suspects had also illegally converted there rifles for automatic fire)

en.wikipedia.org

North Hollywood shootout - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

Would any sensible conversation about 'assault weapons' and firearms in general exclude such incidents from their scope in the US?
 
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Caracus2k said:
Just to highlight how stupid the mother Jones figures are....

They exclude the infamous bank heist shootout in the North Hollywood district of Los Angeles, California, United States on February 28, 1997

Where two heavily armed and armored bank robbers, Larry Phillips Jr. and Emil Mătăsăreanu, and members of the Los Angeles Police Department engaged in an extended shootout with high capacity rifles with nearly 2,000 rounds expended (the suspects had also illegally converted there rifles for automatic fire)

en.wikipedia.org

North Hollywood shootout - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

Would any sensible conversation about 'assault weapons' and firearms in general exclude such incidents from their scope in the US?
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Only 2 people died in that one, wouldn't generally fall into the mass shooting category when folks use the term in general.
 
C Kent said:
Only 2 people died in that one, wouldn't generally fall into the mass shooting category when folks use the term in general.
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Yes, we actually agree on something!

The criminals died and nobody else did, so yes - It's not a "mass shooting" as defined by any government organisation.

And most of the civilians were not hit by gunfire according to your wikipedia link:

  • Mildred Nolte was struck across the face
  • John Villigrana was struck across the head by the stock of an assault rifle
  • Javier Orozco was struck across the face
  • Barry Golding was hit by flying glass and shrapnel
  • Tracy Fisher was hit in the left ankle
  • Michael Horen was hit in the left side of the chest
  • Jose Haro was hit by flying glass and shrapnel
  • William Marr was hit by glass and shrapnel fragments in the right arm, left temple and nose
 
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They should call it something like:

'Firearms deaths caused by mass shootings'

Instead then.

And government organisation defintions like the FBI defintion:

the FBI defines a "mass shooting" as any incident in which at least four people are murdered with a gun.
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don't exclude shooting committed in gang fueds or whilst conmiting other crimes (like Mother Jones do) in a rather transparent attempt to make racial disparities in whoose doing the shooting look more balanced, per capita, in the US.
 
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Well that's the thing isn't it?

It all depends on the definition and there isn't a single accepted metric. Could easily say a mass shooting is when a 100 people are killed by a bullet and it'd be as compelling.
 
Caracus2k said:
They should call it something like:

'Firearms deaths caused by mass shootings'

Instead then.

And government organisation defintions like the FBI defintion:


don't exclude shooting committed in gang fueds or whilst conmiting other crimes (like Mother Jones do) in a rather transparent attempt to make racial disparities in whoose doing the shooting look more balanced, per capita, in the US.
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There's a general standard across government agencies and the general public which is 4 killed, there are various organizations which have mass shootings as 4 killed or injured but nothing quite so egregious as good old mother jones - I understand why Vincent used it as his 'example' but even he knows its utter rubbish.

There was a US congressional report that was released 2013 or 2015 that concluded a mass shooting is 4 or more homicides.
 
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