Trans man denied right to register as his child's father.

They can do what they like with their own bodies but to have vanity projects like insisting on being named as the father rather than the mother on their children's legal documents and to go to court over it. For it to exist for generations on soc med and searchable records is not dealing with their own bodies.

The child will have a tough enough time anyway, most do, without having a drama queen for a parent.
 
I imagine a lot of the guys in this thread are the same guys, like my father, who believe that homosexuality is "unnatural" and were making similar arguments years ago that they shouldn't be married, shouldn't have children etc.
 
Yes but saying you are a man/women when its biologically impossible for it to be true is just mad. Especially when they expect everyone else to go along with it.

Its like Donald Trump denying he lost the election.
 
dirtychinchilla said:
I imagine a lot of the guys in this thread are the same guys, like my father, who believe that homosexuality is "unnatural" and were making similar arguments years ago that they shouldn't be married, shouldn't have children etc.
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The two issues are quite far apart so perhaps only people of similar mindset to yourself incorrectly conflate them for their agenda.

Some of us actual protest societal change for the good of civilisation as opposed to those "offended on behalf of".
 
I don't believe you should be protesting societal change when people are just trying to find a place for themselves. There's a lot of the "I don't like it or understand it so I'll just object to it" mentality in this thread. I've seen it with my father countless times. He's not transgender, he's not gay, he's a straight white man. As soon as something challenges his perception of the norm, he objects to it.
 
dirtychinchilla said:
I don't believe you should be protesting societal change when people are just trying to find a place for themselves. There's a lot of the "I don't like it or understand it so I'll just object to it" mentality in this thread. I've seen it with my father countless times. He's not transgender, he's not gay, he's a straight white man. As soon as something challenges his perception of the norm, he objects to it.
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Judge agreed with your father in this case, get over it with a nice chai latte?
 
dirtychinchilla said:
I don't believe you should be protesting societal change when people are just trying to find a place for themselves. There's a lot of the "I don't like it or understand it so I'll just object to it" mentality in this thread. I've seen it with my father countless times. He's not transgender, he's not gay, he's a straight white man. As soon as something challenges his perception of the norm, he objects to it.
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Well, without hearing my reason how are you protesting with such certainty? It is a very hypocritical statement.

I'm not protesting the lost looking to "find a place for themselves", I'm protesting the complicity of modern authority in child abuse, abuse of the vulnerable, and propogandisation of harmful incomplete-information.
 
He appears to have found a place for himself. A position at the Guardian newspaper. He has a family to bring up. Two fulfilling roles to get on with, I am sure that many of all genders are doing worse.
 
Hagar said:
She appears to have found a place for himself. A position at the Guardian newspaper. She has a family to bring up. Two fulfilling roles to get on with, I am sure that many of all genders are doing worse.
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Better and factual.
 
NVP said:
Well, without hearing my reason how are you protesting with such certainty? It is a very hypocritical statement.

I'm not protesting the lost looking to "find a place for themselves", I'm protesting the complicity of modern authority in child abuse, abuse of the vulnerable, and propogandisation of harmful incomplete-information.
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OK, I take the point. There are a number of people in this thread who object to the principle of transgender people's existence, or their right to exist whether being described as mentally ill. Whether you fall into those categories or not, I don't know. This is, however, what I object to.
 
Theophany said:
I'm not sure I follow, birth certificate isn't a recognised form of ID for a parent, it's just a statement of record?
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As it's a form of ID you would imagine that "all" the info on it would have to be treated the same way as all other forms of government ID. That's the weirdness for me, that one form of ID has different requirements for what is allowed to be put on it.
 
dirtychinchilla said:
I imagine a lot of the guys in this thread are the same guys, like my father, who believe that homosexuality is "unnatural" and were making similar arguments years ago that they shouldn't be married, shouldn't have children etc.
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Or alternatively some people, like myself for example, believe that you can call yourself whatever the hell you like and we won't say a thing negatively about that until you "force" us to adopt your views instead of our own out of fear of being ostracized for non-compliance because if you don't adopt someone else's values, it has often led to job losses, family stress and even physical attack etc as proven time and time again.

Remember "inclusion" is a two way street, if people want their views to taken in consideration then they also need to take the views of other people, who may feel differently, into consideration too, just like adults are supposed to do.

Instead of that adult conversation back and forth we get a very loud minority of very childish "do as I say not as I do" type attitudes, which again brings me back to the "infantilisation" of far too many people now with their "I'm an [insert object] and you can't say I'm not or I'll scream and scream" just like a spoiled 5yo does when they don't get what they want.
 
Yes. Trans rights should not come at the expense of eroding, or actively trying to destroy women’s rights as a protected category by changing the definition of what a woman is, denying the science of biological sex, and deliberately confusing children about sex/gender and leading to a huge rise in messed up kids, which is what the trans activist and queer theory movements are trying (and often succeeding) to do. This is a complex issue but you’re not allowed to discuss it, just dismissed as a transphobe or bigot, and a generation of kids are being indoctrinated with dangerous ideas while people look on helplessly:


Being a man or woman isn’t performative or something you can change on a whim.

See:
Dr. Deborah Soh - The End of Gender
Abigail Shrier - Irreversible Damage
 
dirtychinchilla said:
I imagine a lot of the guys in this thread are the same guys, like my father, who believe that homosexuality is "unnatural" and were making similar arguments years ago that they shouldn't be married, shouldn't have children etc.
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On the contrary, in fact I've always thought that lumping homosexuality, a sexual preference, together with transgenderism, a medical issue, in the acronym LGBT is very odd.
 
dirtychinchilla said:
I imagine a lot of the guys in this thread are the same guys, like my father, who believe that homosexuality is "unnatural" and were making similar arguments years ago that they shouldn't be married, shouldn't have children etc.
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That's because you're being extremely intolerant, so you imagine that anyone who doesn't completely obey you even in thought is Teh EVIL! In other times and places you'd be imagining that they're all communists, infidels, heretics, bourgeous, aristocrats, whatever. Same old same old.

It's not a good look. Reality is rarely as simple as a simple binary split into The Shining Righteous Ones and The Evil Ones Who Are Wrong In All Ways.

Incidentally, I consider the whole "natural/unnatural" argument as nothing more than a fallacy in most contexts, specifically a false appeal to authority. It's nothing more than "It's <insert god here> will" for people who are atheists or theists who don't want to use their religion that way for some reason. How do you fit that into your imaginings?

Nature has nothing to do with what's right or wrong anyway, so it would still be irrelevant even if it was something more than just saying "I attach a superhuman authority to my opinion".
 
dirtychinchilla said:
OK, I take the point. There are a number of people in this thread who object to the principle of transgender people's existence, or their right to exist whether being described as mentally ill. Whether you fall into those categories or not, I don't know. This is, however, what I object to.
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No, mentally ill people have a right to exist, which is not being disputed by any of us. And they should be able to get help and treatment.

And in future we might just be able to correct these disorders.

If you offered a person inhabiting a man's body, but being convinced he's a woman, the option between a) being fixed so he feels like a man, or b) some kind of butchery to become a pale imitation of a woman... how many people will remain flying the flag for "trans".
 
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