Turkey Grand Prix 2010, Istanbul Park - Race 7/19
- Thread starter Glaucus
- Start date
He'd probably be liked a lot more, if he stood up and admitted to being in the wrong and apologised.
Instead he acted like a spoilt brat and blamed everyone else bar him, which doesn't exactly make him a likeable figure.
to me its worse than schumacher who only did it in a desperate last bid every time, vettle did it even though theres nothing really on the line.
he obviously cant take having a team mate who can race him, maybe vettel isnt even that good webber was never really much better than average imo he never stood out as a title contender
I think youve hit the nail on the head why red bull arnt walking away with the championship, give the same car to alonso, hamm, button or Rosberg and redbull would have had pole to 1st place most races.
i think that their two drivers haven't taken full advantage of the stunningly good car that has been offered and are letting the team down.
Soldato
not me, i have never liked him
dont like his smug grin when he gets asked questions on tv
Soldato
I used to hate the guy, but then after last year, started to warm to him, however, after the constant stream of dodgy aggressive moves this year, he's back on the 'dont like' list, and will stay there!!!!
Soldato
Sickening, what a bunch of tossers.
Now they say they did not look at the situation before blaming someone, so not only do they admint to being biased, now thay say they are incompetent, what a joke
Soldato
Personally I still like him. Think Brundle said in the distant past that all racing drivers are arrogant so and so's. Your not going to get much of an apology at least in the media. As Mark Webber says we'll probably never agree and to be honest why should they?
Again its more to do with how its been handled. If it was McLaren then I can imagine Whitmarsh saying something like "We'll look at the data then make a statement" and they would have probably told the driver who hadn't continued just to keep your head down for the time being.
Not imply blame almost immediately and "magic sponge" time on the pit wall.
Not really got much of an opinion on Vettel tbh, seemed likeable enough in the past, and probably felt Webber didnt give him enough room as a teammate, not that Webber had to do anything but stay on his line. Perhaps the weight of expectation is juuust beginning to build up...
Redbull, as a team, have gone down quite a bit in my estimation, at least in the PR sense. Canada, what with a predicted advantage to Mclaren, will be interesting in this respect in order to gauge how (un?)united RB are after the incident.
Redbull, as a team, have gone down quite a bit in my estimation, at least in the PR sense. Canada, what with a predicted advantage to Mclaren, will be interesting in this respect in order to gauge how (un?)united RB are after the incident.
The reaction to Vettel is definitely as much or even more a reaction to how he and the RBR team have consistently attempted to deny any part of responsibility on Vettel's behalf.
Of the management team, Helmut put one sided blame on Webber. Horner didn't name one driver as being to blame but said the drivers didn't give each other enough room. Well this puts the emphasis of the blame on Webber too as he was the one on the outside setting the amount of room. This is in stark contrast to the opinion held by the journos, experts, and general public, and there can only really be one reason for this amazing difference of opinion. And I think that's what people are so up-in-arms about.
Of the management team, Helmut put one sided blame on Webber. Horner didn't name one driver as being to blame but said the drivers didn't give each other enough room. Well this puts the emphasis of the blame on Webber too as he was the one on the outside setting the amount of room. This is in stark contrast to the opinion held by the journos, experts, and general public, and there can only really be one reason for this amazing difference of opinion. And I think that's what people are so up-in-arms about.
I'd say it's just damage limitation due to a lot of people having a sour taste in their mouth about RBR over this incident.
I still can't believe some people still think Webber should have given way simply because Vettel had a nose in front, they're first and foremost championship rivals and all Vettel had to do was keep his line and try to make his move stick down the inside, eventually Webber would have had to move over and yield more room.
I wouldn't even call it a racing incident because Vettel rammed into Webber in a gamble that he would move, totally wreckless on his part.
Soldato
Yes, Vettel was a knobber, no doubts about that, but I'd say Webber was daft for sticking over to the left, just because you are entitled to, doesn't make it sensible.. And this is no way is meant to take any blame away from Vettel..
My reasoning is,
Vettel was storming by, and by the braking point he would have had his whole car in front, all Webber was doing by 'enforcing' his line was compromising both their lines into the corner, and with the 2 MacLarens behind, compromising yourself isn't that wise, especially when the speed overlap is so large and your opponent is going to be ahead of you by the corner anyway. If the cars would have had substantial overlap still by the corner, then fine, be a bit unyielding... Vettel was stupidly aggressive, MW was totally unyielding, it was inevitable..
Look at LH/JB, both yielded at the right time to ensure minimal risk of contact, if they'd been as unwilling as MW, no doubt they'd have come together to, although that would have been a proper racing incident..
all IMO..
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Soldato
So what is it Horner, the other day you said you asked Webber to save fuel and thats why Vettel got a run on him and now your saying Webber was starting to struggle with the rear tires.
the above is the only part of your post I dont agree with
MW was on the racing line - and without being touched /barged into he would have made the corner exactly like he had for the previous 40 or so laps.
Yes he was uncompromising - but it should be Vettel that has to find his way (completely) around MW not 3/4 of the way and be given the rest, and at the end of the day it is MW who has won the last two races hands down (if he hadnt I bet this situation would never have arisen)
I think MW with one move was not only protecting his current racing position but also his standing in the Championship race - if he had given more space, Vettel would be 10 times more likely to try the same kind of thing again, I very much doubt he will now though (even given what the team have said about blaming Mark)
Digging himself even further into the public do-do if you ask me
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Soldato
Honestly, It's on the right.. as they come up over the top, they drift right to position themselves for the left hander entry...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8712834.stm (1:15 - 1:16)
There's Webbers pole lap. notice that just before where he would have had the ding dong with the donkey, he is moving over to the right, as the racing line into the left hander..
MW seemed determined to keep seb pinned on the inside coming upto the corner, had he taken the same line he did for all the other laps, he'd have been drifting over to the right....
Compare his track poisition when they are alongside the red/white curb that is on the right, on previous laps/qually he is right over, when he's alongside Vettel, he's well over to the left...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8713653.stm
The more I see that, and the more I see the speed differential, the more I wonder what MW was doing, being blooded minded never works when you are both unyielding...
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Exactly they can't seem to make their mind up who wound the engine down and who wound it up. The tires have now come into the equation, funny you would have thought thats the first thing horner would have mentioned post race if there was evidence the rears where going off.
Personally I reckon they asked webhead to back off on the engine and didn't make the same call to vettel, they already said vettel had more fuel for a lap or so's attack in him.
Red Bull has always been a popular team, the way they went about business/fun/press releases etc drew a lot of fans to them. Now it seems like most other teams, happy to nobble another driver as along as the golden boy gets his way.
I've always liked RB despite thinking Vettel was a petulant little **** that cries anytime things don't go his way and turns into schumis smug love child when he wins.
I'd love webber to get the job done now, but somehow think he will have a few issues from now on.
The interesting thing was that Webber requested that Vettel be asked to back off him. In otherwords, "Please tell Vettel not to overtake me".
Now if Webber did ask for this...why would he do this with 20 odd laps to go?
I could understand if there were 5 laps to go and Webber was worried about reliability, but with only 2/3rds race distance done, why did Webber feel that Vettel should not be allowed to overtake him?
Now if Webber did ask for this...why would he do this with 20 odd laps to go?
I could understand if there were 5 laps to go and Webber was worried about reliability, but with only 2/3rds race distance done, why did Webber feel that Vettel should not be allowed to overtake him?
Soldato
Can you believe everything you read now?
I donot believe that Horner would state such a blatant lie.
If Webber came out and said, "At no stage did I ask Vettel to back off", then there would be some explaining to do.