Turkey Grand Prix 2010, Istanbul Park - Race 7/19

Do we actually know they under filled?

Or is it possible it was team orders, not to over take. Hence why button ignored it and carried on fighting.
 
''From PaddockTalk

Red Bull Ordered To Change Diffuser, and Rear Suspension

Yet another element of Red Bull's pace-setting RB6 had to be modified ahead of last weekend's Turkish grand prix.

After Monaco, we reported that McLaren had identified a part of the 2010 Red Bull's rear diffuser that did not conform with the regulations and had to be altered in the Principality.

Germany's Auto Motor und Sport now reveals that an element of the rear suspension was changed at Istanbul Park last weekend.

The report said the elements in question, hidden behind six burly Red Bull mechanics on recent grand prix grids, were aerodynamically shaped and at a 20 degree horizontal angle rather than the allowed five.

In response, Adrian Newey's design team reportedly shrouded the parts with round tubing in order to nullify the downforce-producing effect. ''


a tad naughty but hey-ho.
 
So someone that rams his car into the sidepod of the other car at 200mph without giving him time to react is correct and the driver that stays on the line he was driving the whole straight and does nothing illegal is wrong :confused:

You said it yourself, Vettel should have waited for the corner, take the inside line, go wide and at that point force Webber to slow down, but I guess he didn't fancy braking on the inside of the corner on the marbles, well that's though for him.

I also think that the stewards should give Vettel a warning, it doesn't matter that they are teammates, this is just outright dangerous.

No, Vettel was 100% to blame for the collision..

All I'm saying it was webbers decsion that despite the speed Vettel was coming passed him, and there was no question that Vettel would either be totally infront or with minimal overlap by the corner, he decided to only give him a few centimetres of spare room, massively increasing the risk of incident, and compromising both cars going into the corner.

Just look at the moment of impact, it's Seb's rear tyre against the front of Webbers car, the overlap at that point was substantial and getting smaller very very quickly, Webber had lost the corner entry, both of them where off-line (and on the dirty side of the track), I really can't see any logical reason for Webber to be aggressively defending in a futile situation like that, especially against a team mate.

I say all this after looking at how well JB/LH behaved, LH have JB room at the start of the manoevre, he could have squeezed him out, but the risk is too great, and JB yielded intelligently when LH went back at him, again, he could have held his line, but it would have ended in tears.. Both gave each other room, despite who was legally entitled to it or not, both not wanting to take each other out.

So again, Vettel 100% to blame for the collision, however MW was over defending in a futile manner and increased his own risk of an incident for no reason, unless you count hanging yourself and your teammate out on the dirty line centimetres apart miles before the corner with 2 MacLarens right behind you when your team mate has got the jump on you and is easily going to be past you by the braking point a 'smart' move..

To be honest, end of the day, I am totally against Vettel's behaviour, we are talking about stuff with the hindsight of being able to watch video's and see things the drivers can't, they had milliseconds to react within centimetres of each other! If you look at Webber's on-board, he is naturally moving about a bit, he even seems to slightly keep moving right, then stopping, he was taking it down to the wire, as he's entitled to, but the more I see the video the more it doesn't surprise me contact happened, had that been another team, I'd have been impressed with webbers resolute defending, but being your team mate, and seeing others handle it better, I just think he wasn't being that smart about the situation, no big deal..
 
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''From PaddockTalk

Red Bull Ordered To Change Diffuser, and Rear Suspension

Yet another element of Red Bull's pace-setting RB6 had to be modified ahead of last weekend's Turkish grand prix.

After Monaco, we reported that McLaren had identified a part of the 2010 Red Bull's rear diffuser that did not conform with the regulations and had to be altered in the Principality.

Germany's Auto Motor und Sport now reveals that an element of the rear suspension was changed at Istanbul Park last weekend.

The report said the elements in question, hidden behind six burly Red Bull mechanics on recent grand prix grids, were aerodynamically shaped and at a 20 degree horizontal angle rather than the allowed five.

In response, Adrian Newey's design team reportedly shrouded the parts with round tubing in order to nullify the downforce-producing effect. ''


a tad naughty but hey-ho.
Was wondering what they were hiding :D
 
''From PaddockTalk

Red Bull Ordered To Change Diffuser, and Rear Suspension

Yet another element of Red Bull's pace-setting RB6 had to be modified ahead of last weekend's Turkish grand prix.

After Monaco, we reported that McLaren had identified a part of the 2010 Red Bull's rear diffuser that did not conform with the regulations and had to be altered in the Principality.

Germany's Auto Motor und Sport now reveals that an element of the rear suspension was changed at Istanbul Park last weekend.

The report said the elements in question, hidden behind six burly Red Bull mechanics on recent grand prix grids, were aerodynamically shaped and at a 20 degree horizontal angle rather than the allowed five.

In response, Adrian Newey's design team reportedly shrouded the parts with round tubing in order to nullify the downforce-producing effect. ''


a tad naughty but hey-ho.

No punishment? they obviously knew they had something to hide when engineers were shielding the car all the time.
 
so they have been running an illegal car...

all results void?

could this be also why mclaren were matching them at turkey?

But McLaren didn't match them did they?

Yes, Hamilton split the 2 RedBulls, but that was probably down to a "Hamilton special". RedBull still managed to maintain their 100% pole record, this year.

In the race, even before Turkey, we have seen that McLaren (in particular Hamilton), is able to almost match the speed of the RedBull. This pattern didnt change in Turkey. In fact, were it not for the silly accident, RedBull would've got another 1-2, which is consistent with results of previous races.

I don't believe that the change which RedBull made, made much difference.
 
does seem a bit odd FIA has not said anything.

Indeed. Normally, the FIA are all over the teams, when running illegal cars. Last year when Brawn were running a legal car, Brawn had to defend themselves in court. Here, RedBull have obviusly run an illegal car, yet all that was said to them was, "Please make the ncessary changes to your car, to ensure it complies with the rules."

By making the changes, RedBull have acknowledged that their car was illegal.
 
I always thought that the team trying to hide things on the grid with a mass of mechanics was just a wind-up tactic aimed at Whitmarsh.

Seems not.. :o
 
Very interesting radio! I wonder if JB did need to save fuel, or whether he was only told that to keep him behind LH that did actually need to hold off.
 
Indeed. Normally, the FIA are all over the teams, when running illegal cars. Last year when Brawn were running a legal car, Brawn had to defend themselves in court. Here, RedBull have obviusly run an illegal car, yet all that was said to them was, "Please make the ncessary changes to your car, to ensure it complies with the rules."

Could it just be because we don't have that ******* idiot Mosley in charge anymore?
 
It would appear that Webber's race engineer (Ciaron Pilbeam) was told to pass on the message to Webber, to allow Vettel through.

Vettel thought the message had been given, as did Horner.

Unfortunately, it had not been passed on, so Webber was not aware he was supposed to allow Vettel through.

Based on the above, the crash was due to Ciaron Pilbeam, not passing on the message to Webber, who thought he was racing Vettel and was allowed to defend.

It would appear that RedBull have reached the point where they feel they have to back 1 driver over the other. That driver is Vettel.
 
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