Uh-oh. PS3 'Orange Box' fails.

[wannabedamned]

Is DVD9 and no hard drive really worse than slow Blu-ray speeds and split memory. or vice versa

I personally think it could be a toss up between which company is holding things up. If you've heard solid facts about it being Sony and not Microsoft that's another story

 

[nero120]

I've told you how I know the 360 isn't holding up development, it's because the PS3 is. The Xbox360 is at a limitation without a HDD, however the console was based around game playback, so a fast drive and good memory programming is a more than able replacement.

Of course, knowing your posts from the past I would expect nothing less of your posts than some drivel.

So what you actually said is that the devs planned the games dev for 360 architecture and are now screwed because the ps3 isn't working in the same way? Sounds like your friends are sorry excuses for developers if they couldn't see this one coming...

Drivel eh? "Hello Mr Kettle, I'm Mr Pot..."

 

[rp2000]

So what you actually said is that the devs planned the games dev for 360 architecture and are now screwed because the ps3 isn't working in the same way? Sounds like your friends are sorry excuses for developers if they couldn't see this one coming...

Drivel eh? "Hello Mr Kettle, I'm Mr Pot..."

Whilst I hate people who spout off "friend of friend said stuff as fact" there is no need to get personal with people who aren't even members of this forum!! (although insulting individual forum mebers directly seems to be the norm these days! ).


rp200

 

[FrankJH]

Whether you like it or not it IS possible to make decent games on the PS3 - if people want to show little effort / fob their products off to other parties its going to show, simple as that

MN has always defended Xbox etc, it makes sense in the future they can now concerntrate on only developing for MS - and point to this "failure" as an excuse

 

[Mr Men]

Trouble is, once MS gains the monopoly it wants of the serious consoles, it will then turn its attention to Nintendo. How long before we see a handheld Xbox that competes with the DS? How long before MS starts putting pressure on Nintendo's suppliers to develop games for them instead? How long before Nintendo are reduced to the same status as Sega, a mere games-maker instead of the mighty console manufacturer it once was?

MS would never break Nintendo in the handheld market, they can't even make any impression with the 360 in Asia, Nintendo's 1st party games will errr never be forced to be put on a MS machine unless they go bust like Sega but I think that is never going to happen. Nintendo are way way way more profitable than Sega were comparing them is not really relevant.

 

[Nauggie]

Whether you like it or not it IS possible to make decent games on the PS3

Yes it is possible - I think the problem is it costs to much money and PS3 does not have the user base to justify this outlay.

I guess it is a catch-22 situation - the more games developed the cheaper it gets as more programming tools become available. But developers don't want to do the work until there is a user base and the user base won't increase until the games are available! I know a lot of people still using PS2 and not interested in the Xbox who will probably look to pick up a PS3 in a few years once cost reduced by at least 50%.

I'll stick with Wii and PC for now

 

[KNiVES]

The bottom line is, The Orange Box for PS3 is a victim of another shoddy port. All these 'what ifs' and 'oh Gabe hates PS3' arguments won't change that, and certainly won't do much to buck the trend of lax ports on the PS3. It's all down to EA. Valve did not give HL2 to EA secretly knowing EA would ruin it. They just did not have the time and resources to do all three platforms in-house. Gabe may not like the PS3's architecture, but he gave development to EA to ease off workload and ensure the game came out on a timely basis. I believe anyone who thinks Gabe had an agenda and tried to make the PS3 version the inferior game are seriously deluding themselves.

Also, there's way too many thinly-veiled attacks on the PS3 itself as a console here. Once again a major release is used as a soapbox for 'baaaaaw PS3 sux'. 'baaaaaw EA sux' actually.

 

[Wyrdo]

That explains his PS3 bashing a while back then, he should stick to PC programming.

He had nothing to do with the PS3 version.

Edit: Nevermind, I see you corrected yourself a few posts down

 

[Dutch Guy]

Orange Box is just another crap port that isn't designed to make use of the PS3 hardware (Cell CPU) and is more of an afterthought than being designed for it in the first place.

And if Blu Ray streaming is a problem with GTA IV why don't they just dump 5GB of data on the PS3 harddrive and stream off that

 

[rp2000]

Orange Box is just another crap port that isn't designed to make use of the PS3 hardware (Cell CPU) and is more of an afterthought than being designed for it in the first place.

And if Blu Ray streaming is a problem with GTA IV why don't they just dump 5GB of data on the PS3 harddrive and stream off that

Other problem i see regarding the ongoing "which version is holding up GTA IV" saga is MS have paid $50 million for the extra content to Rockstar. I doubt it would be in their best interests to admit it is a DVD-9 restriction etc that is holding up things when MS have paid them so much.

Especially as they have officially stated in the past that DVD-9 and lack of HDD on 360 was a problem for them (as I mentioned further up somewhere).

It just seems such an easy obvious answer to say if any multi plat game is held up that it must be due to PS3 without sources these days.. which is annoying and a bit of a copout.

So far Rockstar have been as diplomatic as they can and said both platforms pose problems. It is only fanboys and internet rumours stating otherwise.


rp2000

 

[Demon]

To me, the bottom line is, which people have already mentioned, is that software is easily scalable from one core to X cores if all cores are approximately identical, ala 360 and Multicore PC's,
When your entire multicore system becomes assymetrical to the extent the CELL is, then clearly you are going to have a pig of a job to redesign your old/existing designs/code to fit to the extent that really you need to start almost from scratch..

At the end of the day, clearly Sony are the ones causing the pain to developers, the good ones have started from scratch which in itself is painful, the bad ones are just plain struggling to get existing designs to work without ripping them up.. whether this pain is justified is another matter..

People seem to think that Sony have gone down the 'preferred' route.. and to some extent I can see some advantages of the theory, but in practice, the 360, that is supposed to be vastly inferior is somehow still challenging even 1st party built from the ground up PS3 games, which brings me to the conclusion that the divergence Sony have gone for is not yielding the results they hoped/promised..

I can't understand where the MS monopoly comments are coming from, brainwashed fanboys or something..
The fact is, all Multicore 'normal' CPU's are symmetrical designs, this isn't just because of windows, it just because we live in a world where we have to evolve technology or face the predicament that you suddenly have a new OS that forces a change of hardware, the market won't sustain that, so we are here by slow progression.. Just becuase the 360 isn't trying to change the market surely doesn't equate to trying to create a monopoly?

I doubt it would be in their best interests to admit it is a DVD-9 restriction etc that is holding up things when MS have paid them so much.

I agree, I doubt it's wise for any company, sony included' to let any game developer say anything detrimental to the hardware, so I think you do only get fluff and nonsense off these companies..
Lets face it, both consoles have some pretty obvious hardware flaws that aren't being harped on about by developers, and I actually think it's right that they don't whine too much and just give us good games..

 

[McManicMan]

end of the day things will improve, they always do

 

[NokkonWud]

So what you actually said is that the devs planned the games dev for 360 architecture and are now screwed because the ps3 isn't working in the same way? Sounds like your friends are sorry excuses for developers if they couldn't see this one coming...

Drivel eh? "Hello Mr Kettle, I'm Mr Pot..."

My friends are artists, not programmers. Which I already said.
Fact is, this is happening ALL the time, would it not be common sense that the problem is the Sony Dev kits and not all the developers out there who, lets be honest, aren't having any problems making games for the Wii, Xbox360 or PC. Hmmm...

 

[nero120]

My friends are artists, not programmers. Which I already said.
Fact is, this is happening ALL the time, would it not be common sense that the problem is the Sony Dev kits and not all the developers out there who, lets be honest, aren't having any problems making games for the Wii, Xbox360 or PC. Hmmm...

Haven't we already covered the fact that 360 releases aren't ported to the wii (and vice versa) so that point is irrelevant, and the 360 and PC are essentially the same platform, so.....

 

[Hugest_UK]

My friends are artists, not programmers. Which I already said.
Fact is, this is happening ALL the time, would it not be common sense that the problem is the Sony Dev kits and not all the developers out there who, lets be honest, aren't having any problems making games for the Wii, Xbox360 or PC. Hmmm...

Tbh what your uncles brothers sister said to you in the pub after 12 pints doesnt mean sqaut to me and your constant trolling and negativity in Ps3 posts is getting tiresome

Hugest

 

[rp2000]

Tbh what your uncles brothers sister said to you in the pub after 12 pints doesnt mean sqaut to me and your constant trolling and negativity in Ps3 posts is getting tiresome

Hugest

You are not the only one..


rp2000

 

[FrankJH]

Yes it is possible - I think the problem is it costs to much money and PS3 does not have the user base to justify this outlay.

Sorry - when isnt 6 million a decent user base? (Minimum current worldwide sales)

I guess it is a catch-22 situation - the more games developed the cheaper it gets as more programming tools become available. But developers don't want to do the work until there is a user base and the user base won't increase until the games are available! I know a lot of people still using PS2 and not interested in the Xbox who will probably look to pick up a PS3 in a few years once cost reduced by at least 50%.

I'll stick with Wii and PC for now

Im not disputing your choice, but if a dev wants to with that many potential sales its easily worth their while

 

[Mr Men]

Tbh what your uncles brothers sister said to you in the pub after 12 pints doesnt mean sqaut to me and your constant trolling and negativity in Ps3 posts is getting tiresome

Hugest

How is he trolling? Can you prove what he heard is not true, never mind its rumoured to be true also without what he has been told, the thread is about another shoddy PS3 game, now the PS3 fans are whipping up a storm to deflect from that issue. The word troll and trolling seem to be the most used things on this forum, as soon as someone has a different opinion out comes the "troll" card, its a bit sad.

 

[FrankJH]

To me, the bottom line is, which people have already mentioned, is that software is easily scalable from one core to X cores if all cores are approximately identical, ala 360 and Multicore PC's,
When your entire multicore system becomes assymetrical to the extent the CELL is, then clearly you are going to have a pig of a job to redesign your old/existing designs/code to fit to the extent that really you need to start almost from scratch..

At the end of the day, clearly Sony are the ones causing the pain to developers, the good ones have started from scratch which in itself is painful, the bad ones are just plain struggling to get existing designs to work without ripping them up.. whether this pain is justified is another matter.. ..

Admittedly for different reasons but devs had a pain programming for the PS2 to start with also - yet that outgrew everthing and is still selling pretty healthily even now (two years after the X360 was released)

Also remember that MS had a huge lead time over Sony (at least a year if not more) - this was only Sony's fault I know, but the original games coming out for the PS3 are for the most part equal to what was coming out a year ago for the X360, I fully agree that the PS3 teams have a tougher task but its also potentially possible that this hardware has further to grow also......

People seem to think that Sony have gone down the 'preferred' route.. and to some extent I can see some advantages of the theory, but in practice, the 360, that is supposed to be vastly inferior is somehow still challenging even 1st party built from the ground up PS3 games, which brings me to the conclusion that the divergence Sony have gone for is not yielding the results they hoped/promised....

Different route yes - preferred no, MS has an advantage as you stated because their cpu is a standard pc design and so everyone is familiar with it - and this is my basis for the above arguement, its easier to get a huge percentage of performance straight away from the core componants because you have been designing for it for a reasonably long time already (ok maybe not dual core, but thats not so difficult to add in from the ground up)

As you said the Cell is completely different so my educated guess is that right now a lot less% performance is being utilised to get similar results to games already released awhile ago on the X360

Im no expert but Ive worked in PC hardware for nearly 20 years so I know enough to make an educated guess - but I will happily eat my words if Im proven wrong over time

I can't understand where the MS monopoly comments are coming from, brainwashed fanboys or something..
The fact is, all Multicore 'normal' CPU's are symmetrical designs, this isn't just because of windows, it just because we live in a world where we have to evolve technology or face the predicament that you suddenly have a new OS that forces a change of hardware, the market won't sustain that, so we are here by slow progression.. Just becuase the 360 isn't trying to change the market surely doesn't equate to trying to create a monopoly?

I havent seen this arguement but I would agree with you on that count - MS DO have an OS monopoly as much as anyone and this gives them the money to throw around and loose billions in additional gaurentees etc and thats business sense considering how many units they can potentially sell.

I agree, I doubt it's wise for any company, sony included' to let any game developer say anything detrimental to the hardware, so I think you do only get fluff and nonsense off these companies..
Lets face it, both consoles have some pretty obvious hardware flaws that aren't being harped on about by developers, and I actually think it's right that they don't whine too much and just give us good games..

We all need every manufacturer to continue - the more in the market the better developed hardware and software will be released, I am really looking forward to trying Mario Galaxies as its meant to be really good fun, and it wouldnt be the same on a PS or Xbox in my opinion, the same for PGR or GT franchises, each different system brings its own shinning lights and any gamer (kid, adult, new or old to gaming) should embrace these creations most of us spend a fortune on

How is he trolling? Can you prove what he heard is not true, never mind its rumoured to be true also without what he has been told, the thread is about another shoddy PS3 game, now the PS3 fans are whipping up a storm to deflect from that issue. The word troll and trolling seem to be the most used things on this forum, as soon as someone has a different opinion out comes the "troll" card, its a bit sad.

Because even now there are enough games out there to prove you CAN have a decent original gaming time on a PS3 IF the devs want to put in the effort!!

His opinion is valid - but the same things being posted time after time always being negative does get a lil tiresome-imo

 

[yaboy]

360 wins another multiplatform award.