Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

what are you talking about? our AFV`s are all home made , same as our ships and subs - oh wait , in fact EVERYTHING the armed force uk use (other than a handful of drones) is made either here or in the EU

You do understand that we do not even have long range bombers, our subs are loaded with American made nukes.

We are buying the so called trash F-35, we do not have 5th gen planes, we are not even developing any.

Nearly half of EU air-force is made up of F-16 and F/A 18.

We rely on American made GPS for navigation which utter stupidity.

Our EU largest air-craft carrier is x2 the size of American Nimitz and if I am right, we have 1 of them in service...

For a worlds largest economy, we are truly in a sorry and dependent state.

Whats more, by 2045, US millitary budgest is expected to double, Russians to tripple, China`s to go up nearly 10 fold.

Ours not even to account for inflation... You have to be an idiot to believe everything is going fine for EU.

** Please don't hotlink images **

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Russia is such a pathetic country that it will do whatever possible to annoy and scare West. Also it is a one massive fail with broken economy and brainwashed nation still worshipping animals like Lenin and Stalin. It must be eliminated before it is too late, Hitler wasn't and millions of innocent people paid with their lives. There is nothing like talking nice to Putin, every agreement you make with him he wipes his bottom with. Merkel and Hollande are a disgrace and shouldn't be involved in any more "diplomacy" towards that Russian Evil Empire.

edit @ Curio, simpleton: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVZjyyAE-78 watch and learn...

We need to gather all Russians and put them in gas chambers

They are a bad race and a threat to the world.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Ja wohl, mein Fuhrer!

Nazi detected. Isnt nazism banned in Europe???

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Given his posting history and attitudes to Russia and the west, I think Arek was being more than a bit sarcastic there

You make me sound like a Russia fanboi...

Doesnt stack up when I call for armament of EU to a world super-power level.

I dont agree with current western (USA) primarily foreign policy, since its insanely hypocritical, self-centered, corrupt and way worse than anything Russia has done in past 20 years.

Even on Ukraine, EU has a far more balanced approach even with pressure from USA.

If that pressure wouldn't exist, maybe we`d actually practice "REAL" democracy and let the locals decide what they want to do in an enforced democratic vote (you can read about this few pages back).

Hold recognized referendums in Crimea and Donbass and let people decide what they want. Stopping this insane bloodshed for no reason.

Currently, USA and Russia are having a hissy fit at each-other at cost of thousands of lives in EUROPE.

We cant tell anything to USA because they own us, and we are too small to tell Russia anything.

EU is worlds largest economy for god sake, our army should be strong enough to grab both USA and Russia by their ears and pull them aside for a strong word and if that isnt enough, a kick in the arse to follow.

At the moment, we cant even write a "strong worded letter"

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

That was my intention, though I do note a change of tack in your posts recently and will watch with interest...

I am behind what is right. Now lets have a quick look of events in Ukraine and a bit more of related activities.

- Countries including west, sign a pact which dictates that Yanukovich will step down in couple months and elections will be held.

- Euromaidan storms government by force, ignoring all previous reached and recognized agreements --- West Supports.

- Euromaidan leaders remove Yanukovich unconstitutionally (not enough votes reached) and this is all under essentially pro-right activists being inside Rada --West Supports

- First law new government tries to push through is to remove Russian language along with other anti-russian - soviet ideologies -- West is Silent.

- Temproary government wants to sign EU deal way before elections took place -- West Supports

- Nuland caught talking about who they should place as a leader of Ukraine.

- Communist party is banned from Rada. (Undemocratic) -- West is Silent

- East demands Federalization (not independence, federalization), Ukranian government sends troops to put them down -- West Supports

- Crimean crisis happens, elections are held, observers from all over the world are invited to take part -- West flips poo.

- No one denies that vast majority of Crimea voted in Pro-Russian favor -- West flips poo.

- Russian equipment in Ukraine - West flips poo

- Ukranian equipment BUK-1 along with Crew in Georgian war -- West Supports.

- Russia demands elections to be held in Donbass, Rebels do want Independence though -- Ukraine says that this is unacceptable and West Supports

- Ukraine + West demands total surrender of "Terrorists" total control of border and then MAYBE, SOMEHOW people of the east will get their say. -- West says that this is how its supposed to be.

- This is given that idea of just federalization has made Kiev to send in troops, what chances do people of Donbass of actually getting independence? Also given Crimean history, when those too, wanted independence but where shuffled to the side in the 90`s.

- Countless of falsified satellite pictures, media pictures painting Russians as the bad guys, with vast majority being completely disproved the latest one of congress guy showing some totally unrelated pictures.

- Russia not to be trusted at all, rich coming from a country which sent Collin Powell to the UN with falsified evidence concerning about Iraq... No one has been tried for falsification of evidence that has lead to thousands of deaths, "poo happens".

- Libya, UN granted of No-Fly-Zone, ended up bombing everything from the skies, launching tomahawks, SAS on the ground (boots on the ground) mission called total success and in compliance with UN. Libya is a total mess right now, protesters are shot in the squares, 2nd war going on... -- Who cares.

- Georgian war, Russia invades a small country for no reason just to feed its soviet appetite -- few years later, EU investigation confirms that Russians had the right to do what they did.

- EU says that supplying weapons is totally wrong way to solve a crisis -- we send military advisers, Americans are sending "non-lethal" weaponry.

- Russia blamed for using the gas supplying as leverage, blamed for forcing Ukraine to Pre-Pay for supplies, when its well known that Ukraine ran massive debt for the supplies and been caught red handed stealing gas -- Russia is a bad bad and vile being, keep in mind... Russia is not refusing to supply gas, all its saying that it must be paid for and not free.. (crazy right?)

- Ukraine cuts off electricity, water to Crimea - Nothing Wrong.

- Countless sanctions on Russia, talking of switching off SWIFT which would paralyze whole financial system.

- Gas from Russia keeps flowing to both UKRAINE and EU, barely any talks of cutting it off to EU as a response for the sanctions.

- Ukraine PM threatens to shut down the gas pipeline which supplies gas from Russia to the Europe.

And to just sum it up from History.

- Nuclear Missiles in Turkey - Beacon of Democracy projected on the world of freedom.

- Nuclear Missiles in Cuba - Empire of pure Evil trying to destroy the whole world.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Can someone explain to me, what benefit does Putin have in murdering opposition leader who has next to none support and is considered American spy by most of population?

Especially knowing full well the west is going to pick this up and blow it up and blame him.

He jailed and then released Hodorkovsky, a man who Putin genuinely feared and yet he is alive and well, spouting anti-putin stuff while still having considerable power.

This guy is literally a no one.

This Nemtsov is as much as of a threat to Putin as BNP leader Griffin or whats his name to Cameron.

P.S

I guess things have gone bad for KGB (FSB) since they used to be pretty good at making people "suicide" or have an "accident"... All is left is to do an open drive by shooting on one of busiest streets in Moscow.

Sanctions must`ve really hit Russia hard, cant even use plutonium in assassinations anymore...

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-31656455



First arrests of their kind unless im mistaken? Be interested to see if they face the same fate as Jihad fighters returning from Syria.

I wonder what the reaction would be, if those were fighting on Ukraine side

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Yes lets....

Yanukovich using riot police on the protestors triggered them to call for his resignation. "Mr. Yanukovych called for calm after the clashes and declared he would never use force to disperse a peaceful protest." Yeah right. Any source on this West signed pact?

Yanukovich fled his post in Ukraine by helicopter to Russia before any storming occured when he realised the game was up after shooting dead protesters?

The country was left leader-less and so the MPs in parliament were left to pickup the peices: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-begins-building-new-government-9147465.html#

Nope. Yanukovich introduced a law in 2012 allowing the Russian language to be officially used in Ukraine, this simply reverted it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_policy_in_Ukraine

Have a read of: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine–European_Union_relations "In May 2010, President Viktor Yanukovych promised to adopt in June 2010" so they wanted to do what was promised? Right.

LOL which one of your pro-Putin blogs/sites did you copy/paste all that propaganda from? I cant even be bothered to go through the rest of it. Whats all this "West Supports" stuff? As opposed to what exactly?

Err what? After the deal was signed, euromaidan was supposed to "disperse" Protesters were violent and armed and most of things they did were lawless.

Country was left leader-less because Euromaidan refused to follow the deal signed

I know, so much Russian propaganda... I am sure especially the Iraq/Libya is all pile of nonsense, just Russian propaganda.

I suggest you watch BBC`s take on the "Shooting of Protestors" things are really not as clear cut as you make it seem.

Oh sorry, I guess if laws are reverted its fine? I guess if Germans reverted some laws from 1940`s it would be absolutely fine.

Same goes for America, with its racial laws... Bring back Segregation, after all... its just reverting of laws.

We can revert laws all the way back to slavery

simply reverting laws, what your problem?

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Yup, proves my point - you're behind what Russia says is right.

In that case, you are behind what America says is right

Cant wait till the day, anyone who questions US foreign policy is going to be labelled pro-putin.

Are you questioning existence of Chemical Weapons in Iraq? -- PRO PUTIN!!!

Then we`ll throw some internal stuff as well...

You believe in NSA? -- PRO PUTIN!!!

Thats why I am Pro-EU as superpower, because apart from UK (which is a dog to USA) mainland EU seems to have more or less balanced view on foreign issues.

P.S

Scorza, I think you are Pro-Russia... Because you share same opinion on Iraq.

I'll admit that I was a moron and believed Blair when he said that Saddam was developing WMD, I naively thought that there was no way they'd lie about this because if it turned out that there were no WMD in Iraq then Blair would have to had resigned immediately! T

You cheeky little minx, making us believe you are anti-Russia I bet Russian Propaganda brain-washed you into believing that there are no WMDS in Iraq...

Because if you dont believe in West Actions, then you simply must be Pro-Russian. There is NO 3rd option and those who are Pro-Russia are always 100% wrong.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Massive difference between going to a country and being accepted to fight on its behalf (Foreign Legion) and going to visit a country and fighting against it (Syria)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-31669061

Yet another Russian murder of someone with a different view.

I dont think we had any issues with "illegal volunteers" when they fought against Geddaffi and Assad....

Strange hmm....

You do realise that shooting of that guy, in Russia, where Putin has approval rating of around 90%... Is comparable to sudden murder of Nick Griffin tomorrow...

Today we laugh at him, tomorrow we would make him a martyr... Its just against any common sense ordering a murder of an individual which possesses no threat when alive but has a potential to be a bomb if dead.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Final interview with Boris Nemtsov, hours before dying:

http://www.newsweek.com/final-interview-boris-nemtsov-310392

For now, we’re drowning. Everyone. Due to the policy of Vladimir Putin, a country with unparalleled potential is sinking, an economy which accumulated untold currency reserves is collapsing.

The West, the U.S. and Europe are moving forward, and what is our government doing? It comes up with some desperate ideas, wants to regulate prices, subsidizes state-owned companies to let its people on the boards earn even more. And worst of all, this government wades into a costly, fratricidal war in Ukraine and into pointless confrontation with the West.

Putin programmed my countrymen to hate strangers. He persuaded them that we need to rebuild the former Soviet order, and that the position of Russia in the world depends entirely on how much the world is afraid of us. He managed to do all these things with Goebbels-style propaganda.

I think it's quite possible that someone read/heard this interview, passed on the information and the decision was made to terminate him. Let me add that it's quite disgusting to hear people on this forum rant about conspiracies to destabilise Russia. Who in the West and in their right mind would not want to one day cooperate internationally with such a decent, intelligent man?

1) Everyone with more than 1 brain cell in the head, in the west, understands that this guy is hopeless and will never be a President in the Russia... A.k.a he is worthless alive to the west. Dead, is another story.

2) This is the same guy who talked that if he is in power, he will remove Russia`s nuclear arsenal.

3) This guy been found to be financially supported by the West, rightly so, if he came to power, it would be amazing for us... Russia which abides by our rules and does not have nukes, dream come true.

Now wake up and realize what a joke of a person this is to a normal Russian on the street and weigh in his chances of ever even getting 1% votes in the election polls.

To Putin this guy is so much more worth Alive because it shows "democracy" and portrays opposition as a joke due to their policies.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

ah yes. obviously. It was probably one of those muslamic terrorbads he was obviously involved in

http://www.independent.co.uk/incomi.../alternates/w460/Boris-Nemtsov-AFP-Getty3.jpg

Thank god Putin is leading this enquiry.

All of you who are going against the official version.

Are conspiracy theorists, you do realize.

Bring on the tin-foils. Or it only works for the west?

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Propaganda, brainwashing, intimidation.... remember?

I think its time we forcefully remove Putin from power in Russia for the sake of poor Russian people.

Thats how democracy works.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Pot, meet kettle.

And of course there is no destabilization being attempted against Russia. The political and economic sanctions, the constant threats and ramping up of propaganda against Russia, it's all just a figment of my imagination.

Or maybe not.

It hasnt even been a full day since murder of the guy and all front pages are essentially screaming "Putin Murdered Nemtsov in cold blood, himself, right outside Kremlin"

One of Baltic states President already made a statement which read that this is clear example of Russian state terrorizing its own citizens.

Its just crazy when world leaders resort to those kind of words.

At best, we should require and independent inquiry into the case, rather than let Putin handle it.

No one has the right to draw conclusions less than 24hrs from the event, especially on PRESIDENT level.

Disgusting.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Hardly, there's a long history of assassinations of political opponents and journalists in Russia. None of them were particular threats to Putin. It's just how he operates.

Even know I can throw the "Tin-Foil Hat" at this comment, I wont.

Since I am not gullible, Putin indeed, has been involved in some rather dark things in Russia.

However, with little common sense, one understands that the current murder, carries negative impact on Putin.

He knows that the whole world is watching him due to Ukraine, this really isnt the time to do things like that... Makes zero sense, especially knowing how smart he is.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Putin didn't have to order it, he just tolerates ring wing extremist, xenophobes, neonazis and they support their fearless leader by killing opponents because they can.

Wait so Putin didnt order/murder personally this guy? Cause the Media makes it seem like he did it himself.

I can personally buy the version that one of his less smart "underdogs" gone a bit wild and did this... and that following person would most likely dissapear from existence very soon, and no one will ever even hear about it...

Doesnt change the fact that almost certainly Putin had no intentions what-so-ever of getting rid of this Nemtsov and things have just gone very wrong and caused a massive head-ache to him.

As for arek and Danny, you only need oulton's contribution and the off their meds Putin admirers team is complete.

Fine Goebbells tactic here, make your opponent seem sub-human (insane + Putin-Fanboi) so instantly, that grants the "all your arguments are invalid" buff.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Spoiler

It has absolutely never bothered him that people are watching.

Yes it has, why do you think Hodorkovsky was sent to jail rather than being murdered?

Why do you think he was allowed to walk?

Because him being in jail, caused more trouble to Putin than him being outside, him being murdered, caused more trouble than him being in Jail.

Putin is a calculative person.

You should look into his rise to power in 2000`s, he didnt focus on political Murders, because he knew that it backfired... Instead he set up his opponents to be publicly shamed.

Nemtsov alive, is public shaming and was beneficial to Putin. Nemtsov dead carries absolutely 0 benefits and 120 negatives.

There's no tin foil hats to be worn here, plenty of evidence to say the Russian state engages in dirty activities.

100% agree with you here.

However, who are we comparing against? USA has been found and still is found of very foul play with CIA and torture.

Vatican has been said to have a very corrupt and brutal hierachy.

Did you know that there is Amish Mafia?

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Why do you think he was even in jail in the first place?

Because he was a threat to Putin? Once he was no longer a threat, he was allowed to walk.

You just said that Putin does not care, well why didnt he murder Hodorkovsky? This guys is probably biggest threat Putin ever had.

He didnt murder him because he is smart. Murder of Hodorkovsky would`ve backfired on him. Jailling of Hodorkovsky backfiring on him (not as much as murder). As soon as that guy walked, everyone forgot about his existence... Thats why he walked, because Threat<Pain of Media and world.

None of which have anything to do with this.

Err what? You do realize that everything in this world, is measured and understood through comparison?

How do you know you are tall? You look at other people....

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Yes it would be an idiotic thing to think that murdering literally everyone was the only solution to dealing with opponents.

It would be more idiotic to assume that Putin murdered a man who was worth to him more alive (as a joke of opposition) than dead (a martyr for the west)

When he spared this fate to his most feared opponent in fear that his death would back-fire on both world and internal arena... Showing that Putin`s direct order of murder Nemtsov made absolute 0 sense, and disproving your belief that Putin gives zero monkeys about public opinion.

No it's not. That's an idiotic thing to say. Other nations doing bad stuff has no real revelance on whether it's acceptable or not for any one nation to do bad stuff

That is a very childish and utopian thing to say.

I repeat, everything in current world, is seen through comparison.

Your A-Level, GCSES, SAT, ACT are measured against your ability to perform against your peers.

You simply can not isolate Russia and judge them "perfect" perspective when no other nation is even close.

Its same as calling someone dumb with B`s for GCSE`s while having D`s yourself, while taking exactly same test...

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Quote where I've said Putin doesn't care about public opinion. You're trying to back up your argument with a point that I've not made.

It has absolutely never bothered him that people are watching. His position is one of showing absolute strength.

There's no tin foil hats to be worn here, plenty of evidence to say the Russian state engages in dirty activities.

100% agree with you here

I never said that what Russia is doing is "right" I was not joking when I agreed with you that there is plenty of evidence to suggest Russian wrong-doing.

Both when I agreed that there is plenty of evidence to suggest that Russia is a Mafia state and when admitting Putin has been involved in very dark practices during his career.

Also not everything is relative, things can also be absolute.

Your mere existance is relative to the point of universe... You do not exist to an alien who is 1 billion light years away. Simple as. Hell, you havent even been born to someone who is 50 odd light years away from us.

In short I am saying 2 things.

1) Given past history of Putin, there is more than enough of evidence to suggest that he was not behind the Nemtsov killing as the west is portraying.

2) While Putin is a bad person, the current world we live in, is bad. We in the west with our practises are not exactly far away from the "monster Putin" so its a bit weird when we speak from point of morality when we have been proved to be involved in insanely bad things.

We need to change ourselves and that will remove people like Putin automatically.

To dumb it down, lets use this as an example:

We live in post-acalyptical world where food is short, we (west) steal the food and everything is good, we are fed and happy. Once Russia tries to steal the food, they are labelled as terrorists and thiefs (correct from "utopian" view) by OURSELVES. However, due to the nature of the world, if you do not steal the food, you dont survive. simple as. Russians dont understand why cant they steal the food when we are doing it and why are they labelled as thiefs by us, who have been doing it for as long as anyone can remember?

In short, everyone is bad, we are just arguing who is worse.