Why shouldn't we train them? I don't think the Peshmerga have ever been trained by western governments have they?
Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar
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Why shouldn't we train them? I don't think the Peshmerga have ever been trained by western governments have they?
America trained them before isis during the second gulf war I think.
no amount of training will put Ukraine on an even footing with Russia anyway.
It's not training they need it's vehicles and weapons.
so unless we are giving them new stuff and showing them how to use it I don't see the point
Soldato
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What a feeble attitude you have; so lacking in belief and ambition for our nation. We are one of the worlds largest economies with strong political influence and the military might to back it up.
We should assert ourselves, not bury our heads in the sand.
I agree they need vehicles and weapons, and it's a tremendous cop-out that no-one is helping Ukraine in this way yet. However I don't see the harm in training Ukrainian forces, who knows they might be able to achieve some victories over Russia which would be incredibly embarrassing for Moscow. While at the same time it can't really hurt us.
Have to agree with this. While I don't think Putin is planning on rolling through Europe a la Hitler, we have to stand up to this in some fashion...or we didn't learn much from last century, did we? And while our military isn't once what it was, it's still up there with the best.
Also, I was not particularity a fan of Maggie Thatcher by any means, but I would love to see how she would have gone head-to-head with Putin in this situation. He probably wouldn't even of dared start any of this for fear of the phone call
SkodaMart
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SkodaMart
Hitler was popular as well.
Lies, propaganda and media control can squew a rational persons views.
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SkodaMart
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SkodaMart
Oh come on!!
You are living in the past mate.
Look at a map for Gods sake, and compare the UK with Russia!
The UK should stay out of the affairs of Russia - at this stage at any rate.
The days of the British empire are long gone, reality check maybe??
Have you watched the Falklands war documentaries, do you realise how badly our forces were stretched?
Or how about the poor equipment supplies to squaddies in Afghanistan, and Iraq. - Lads were having to buy their own boots for ****sake!
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SkodaMart
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SkodaMart
Given his posting history and attitudes to Russia and the west, I think Arek was being more than a bit sarcastic there
Sorry, not how it read.
I've not seen his previous
because logistics and advanced battlefield medical care are a hard thing for a country to perfect when it hasn't fought a war in a long time?
or did you think we were just training them to shoot rifles?
Military Might ! Not really, those days are long gone.
Because they'll be getting hold of British weapons, which Cameron has promised not to supply Ukraine with, through Britain - United Arab Emirates weapons deals, so... they need British weapons instructors.
Soldato
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Training is a part of the problem though, there's been plenty of noise on twitter and FB from Ukraine troops about the poor leadership skills from their officers but I do agree new equipment is badly needed, everything from new gun sights with night vision to artillery pieces.
I'm aware of that but you used Libya as an example, where the mission didn't creep at all. support rebels, get civvies out of there, bomb gaddafi, help co-ordinate strikes, done then left them to it.
Or look at the French in Mali still going at it.
That said I think "mission creep" is a poor and misused term. Threats and the situation evolve. you cant keep doing the same thing a year later if everything has changed on the ground.
What should happen is, weigh how far we can commit, *dont announce it* and then work within that border, reassessing periodically. Again the french have been doing this brilliantly in mali.
This has nothing to do with any empire, can we stop wheeling this tiresome fallacy out.skodamart said:
Any War stretches resources. your example is entirely mute.
And for years now we've had very good personal kit. The lesson there is about being prepared for a tasking not "why bother".
Quite. They have also started conscription and currently have the 3rd largest army in the EU. they have masses of untrained troops. It's actually similar to the massive inflated afghan/iraq armies in that respect but lets hope without the culture and motivation problems.Freddie said:
The Americans are sending a battalion to train 3 battalions as well and Poland and Lithuania have joined a Brigade with Ukraine to help them train with nato forces (both Nato countries)
A lot of our training will apparently be medical, comms and logistics.
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training from america? they spent 25 billion arming and training iraq the army turned tale and ran.
you might as well get usain bolt to train your army
SkodaMart
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SkodaMart
Britain WAS a world power, we were a force to be reckoned with.
WAS = past, history, gone...
We are too small to act as 'world police' it's an utter joke and a massive drain on our resources - as well as a waste of UK forces lives.
Lets face it, standing up to Germany during WW2 was very impressive but if it wasn't for Hitler fighting on all fronts we would be now speaking German.
We have very impressive armed forces, but please don't be a fool and compare us to Russia.
I don't think we should be sending people to train the Ukrainians or giving them equipment or anything, this conflict has been so dodgy from the start.
There are no good guys in this, just people getting killed and people's lives destroyed for political reasons. Stay out of it.
There are no good guys in this, just people getting killed and people's lives destroyed for political reasons. Stay out of it.
apples and pears. there aren't half the problems of training a eastern european army than there is a middle eastern one, and the ukrainians whilst losing ground vs a russian backed force are already miles more competent than the INA.
You also seem to be missing out the fact the west trained the peshmerga, and the jordanians who are still kicking the stuffing out of ISIS.
How do you think the baltics and poland got converted from ex soviet to leading Nato members? Regular training and investment with Nato forces.
Lets not use your complete lack of military knowledge to write off two of the 3 largest armies on earth shall we?
dear lord. Empire or ww2 has nothing to do with this present day situationSkodamart said:
1. we are not acting alone
2. It is in defence of a Federal Entity
3. And a single sovereign state
3. against the aggression of another single sovereign nation
It Is literally the antithesis of acting like an Empire. You just sound like an RSS for a guardian hand wringing opinion column
Oh right, which lives have we lost in the training force we havent sent out yet? And no, its not a massive drain. we sent 1000 troops to combat Ebola in Africa. This isn't even a 10th of that.
You are delusional if you think that's what I am doing.
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SkodaMart
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SkodaMart
So, when Russia sweeps through the Ukraine and reclaims it, what then?
New Berlin wall?
SkodaMart
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SkodaMart
Latvia and Lithuania would be my guess, wonder where he will stop?
This is like WW2 all over again (with nukes).
This is serious ****
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