Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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What else can the west offer Ukraine other than air superiority?

The way i see it, Ukraine is having limited momentum whilst Russia pulls itself together. The way things are progressing this is going on for years.
 
4Qman said:
What else can the west offer Ukraine other than air superiority?

The way i see it, Ukraine is having limited momentum whilst Russia pulls itself together. The way things are progressing this is going on for years.
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More ammunition and equipment, but it could be too late now and it could well end up as a stalemate. Sadly I'm not sure the US would be too worried about that outcome.
 
4Qman said:
What else can the west offer Ukraine other than air superiority?

The way i see it, Ukraine is having limited momentum whilst Russia pulls itself together. The way things are progressing this is going on for years.
Click to expand...
If that's what it takes then that's how it will take. It's up to the west and NATO as to how quickly Ukraine can drive out Russia, supplies have been drip feed for over 18 months which has given Russia the opportunity to dig in and mont a resistance.

NATO really needs to make it clear statement that they want Ukraine to win with the goal of re-establishing Ukraine's pre 2014 boarders and just give Ukraine everything it needs and more to do the job. Ukraine has proven time and time again they are capable of using western equipment to it's fullest potential they simply lack the quantity. 30 pilots for the F-16 program? They should really have a long term goal of getting 200 plus guys trained up ready to full these things along with all the auxiliary craft (tankers, jammers, etc).

As for artillery the 155mm shells are dirt cheap (£600/$800 a shove),if we could build out our manufacturing across NATO to supply Ukraine with a million shells month that would be one of most inexpensive and cost effective ways of defeating Russia. Add western tanks and APC's to the mix it would reduce casualties when attacking.

As always our leaders have taken a half arsed approach to this resulting in needless deaths.
 
Freddie1980 said:
If that's what it takes then that's how it will take. It's up to the west and NATO as to how quickly Ukraine can drive out Russia, supplies have been drip feed for over 18 months which has given Russia the opportunity to dig in and mont a resistance.

NATO really needs to make it clear statement that they want Ukraine to win with the goal of re-establishing Ukraine's pre 2014 boarders and just give Ukraine everything it needs and more to do the job. Ukraine has proven time and time again they are capable of using western equipment to it's fullest potential they simply lack the quantity. 30 pilots for the F-16 program? They should really have a long term goal of getting 200 plus guys trained up ready to full these things along with all the auxiliary craft (tankers, jammers, etc).

As for artillery the 155mm shells are dirt cheap (£600/$800 a shove),if we could build out our manufacturing across NATO to supply Ukraine with a million shells month that would be one of most inexpensive and cost effective ways of defeating Russia. Add western tanks and APC's to the mix it would reduce casualties when attacking.

As always our leaders have taken a half arsed approach to this resulting in needless deaths.
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We wouldn’t be able to replace the amount of barrels needed to fire a million rounds a month, barrels need changing after a few 1000 rounds, all of the barrels would be burned out after a few weeks
 
Minusorange said:
This is an issue with their drip feeding supplies to Ukraine, trying to do it as cheaply as possible without realising that it may end up a long term drip feed which could end up costing way more than if they'd just gone big to send Russia home
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Politicians and the inability to look beyond an election cycle shocker.

It's truly baffling.
 
Whether it's true or not I don't know but you can see in the video there is artillery shells laying everywhere, so at the very least they were storing artillery shells at the same factory making military optics. But it's definitely possible part of the factory was converted to making shells for the war, maybe even the entire factory had stoped working on optics and switched over to shell production. Russia will never tell us the truth
 
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Consider if the US is to supply Ukraine with more mine clearing line charges, ATAMACS, more HIMARS and Patriots, more artillery shells, etc. and Ukraine breaks the Russian defenses and is about to enter Crimea. There are over 4 million people with Russian passports, speaking Russian language and with mostly Russian heritage in Crimea. Stealing Crimea was the biggest success of Putin during his 24 year reign and a key factor in Russian politics. Putin is not just going to just say whatever, take it - he's definitely going to put an ultimatum to Ukraine and US "Stop or I'll use the nukes". And that's a situation US doesn't want to be in, because who knows how Zelensky and Putin are going to behave, this stuff can escalate step by step (neither Putin nor Zelensky are known for their de-escalation skills) to a global nuclear war.

So (it looks to me) the US is giving Ukraine enough weapons to stop any Russian advances, but not enough to have a real shot at freeing the occupied territories. And this is going to be a long war unfortunately, with a lot more innocent civilians and soldiers dying. Hope I'm wrong and on 24th of August Ukraine starts a successful offense or next year the F16s arrive and change everything.
 
Russia have no active capability to make artillery shells? That’s got to be a huge blow for them. I’m surprised more of these facilities aren’t being targeted.
 
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