Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar
- Thread starter areksnumbr1sxylady
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Soldato
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Why have I just read a story from September last year?
Well to be fair, it was the fact that the Ukranians were not armed and that lot were that was more the deciding factor. Anyway, who are they? Probably ethnic pro-Russian 'militia' doing most of the dirty work currently. Saw a news report earlier showing how two were caught trying to cut water supplies inside one of the Ukranian army bases. Same paramilitary getup, same noncholant russian military whistling in the background...
Edit - here we go, these uniforms might seem familiar. The now disbanded Ukrainian Berkut special police responsible for a lot of the bloodshed in the protests. This lot are in Crimea, where theyre getting fast tracked russian passports apparently.
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Latvia and the old bloc have significant Russian speaking populations how long until they too want to go to Russia? Its a result of those old occupations where Russia put its stamp on the bloc by putting lots of russians in there in i presume an old colonial method? Its no different than most big movements of people like immigration when there are enough of them they will demand thier own country and they normally take the land as well so its a very slow methodical conquest sometimes. Just like in Ireland where England captured the North with Protestants, Russia has and will always have control over its old territory Ukraine through its Russian population.
It would be a good deal to just settle all these issues now rather than keep pushing at borders and moving people around like they are doing inside the EU. Just sell Putin the eastern bits where all the bloody Russians live and demand free gas for so many years through a treaty. And then you can talk about Crimea being leased to them for money so Ukrainians would join the EU with free gas and money coming in from the Crimea lease. At the minute they are neither in Russia or the EU and very poor and in a fight that even if they win Ukraine is going to be in poverty.
And that Uncle Sam does not give a toss about Ukraine they just want to see Russia lose its Black Sea port in Crimea. Personally i think thier bluffs have been called by Putin and Ukraine should take the money and put on the pet shop boys.
It would be a good deal to just settle all these issues now rather than keep pushing at borders and moving people around like they are doing inside the EU. Just sell Putin the eastern bits where all the bloody Russians live and demand free gas for so many years through a treaty. And then you can talk about Crimea being leased to them for money so Ukrainians would join the EU with free gas and money coming in from the Crimea lease. At the minute they are neither in Russia or the EU and very poor and in a fight that even if they win Ukraine is going to be in poverty.
And that Uncle Sam does not give a toss about Ukraine they just want to see Russia lose its Black Sea port in Crimea. Personally i think thier bluffs have been called by Putin and Ukraine should take the money and put on the pet shop boys.
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You've got to respect the fact that protagonists from all sides are keeping it real with the Balaclavas, in situ, I'm gona get one, sports direct have got some on offer.
Yup as Devlish said Russian Citizen militia with thier Russian trainer probably. Both sides probably knew it was coming the Russians have legendary spying capabilities and i bet they have been preparing for this for a year or more. Look at the posture of some of them they are not full time. This is why they can not take back the Crimea without a big civil war i know i grew up in this exact situation in NI where citizens and army can be a confusing mix. An off duty or retired man can easily become militia in a few days notice and an AK47 and half of those guys look like they just got out of bed.
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The difference between the US and Russia is the difference between South Korea and North Korea. Or the difference between West Germany and East Germany. Or the difference between Poland and Belarus. You are who your friends are.
The US has bases in Japan and Germany - they are flourishing democracies.
Russia has bases in Moldova and Ukraine - they are the worst developed countries in Europe.
Keep sprouting ignorant drivel tho.
or who you conquered?
Having foreign military bases does not magically bring democracy or prosperity. Once again you show your bias by cherry picking Germany and Japan, while completely ignoring US military bases in Bulgaria, Afghanistan, Djibouti and Cuba.
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Go ahead and cherry pick the flourishing countries where Russia has bases. Comparing the US with Russia is crazy, there's no debate about it, don't know what you people are smoking.
Also, in the case of South Korea (and others) the US bases are precisely the reason why that region of the world isn't part of North Korea.
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Caporegime
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Just look at east/west germany/Berlin
Once again you going for black and white logical fallacy, my point here is that Germany and Japans success has nothing to do with US military bases there. Mind you I did not include arabic countries that are quite a long way from democracy that have US military bases.
You said "you are who your friends are" and I believe I provided enough evidence that what you said is false as some of the US allies are far from democratic and far from prosperous.
Also since you've been using black and whit fallacy each time we interacted here educate yourself not to make the same mistake again.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma
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Even if the Ukrainians were armed, they couldn't win in that situation. These 'civilian protection groups' just appear to be goading them into being the ones who fire the first shots. If that happened the Russian's could deny accountability as they aren't Russian military, plus they'd then have all the reason they needed to protect the (obviously helpless and not at all heavily tooled up) ethnic Russians in the Crimea using military force.
I was talking about
after the poster above claimed they are the same, which, again is a crazy claim.
Where did I say the US was a saintly nation? Where did I say it does everything right?
I think you should start your own thread of logical fallacies since you're such a fan.
Sigh, after I linked you the wiki page you shoot off with black and white fallacy straight away. Nowhere did I say you imply US is a saint, nor did I claim that you said US does everything right.
What you did is present two cherry picked cases of well prosperous countries and linked their success to the existence of military bases there. I presented additional information that renders your point false. Nothing more, nothing less.
why would someone think to quote the two axis powers of ww2 and think the us has bases in their countries due to their sucessfulness and being allies?
the us forced bases in their countries after ww2.
http://usforeignpolicy.about.com/od/asia/a/The-United-States-And-Japan-After-World-War-Ii.htm
the us forced bases in their countries after ww2.
http://usforeignpolicy.about.com/od/asia/a/The-United-States-And-Japan-After-World-War-Ii.htm
it's really not.
any russian intervention in Ukraine would be no different to our intervention in Iraq or Afghanistan.
Same goal - not completely annexing the country, only ensuring that whichever party takes power is friendly to the party instigating the regime change.
Russia are no more wrong here than we were.
Unless we're talking about different ideologically - but that difference is the old east / west capitalist / socialist divide and nobody would claim they are the same in that respect.
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