Soldato
Yeah, Mercedes have been bullet-proof.
Vettel vs Alonso - Who Deserves it more?
- Thread starter smr
- Start date
Yeah, Mercedes have been bullet-proof.
So McLarens screw ups are worth over 100 points? How did you work that out? Don't forget that removing bad luck puts Vettel at least 25 points further up than he is now too, meaning Hamilton would be needing 5 race wins at events he actually scored zero at...
Yes they may count, I can't see Alonso having a poor run in the last two races though. The discussion can continue after the WDC has been established for this season as well.
Soldato
It's very easy to work out have a go
Off hand I can think of 3 races he would have won if Mclaren had not messed up.
It's very easy to work out have a go
Off hand I can think of 3 races he would have won if Mclaren had not messed up.
Yep, that's as far as I got too. Still 50 more points to find...
I think he was going by the James Allen article?
http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2012/...nd-the-title-slipped-away-for-lewis-hamilton/
http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2012/...nd-the-title-slipped-away-for-lewis-hamilton/
But as I said, you can't just remove bad luck from 1 driver. If you remove the bad luck from Alonso and Vettel too they would still be ahead.
Soldato
As an Alonso fan, I'll obviously say Alonso, he's shown his class in that Ferrari this year.
My next choice would be Hamilton, I dislike his celebrity ways and twitter stupidity, but when the McLaren has not been breaking down, he's been showing his worth.
Alonso and Hamilton are the best drivers on the grid.
My next choice would be Hamilton, I dislike his celebrity ways and twitter stupidity, but when the McLaren has not been breaking down, he's been showing his worth.
Alonso and Hamilton are the best drivers on the grid.
Their DNFs didn't gift Hamilton many points did they?
Where as Hamilton's gave a first and 2 seconds to title leaders. It's one thing to equalise the luck, but in the interest of accuracy the consideration should extend to the altered points distribution caused by the misfortune.
Then it does start to make your head spin, you lose interest in the pedantry of calculating how much the team has let Lewis down and take the season at face value, as a competitive and exciting one.
Back OnT, it's a close call but I think Alonso sneaks it. He has dragged that car beyond where it should be.
Soldato
It's one thing being unlucky it's another when the team can't see their own mistakes to put them right.
Quality control at Mclaren is getting worse. Roll on 2014.
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Associate
Hmm, im gonna say vettle. Alonso has done an exceptional job, but Seb just edges it.
Soldato
Alonso.
Seb's not been bad, but Seb has really gained masses of points in the last few races. Alonso has been on top throughout the whole season by putting a car above its place (on the whole).
Alonso's had a harder drive and is genearlly the better driver.
kd
Seb's not been bad, but Seb has really gained masses of points in the last few races. Alonso has been on top throughout the whole season by putting a car above its place (on the whole).
Alonso's had a harder drive and is genearlly the better driver.
kd
Heart says Hamilton, head says Alonso.
What Vettel is likely to achieve is undoubtedly brilliant, the third triple world champion at his age is outstanding regardless of what car he is in. I just struggle to reconcile with him and I can think I can honestly lay the blame for 95% of my dislike with his bloody finger.
I've never known such a simple gesture generate such a large amount of hate. Well, I can think of at least one more, but that harks back to the 1940s
What Vettel is likely to achieve is undoubtedly brilliant, the third triple world champion at his age is outstanding regardless of what car he is in. I just struggle to reconcile with him and I can think I can honestly lay the blame for 95% of my dislike with his bloody finger.
I've never known such a simple gesture generate such a large amount of hate. Well, I can think of at least one more, but that harks back to the 1940s
Caporegime
Good shout there. Kimi has been excellent this season in an unknown car.
Yeah its a head spinning thing that just becomes a predictive nightmare, but Vettels DNFs lost him a certain win in Valencia and a haul of points in Monza, so even a conservative guess is about 35 points. Alonso's are far less easy to guess at as they were at the start of the race. But given his performances they would both have been solid points finishes at least.
Its interesting that the reasons people are giving for why either Alonso or Vettel deserve it would be applicable to any driver on the grid, yet the choice is limited to just those 2. Your right, Kimi and Lotus have done a brilliantly consistent job of keeping their nose clean and just getting on with it.
Thats nice... you know that there isn't any rules about ride height compared to the track though, yes?
So you have proof this is adjustable ride height, and not just a skid block coming loose and scraping on the ground like everyone else in F1 seems to have agreed it was?
Also found this which althuugh the quotes are from 2010 does beg the question maybe they never removed it and simply hid the operating mechanism as Ferrari and iirc McLaren have again questioned RB's ride height during this season.
Another thought is maybe Newry has devised some sort of clever suspension that while totally mechanical and non driver adjustable alters itself depending on the weight of the car
Which would be brillantly clever. But as the car is closely scrutenised by the FIA at every race weekend, not to mention closely monitored by all other teams, so you are either suggesting that the FIA somehow 'miss' this device during scrutenering, or they are actively turning a blind eye to it, which is just conspiracy theory tastic.