Vote: Chelsea vs Liverpool

Keeper - Carragher
Defender - Carragher
Midfielder - Carragher
Striker - Carragher

All together now...We all dream of a team of carraghers...


now in all seriousnous, and im as red as they come, the chavski players edge it at the min although gerrard is better than lampard. fat frank scores goals in a goalscoring team worth millions, stevie scores goals in a team where goals are hard to come. Use fat frank in another system, or when the team is having a blip and he'll not be as productive as stevie. Fat frank can play in one position, stevie can play anywhere and give you a good performance....
 
dobbsy said:
now in all seriousnous, and im as red as they come, the chavski players edge it at the min although gerrard is better than lampard. fat frank scores goals in a goalscoring team worth millions, stevie scores goals in a team where goals are hard to come. Use fat frank in another system, or when the team is having a blip and he'll not be as productive as stevie. Fat frank can play in one position, stevie can play anywhere and give you a good performance....
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Claims like that cannot be proved however, so its a pointless arguing point.
And Gerrard rarely gives good performances anywhere outside of his prefered position...infact, he rarely seems to play to his rumored potential from what ive seen, for England & 'Pool, ive prehaps seen 1-2 games where ive thought he was almost worth the hype. With the remaining seeing talent being wasted and/or lazyness.
 
BoomAM said:
Claims like that cannot be proved however, so its a pointless arguing point.
And Gerrard rarely gives good performances anywhere outside of his prefered position...infact, he rarely seems to play to his rumored potential from what ive seen, for England & 'Pool, ive prehaps seen 1-2 games where ive thought he was almost worth the hype. With the remaining seeing talent being wasted and/or lazyness.
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right back, champions league final, against a fully fit and flying serginho need i say more? he's been playing right mid all season more or less, instrumental in creating and scoring as he's drifted.
 
The fact i can name one occasion is one more than the '0' times fatty has played in any other position. Versatility = complete player, having all the attributes to play anywhere. I can recall a time when we played stevie left back when stan stauntan went off injured....he was the best player on the park then too.

I'll say it again, more goals in a team that scores substantially less goals than chavski means gerrard>lampard.

A biast view my opinion is not...cech,terry,crespo are better but lampard is not. Anyone that doesn't think gerrard is better, simply doesn't understand football or is cockney - which is tantamount to the same thing.

Don't tell me you want to join the list of bitters mate?
 
dobbsy said:
Anyone that doesn't think gerrard is better, simply doesn't understand football or is cockney - which is tantamount to the same thing.

Don't tell me you want to join the list of bitters mate?
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So your views on football & its players are gospel? Anyone who disagrees doesnt understand football?
Sure mate. Sure. :rolleyes:
 
BoomAM said:
So your views on football & its players are gospel? Anyone who disagrees doesnt understand football?
Sure mate. Sure. :rolleyes:
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Tongue in cheek comments mate. Apologies. Never did i suggest my views were gospel, merely an opinion. Football is all about opinions afterall. I just don't think you have supported your opinion with any fact at all, and then criticised my point and stated that i've not presented any fact, when infact i think both my previous two posts give reasons.

This is an issue that seriously irritates me, as i attend almost every home game (bar work commitments), yet the majority of people i know who proclaim to be chelsea supporters whom suggest lampard is superior a) read too much into media coverage and b) are probably one of the 'easy easy' chanting supporter category who have no idea of history or tradition or anything for that matter about their respective clubs. Sick to death of the closet supporters who come out when a team wins a trophy. My view is that your die hard, knowledgeable football supporter would choose gerrard, simply for possessing every attribute of a complete footballer, versatility and more 'quality' which again in my opinion, lampard does not possess.
 
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Versatility does not = complete player.

For Chelsea Lampard will never have to play anywhere other than his position (his bolded as he's the best in the country there). He doesn't need to be Mr Versatility all he needs to do is his job, which just happens to be something nobody around is doing better.

I think Gerrard is a fantastic player, he's just not better than Lampard at what Lampard does.
 
dobbsy said:
when infact i think both my previous two posts give reasons.
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They give either subjective reasons or speculation. Not fact.

My view is that your die hard, knowledgeable football supporter would choose gerrard, simply for possessing every attribute of a complete footballer, versatility and more 'quality' which again in my opinion, lampard does not possess.
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Thats your view. And your view alone.
I am not a Chelsea, nor a Liverpool supporter. Nor do i support an English team. So i have the 'advantage' of being able to see past English club biasness.
Ive never said he was a bad player. All im simply saying, and has Gilly has explained quite well, is that Lampard, playing in his prefered position, is argueably the best in the world in that position. Gerrard isnt 'the best' in any area. Gerrards problem, is that for England, him and Lampard are basically competiting for the same position, and when it comes down to it, Lampard is better at doing that position.

Gerrard is a very versitile player. But if you want to be the best, you cant be. You have to choose a position and make that your own. Lampard has done that. Gerrard hasnt.
Look at Ronaldinho. Often refered to as the worlds best attacking player. He cant defend. He cant tackle. But he can go forward very well. Because he has chosen to make that role his own.
He is, essentially, half a midfieder because of it. But he is one of the best because he's taken his chosen position and excelled in it.
Versitility doesnt come into the equation if you want to be the best.
As the saying goes, jack of all trades, master of none...

Of course, thats just my opinion on the situation.
:)
 
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Gilly said:
Versatility does not = complete player.

For Chelsea Lampard will never have to play anywhere other than his position (his bolded as he's the best in the country there). He doesn't need to be Mr Versatility all he needs to do is his job, which just happens to be something nobody around is doing better.

I think Gerrard is a fantastic player, he's just not better than Lampard at what Lampard does.
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If Lampard is such a great player how come it has taken until Abramhovic has taken over for him to emerge, you don't think its not because he has now got Makelele covering him or Duff & Robben supplying the passes for him. Gerrard has been known as a "star" player when Liverpool have been playing well or badly. Do you really think people would be talking about Lampard if he was playing for Sunderland?
Lampard is a very good Attacking midfielder, he is not a complete player, he scores goals and is a good passer (nowhere near as good as people like Xabi Alonso or Xavi as shown in the England Spain friendly a year or so back). The reason why Lampard is not Mr Versatility isn't just because he does his job better than anybody in the Chelsea side (not in the world) but also because he can't play Right Wing, Right Back or a holding role in midfield where as Gerrard can play these posistions because he is a complete player. Gerrard can pass as well as anybody else in the world, he scores goals, he can tackle, he can run with the ball, he is physically a better athlete than most player (quick, strong and runs all day) and is as influencial as any other captain around.

Quick update

Robbie Fowler 3
Herman Crespo 46

Cech 45
Reina 3
Terry 1

John Terry 32
Jamie Carragher 17

Frank Lampard 19
Steven Gerrard 30

49 Votes in total
 
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England fans voted Lampard the national side's best player last year, 11% more votes than Gerrard & 13% more than Rooney.
He was voted 2nd in FIFA's World Player of the Year last year, behind Ronaldhino Every coach & captain of every national side votes.
He also won The Sportswriters' Footballer of the Year and was runner-up in the European Player of the Year in 2005.
Amazing how many Chelsea fans there are in high places:)
 
JohnnyG said:
England fans voted Lampard the national side's best player last year, 11% more votes than Gerrard & 13% more than Rooney.
He was voted 2nd in FIFA's World Player of the Year last year, behind Ronaldhino Every coach & captain of every national side votes.
He also won The Sportswriters' Footballer of the Year and was runner-up in the European Player of the Year in 2005.
Amazing how many Chelsea fans there are in high places:)
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Last year (of which Gerrard missed 3months with injury) he was more consistent than Gerrard im not debating that but Lampard is not a better player. Sven has stated that his 3 most important players are Gerrard, Rooney and Beckham. Gerrard is the player that all the big clubs have tried or wanted to sign (Juve, Milan, Real, CHELSEA, Man Utd and even Wenger said he would love to sign Gerrard) not Lampard; he occasionally get linked by the papers to Barcelona as he girlfriend is Spanish. As i have stated before, whenever a "expert" or ex-player has been asked who is better (not on form) between the two, i can't remember one saying Lampard. Only in the last month or so Alan Hansen was asked and he said Gerrard, there was a column in a paper where they asked Phil Thompson, Dalglish, Ray Wilkins, Brian Robson and David Platt who was the better of the two and Thompson and Dalglish said they could pick between them (proberly as if they said Gerrard they would have been accused as being biased) the other three said Gerrard was better.
 
Lampard is not a better player in your opinion, he is in the opinion of the majority of people who have voted in major individual honours, I doubt whether anyone votes on consistency too.
No-one has said they would like to sign Lampard because they know they can't, Gerrard was very close to leaving so every club expressed an interest obviously.
 
JohnnyG said:
Lampard is not a better player in your opinion, he is in the opinion of the majority of people who have voted in major individual honours, I doubt whether anyone votes on consistency too.
No-one has said they would like to sign Lampard because they know they can't, Gerrard was very close to leaving so every club expressed an interest obviously.
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Those votes were on last years performance's firstly (otherwise Pele is the best player in the World still). Secondly don't pay too much attention to Fifa's rankings, is Diouf one of the top 100 living players when you consider who wasn't put in there (Gerrard, Lampard, Keane, Rush and the list goes on). Fifa and Uefa are the same people with different titles, so i don't understand how Kaka was named the best midfielder by Uefa (ahead of Gerrard and Lampard) but wasn't considered for World Player of the year. All these votes go on reputation thats why Gerrard was name most Valuable player in Europe because he has a bigger name than say Carragher (who was Liverpool's best player last year, so why wasn't he nominated). Basically what im saying is that "Last Year" Lampard was better than Gerrard but he is not a better player in my opinion.
As for being linked with other clubs, your right that a lot of clubs stated they would like to sign Gerrard as there was a possibility of him leaving but as Alex Ferguson said there was no chance of Gerrard joining them but he would have loved to sign him, there was also no chance of Lampard joining them but he didnt mention him (he also stated last season that Gerrard had taken over Keane and Viera as the best midfielder in the Premier League).
 
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Fergie said he would have loved Gerrard to sign because he was probably going to be available albeit unlikely that he would join them, if Lamps was probably going to be available Fergie would want him & I bet every other manager would too so that's no gauge of anything.
I'm not paying attention to FIFA's rankings, never mentioned them.
What I am going on is the amount of people in the game who consider Lamps to be better than Gerrard.
You're entitled to your opinion but I'd say that you're in the minority, not in here because of bias, but in reality:)
 
Theres really no point going round and round you'll never settle, if we base it on the vote in this thread Gerrard is better, if we base on a vote somewhere else Lampard is better, rinse repeat.

End of the day its all opinion anyway.
 
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