When are you going fully electric?

[Jonnycoupe]

I wouldn't be surprised to see the next version of NEDC/WLTP type testing include some sort of test for cold weather and warm weather performance if EVs stick around, so as to generate a warm and cold range figure - even if said figures are only really indicative like MPG figures are these days

EPA does a 2 or 5 cycle, most cars only do 2 and get a 0.7 factor to the mileage - if you do 5 cycle thanks the appropriate heat management it shows better real world use - one of these cycles is a -7C startup. We have just done it on IPACE which takes the EPA from 234 to 246 miles.

Tesla for years had managed to claim a default 0.77 hence there US EPA numbers were very good on the EPA label.

Back to the point:
The problem with the 250 miles versus 150 miles is that its described as if its the issue for a trip, reality its the combined effect of lots of smaller journeys - each one having to bring battery and cabin up significantly from the colder ambient temperature. Its like boiling a kettle 4 times for a cup of tea.

I also really enjoy not having to go to the petrol station to fill up.

Remains for home charging the biggest win and more than cancels out any public charging stops.

 

[Journey]

If they can fix the cold weather / winter range issues then I'd be a lot more keen. I'm about 2-3 years out from changing cars so here's hoping.

How are you imaging that will be possible in 2-3 years, if at all ever?

Or do you not understand why the range is reduced in colder weather to start with?

 

[Simon]

How are you imaging that will be possible in 2-3 years, if at all ever?

Or do you not understand why the range is reduced in colder weather to start with?

Don’t need to understand why. Just live with the consequence. Which for me turns a 3h trip into 3.5h and about £10 of food just cause it’s cold.

Also you can’t look at it from your Ev geek eyes if you expect EV to go mainstream.

 

[Simon]

I would quite happily get an EV but there isn’t a car out yet that I would be happy with. My E63S for me is the complete package and would like a similar sized/spec saloon which isn’t hideous (thinking EQE/EQS). Would like the idea of driving around in silence but would miss the sound of a v8 as it’s quite an emotional experience

The cost advantage of EV has massively eroded now. So don’t rush.

 

[dlockers]

How are you imaging that will be possible in 2-3 years, if at all ever?

Or do you not understand why the range is reduced in colder weather to start with?

Don’t need to understand why. Just live with the consequence. Which for me turns a 3h trip into 3.5h and about £10 of food just cause it’s cold.

Also you can’t look at it from your Ev geek eyes if you expect EV to go mainstream.

^^

This... it is irrelevant why it happens. Consumers will vote with their wallets unless forced by government (at a level acceptable that doesn't instigate a coup!).

 

[Simon]

I'd lump that in with range issues. It wasn't that long ago people were debating the merits of AC or no-AC and at what speed it became more economical to open windows etc.

I also really enjoy not having to go to the petrol station to fill up.

I’d rather go to a petrol station in than any public charger ! By the time I’ve even started charging my ICE tank would be full.

4500miles of EV miles in 4months

 

[chanjy]

Education and transparency are probably key.

Punters buy a 250 mile car and then are upset when it only does 180 miles in winter, I'd be annoyed too

Bigger batteries (as the costs come down) and clear labelling on range will help

 

[Simon]

Education and transparency are probably key.

Punters buy a 250 mile car and then are upset when it only does 180 miles in winter, I'd be annoyed too

Bigger batteries (as the costs come down) and clear labelling on range will help

No one bought an ICE on range ever. It was never ever quoted as a purchase decision point. Mpg maybe but tbh range isn’t an issue when refilling is so fast. Mpg was the factor which was easy to work out pence per mile

 

[Simon]

Education and transparency are probably key.

Punters buy a 250 mile car and then are upset when it only does 180 miles in winter, I'd be annoyed too

Bigger batteries (as the costs come down) and clear labelling on range will help

Bigger batteries still need to fit in the car. And why add hundreds of kilos with no other benefit than to just to add a few miles more range. You impact efficiency and make an even bigger carbon debt when the car is built.

 

[Uther]

Don’t need to understand why. Just live with the consequence. Which for me turns a 3h trip into 3.5h and about £10 of food just cause it’s cold.

Also you can’t look at it from your Ev geek eyes if you expect EV to go mainstream.

100% this.

 

[dlockers]

I’d rather go to a petrol station in than any public charger ! By the time I’ve even started charging my ICE tank would be full.

4500miles of EV miles in 4months

Yeah for sure - but for my use case where granny charging is adequate, it is much more convenient than going to a petrol station.

 

[Uther]

Education and transparency are probably key.

Punters buy a 250 mile car and then are upset when it only does 180 miles in winter, I'd be annoyed too

Bigger batteries (as the costs come down) and clear labelling on range will help

One of my very regular trips is 110 miles each way, mainly motorway driving. I don't stop on the way there, there is nowhere to charge at the destination, and I don't stop on the way back.
I actually thought a 250 mile EV could do that in all weather at all times of year, but apparently not. My current ICE can do that trip twice on one tank.
As said above, we are moving away from early adopter EV geekdom, and supposedly into mainstream use.

 

[Journey]

Education and transparency are probably key.

Punters buy a 250 mile car and then are upset when it only does 180 miles in winter, I'd be annoyed too

Bigger batteries (as the costs come down) and clear labelling on range will help

Agree with education, people are lazy about education of every day things, and people tend to believe what they read or are told by marketing but most people 'just know' that you'll never get a quoted MPG figure as an example, since that is how it has always been yet they don't get upset about that it is just accepted. Perhaps it will just take time for people to accept that ranges differ based on various factors, and that is something them might want to consider if they are not willing to spend some time charging the car after various trip types or in certain weather conditions.

Bigger batteries aren't something I'd think is the option, mainly faster charging and in more places. That will take time, but some people want everything now, so for them a BEV isn't an option it is that simple, I am sure they'll keep complaining that they can't buy one as it doesn't suit their needs though, which is weird in itself.

 

[sandys]

Electrified vehicles are generally flawed, I think most people understand that now, that they are beta testers for the cars and the infrastructure and you just need to be the type to either accept that or buy ICE.

For me I will always have an ICE as I enjoy the act of driving and currently EVs don't do it for me, most are too heavy and offer a disconnected driving experience, for our family truck though an EV would be perfect once the beta testers have fixed all the half arsed stuff.

 

[Sinbad2000]

One of my very regular trips is 110 miles each way, mainly motorway driving. I don't stop on the way there, there is nowhere to charge at the destination, and I don't stop on the way back.
I actually thought a 250 mile EV could do that in all weather at all times of year, but apparently not. My current ICE can do that trip twice on one tank.
As said above, we are moving away from early adopter EV geekdom, and supposedly into mainstream use.

Arguably, your use case isn't necessarily a mainstream use case

 

[Uther]

Arguably, your use case isn't necessarily a mainstream use case

Yeah, seems to be a lot of us around...

 

[dlockers]

Yeah I have a semi-regular 110 mile commute which I can't do in the PUG.

Which is good because technically my company pays ZERO pence per mile versus 45 pence per mile for petrol.

 

[Simon]

Arguably, your use case isn't necessarily a mainstream use case

True. People who are driving too busy to post in forums, whilst other think everyone else should have EV cause it works for them

 

[b0rn2sk8]

One of my very regular trips is 110 miles each way, mainly motorway driving. I don't stop on the way there, there is nowhere to charge at the destination, and I don't stop on the way back.
I actually thought a 250 mile EV could do that in all weather at all times of year, but apparently not. My current ICE can do that trip twice on one tank.
As said above, we are moving away from early adopter EV geekdom, and supposedly into mainstream use.

To be fair, I think even my ‘306’ mile standard (short) range model 3 would struggle with that on a really bad winters day, in summer it would be fine. That said, it would only need an hour on a 7kw charger at the destination or 2-3 mins on a decent rapid charger to make it back.

It wouldn’t be an issue in a Long range though or anything with an equivalent WLTP figure.

I’ve always said slow AC destination charging is the key and it always will be.

 

[Wizzkidy]

I have had little problems with my M3P to be fair. I travel to Great Yarmouth here and there for work, that's 110miles one way from here, if I charge to 100% I get back with 20% battery. Charging is the issue really, it take a bit too long even on a 150KW charger, and there is only 2 of those close to me at a BP garage and as of now its expensive!

I have a home charger as well which is convenient and cheaper.

During the cold snap charging was poor on the quick chargers, normally 20 minutes turned into 1 hour, and pre conditioning the car is a bit of a pain and you need to remember to do it.

The car itself is great, the drive is great and so easy and relaxing. It's all about charging, make that easier and better and then its a win from me.