Why are you not vegan....

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chicken burgers are actually a really good example of decent replacement of meat. if like me you like plenty of salad, some cheese and mayo or nandosish hot sauce then to be honest you would struggle to tell the difference between them and meat. the problem then just comes down to cost. I often pick up quorn chicken burgers when they are on offer, it is just they are a bit pricey when not reduced.
 
LiE said:
Looks ok to me.
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I think thats someone who hasnt even read the ingredients and instantly taken a dislike because its vegan.

Water, wheat protein (9.8%), rapeseed oil, maize, wheat flour (wheat flour, calcium carbonate, iron, niacin, thiamin), wheat flour, wheat gluten, wheat starch, soya protein isolate (1.6%), salt, spices (contains mustard), flavouring (contains soya), garlic powder, onion powder, thickener (methylcellulose), pea starch, pea fibre, yeast extract, sugar, potato starch, dextrose, barley malt extract, herbs, celery, leek powder.

Compared to the crap you see in other products this is fine.
 
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omnomnom said:
I think thats someone who hasnt even read the ingredients and instantly taken a dislike because its vegan.

Water, wheat protein (9.8%), rapeseed oil, maize, wheat flour (wheat flour, calcium carbonate, iron, niacin, thiamin), wheat flour, wheat gluten, wheat starch, soya protein isolate (1.6%), salt, spices (contains mustard), flavouring (contains soya), garlic powder, onion powder, thickener (methylcellulose), pea starch, pea fibre, yeast extract, sugar, potato starch, dextrose, barley malt extract, herbs, celery, leek powder.

Compared to the crap you see in other products this is fine.
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Yep.

For comparison this is a southern fried chicken breast.

INGREDIENTS: Chicken (59%), Water, Wheat Flour [Wheat Flour, Calcium Carbonate, Iron, Niacin, Thiamin], Rapeseed Oil, Wheat Starch, Semolina (Wheat), Pea Fibre, Cornflour, Wheat Gluten, Rice Flour, Red Lentils, Salt, Black Pepper, Onion Powder, Fennel, Garlic Powder, Dextrose, Yeast Extract, White Pepper, Yeast, Sugar, Black Pepper Extract, Cayenne Pepper, Maltodextrin, Flavourings, Paprika Extract, Sunflower Oil, Colour (Paprika Extract), Caramelised Sugar, Coconut Fat, Potato Starch, Nutmeg Extract, Maize Starch, Garlic Oil, Onion Oil.
 
LiE said:
Yep.

For comparison this is a southern fried chicken breast.

INGREDIENTS: Chicken (59%), Water, Wheat Flour [Wheat Flour, Calcium Carbonate, Iron, Niacin, Thiamin], Rapeseed Oil, Wheat Starch, Semolina (Wheat), Pea Fibre, Cornflour, Wheat Gluten, Rice Flour, Red Lentils, Salt, Black Pepper, Onion Powder, Fennel, Garlic Powder, Dextrose, Yeast Extract, White Pepper, Yeast, Sugar, Black Pepper Extract, Cayenne Pepper, Maltodextrin, Flavourings, Paprika Extract, Sunflower Oil, Colour (Paprika Extract), Caramelised Sugar, Coconut Fat, Potato Starch, Nutmeg Extract, Maize Starch, Garlic Oil, Onion Oil.
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Asda smart price nuggets have 45% chicken but hey celery...HERBS?! How dare they.
 
Raymond Lin said:
Are there any vegans here who has been at it for more than 12 months, who eat simple 3 meals a day with no supplements? I mean zero.

No shakes, no pills, no injections.

Not even blending stuff in a blender to "top up" as a way to get more nutrients easily, besides making a vegan milkshake to go with your vegan burger or something.
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A colleague at my mum's last workplace has been vegan for 30 years. In the early days, she had to buy her milk and other dairy free things from health food shops. She gets colds all the time.. Some of the cause could be down to damp in her home. Streetview shows her house with rotten window frames and vegetation growing in the chimney.
 
Droolinggimp said:
To be fair, I think he was on about the purposely produced food stuff for Vegans, like Mince, burgers etc, not food that is non meat. I have tried many Vegan substitutes of popular meats and other dishes (worked in a restaurant) and they were all very bland. Not nice at all.
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I think the underlying problem is that a non-meat substitute for meat is just that - a substitute, one thing being passed off as something else. It's never going to be as good as the real thing. I've also tried a few and they varied from crap to maybe barely adequate and I don't expect any to be any better than that. The word that comes to my mind is "ersatz", which is perhaps me showing my age. In particular, Camp "coffee". Which started as ersatz in WW2, IIRC. It's made from chicory and it's absolutely not coffee.

But vegan food that isn't pretending to be meat can be very good eating.


EDIT: I was wrong about Camp. Not about what it is - a horrible ersatz "coffee" - but about when it was first made. Also, it has some coffee in it. 4%. So it's not completely fake. But it certainly isn't coffee.
 
1) Health - We have eaten meat for 2.6 million years - as a result we have been fundamentally shaped by meat in our diet. Despite the less educated/more propaganda based vegan press, we struggle to live healthy by ripping out 2.6m years of biological adaptation. It's not massive disaster, but we are just less healthy.

2) Enjoyment - we have likewise evolved unique pleasure centres for the taste of meat and I therefore enjoy meat

3) Animal Cognition - we fundamentally misunderstand animal cognition and grossly anthropomorphize them. They fundamentally can't think the same way we do.

4) Vegan substitute food is generally low quality and hyperprocessed

5) Nature is brutal - animals live brutal, short lives in the natural world. As indeed humans did until extremely recently. The best advice for vegans is to look at nature before they criticise farmers.

Eg watch the whole of this:
youtu.be

Half an Impala Tries Escaping Hyena

Impalas might be common in the Kruger Park, but they are true fighters! This isn’t our first video of an impala fighting back with half its body hanging out....
youtu.be youtu.be

Then ask yourself, does this animal look like it's suffering like a human would be if this happened? Does this look wildly better than instant death with a bolt gun?

A degree is neuroscience is a brilliant way to remove all these doubts!
 
katie279 said:
1) Health - We have eaten meat for 2.6 million years - as a result we have been fundamentally shaped by meat in our diet. Despite the less educated/more propaganda based vegan press, we struggle to live healthy by ripping out 2.6m years of biological adaptation. It's not massive disaster, but we are just less healthy.

2) Enjoyment - we have likewise evolved unique pleasure centres for the taste of meat and I therefore enjoy meat

3) Animal Cognition - we fundamentally misunderstand animal cognition and grossly anthropomorphize them. They fundamentally can't think the same way we do.

4) Vegan substitute food is generally low quality and hyperprocessed

5) Nature is brutal - animals live brutal, short lives in the natural world. As indeed humans did until extremely recently. The best advice for vegans is to look at nature before they criticise farmers.

Eg watch the whole of this:
youtu.be

Half an Impala Tries Escaping Hyena

Impalas might be common in the Kruger Park, but they are true fighters! This isn’t our first video of an impala fighting back with half its body hanging out....
youtu.be youtu.be

Then ask yourself, does this animal look like it's suffering like a human would be if this happened? Does this look wildly better than instant death with a bolt gun?

A degree is neuroscience is a brilliant way to remove all these doubts!
Click to expand...

You definitely went to college
 
katie279 said:
1) Health - We have eaten meat for 2.6 million years - as a result we have been fundamentally shaped by meat in our diet. Despite the less educated/more propaganda based vegan press, we struggle to live healthy by ripping out 2.6m years of biological adaptation. It's not massive disaster, but we are just less healthy.

2) Enjoyment - we have likewise evolved unique pleasure centres for the taste of meat and I therefore enjoy meat

3) Animal Cognition - we fundamentally misunderstand animal cognition and grossly anthropomorphize them. They fundamentally can't think the same way we do.

4) Vegan substitute food is generally low quality and hyperprocessed

5) Nature is brutal - animals live brutal, short lives in the natural world. As indeed humans did until extremely recently. The best advice for vegans is to look at nature before they criticise farmers.

Eg watch the whole of this:
youtu.be

Half an Impala Tries Escaping Hyena

Impalas might be common in the Kruger Park, but they are true fighters! This isn’t our first video of an impala fighting back with half its body hanging out....
youtu.be youtu.be

Then ask yourself, does this animal look like it's suffering like a human would be if this happened? Does this look wildly better than instant death with a bolt gun?

A degree is neuroscience is a brilliant way to remove all these doubts!
Click to expand...
You are a sick person for posting that vid and fairly stupid if you think that animal didnt suffer. Everything else you said was just as bad.
 
Which is my point exactly - this is literally a video of the natural world that you consider 'sick', scenes like this are happening billions of times a year all around the world - so it begs the question of what exactly are you seeking? Some unnatural state that has never existed? Should we delude ourselves from the reality of nature? Just get out into nature and face reality!

Regarding my stupidity - please read my post again and avoid interjecting silly statements that I never said - I literally said the opposite of what you said and yet this has eluded your base understanding - I literally said nature is 'brutal' twice and still this has diffused across your limited frontal lobe....

My point, as perhaps your post is demonstrating, that neuroscientifically brains are very different in their ability to comprehend and the concept of pain is hugely complex from nociception to cognition. There is not an animal on the planet that experiences pain in anything like the way we do - so anyone doing so is much like a child who treats their teddy as a living thing, it may be comforting, but it's not true...

So you can claim what you wish, just don't kid yourself that the intellectual and scientific world is with you....
 
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