***World of Warcraft : Warlords of Draenor***

Blizzard made WoW far to easy and far to accessible in the hope they can ring it dry of every penny possible. I remember when guilds were important and raiding as a guild was important. Guild raiding encouraged a sense of togetherness to overcome a common goal. Friendships were formed and it helped nurture a strong social side to the game, not only within a guild but over a entire realm. The difference in the way the player base behaves from Vanilla to now is just staggering and its mostly down to the direction Blizzard has taken the game. LFR, Dungeon finder, cross realm quest hubs, ignoring the fact that some realms are just dead and being unwilling to allow people to transfer off them for free because of the 'man wanting his coin'. I never understood why they forced daily quests back down people throats for rep? Why could rep be earned while running dungeons and raids while wearing a certain factions tabard like the old days? What was wrong with that? Logging on everyday to do 40 daily quests, I would rather earn half the rep and go have a giggle messing around in the dungeons.

I dunno, maybe I have grown out of it or maybe I have grown bitter because of what it has become. Clearly a lot of people still enjoy playing it but I cant see for the life of me why anymore. I honestly think it needs to die flat on its face so that we see some innovation in the genre because at the moment theres not a lot going on. I think I said something similar to this when the expansion was announced and got some smart arsed reply along the lines of 'kthxbai'. That in itself sums up 80% of the current WoW player base for me, keep paying your subs and sucking it up fan boy.
 
I think all above points are valid but are you looking to deep into it.

If they hadnt changed it to take lesser people and **** who stand in stuff or added LFR/Flexi etc would the game be dead now.

When i 1st started playing it was hard, you had to learn to play, now its face roll but wasnt Mage face roll 111211112111123 etc etc etc

I have been playing for 7 years now i think and got bored with cata cause the content was crap.

I liked MOP and still enjoy it but i am doing the whole semi hardcore HC modes but on a casual basis if that makes sense 3 times a week for 3 hours but i still log everyday practically and do a 30mins farming, maybe an hour but some days i wont log at all

I come and go as i please and have banter/fun/arguements etc etc in the 10 man Hc group we run in SoO

I think the game is what you make it, i find some things frustrating, i have chars with all professions yet only my LW/BS/Cloth maker can make anything worth making, why cant an Engineer make 553 Heads still, why cant my Inscripter make 553 Trinkets or even my alchemist make a Epic Stone and update it but i understand with WOD this will change.

I still enjoy and will still play and could play maybe to a higher standard but am happy with what i am doing etc so it suits me

Is there another game out there like it ?
 
Ralph_ENG said:
If they hadnt changed it to take lesser people and **** who stand in stuff or added LFR/Flexi etc would the game be dead now.
?
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or would they still have 12 mill +?

Edit: The easier the game has become the more subs have gone down, it could be argued that subs would have gone down as it doesnt attract new players at the same rate as previous due to game like LoL etc but I guess we'll never know.

I dont think the game was 'hard' back then either, I just think the time sinks were more fun.

Double edit - 9+ hours raiding isnt casual :p
 
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Ralph_ENG said:
If they hadnt changed it to take lesser people and **** who stand in stuff or added LFR/Flexi etc would the game be dead now.
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I disagree, I think it would be about the same but with a different player base.

WoW only became hand holdingly linear because the great unwashed brainless masses whinged that it was too hard. And thanks to Blizzard picking up some very unwanted habits from the kings of money over substance, Activision, they started to pander to those types of people.

The reason the game subscriber base has dropped is because those people in vanilla who played it for the challenge and worked to overcome the lack of hand holding have left.

Blizzard should have said to the whingers "Try harder" rather than dumb the game down for them. They'd make the same amount of money and the game wouldn't be full of the little cluster****s.
 
Tute said:
I disagree, I think it would be about the same but with a different player base.

WoW only became hand holdingly linear because the great unwashed brainless masses whinged that it was too hard. And thanks to Blizzard picking up some very unwanted habits from the kings of money over substance, Activision, they started to pander to those types of people.

The reason the game subscriber base has dropped is because those people in vanilla who played it for the challenge and worked to overcome the lack of hand holding have left.

Blizzard should have said to the whingers "Try harder" rather than dumb the game down for them. They'd make the same amount of money and the game wouldn't be full of the little cluster****s.
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+1000

I still prefer the pre-lfr days. should have just left it at LFD imo. Unless you are on a super busy realm, most cities are dead, miss seeing people trying to organize runs. And what ever happened to GDKP runs, they were awesome
 
The problem I found with the Pre LFR days was that unless you had the achievement saying you had completed the raid once then 99/100 you got rejected and the other 1 was full of retards that could not find their arse with a map. It got to the point where you could download a MOD that would fake the achievement for you. All well and good if you are on your main, but on an ALT you are screwed. Then after that you got people shouting for groups where the Ilvl was excessively high for the content you were about to do.

Its all well and good saying Its catering to the casual by implementing LFR but lets look at it this way. You have 5 servers with loads of people shouting they want to do raids yet not enough randoms to actually do it. Either the server populations just do not allow for it or the active raiding guilds on the server are full and are not recruiting (happened a lot) You now have this growing player base that is becoming stagnant and will leave due to having limited things to do besides run the same dungeons or roll an alt. Introduce the LFR system and you now give those smaller groups who cannot get into a raiding guild and are sick of standing in lagaran shouting for a group the chance to get a group with minimal effort. The LFR system has helped substantially in maintaining those players while still allowing others to go shout or join a raiding guild.

You say there is no need for guilds to raid yet I frequently see people in Ilvl 550+ which is standard raids and heroics. The problem is not the ease with which everyone can now raid but the ease with which they give away items and how easy the content is. Timeless Isle saw me in nearly complete epic gear within 2 days. It was just pathetic, I did not have to work for it at all and to top it all off, I have done every raid as a tank up to the first wing of Siege without looking up a single tactic and winging it the entire way... that should not be possible at all.
 
I do hear what everyone is saying but also wasnt that what HC modes where introduced for? keep the hard corers happy, keep the guilds happy??

I also agree with Woogie i am a healer who quite frankly hasnt even really read tactics of Hc bosses but Winged most of it and after a few wipes you get the general gist or get told by the RL that i should have done this that and then not when i did it etc. In the same breath you dont learn a fight unless you wipe a few times anyway

Its a fine line keeping everyone happy but wasnt subs tailing off towards the end of WofLK and then it got changed and stablised? Correct me if i am wrong i dont really look into the whole how many subs etc i just enjoy and play the game how i want.
 
Subs tail off and then come back with new expansions. Its not what people like so they leave again but then its what others like so they stay. Can never please everyone but in trying to do so they are upsetting more people.

WOTLK was the golden point of raiding imo but its also where things started to go wrong. BC raids were tough and you had a major sense of achievement when you completed them yet you needed so much time to prep and get ready that it became a burden and a chore to raid. WOTLK balanced this quite nicely with less need for grinding and more accessible content that you still had to do stuff to earn your rewards... Then came Ice Crown Citadel and with it the new heroics and the quest line for an epic sword/axe..... OK it was a easy to obtain epic but the rest was still a challenge... until the stacking HP/DPS/HPS buff that was introduced just after the final wing was released. Here was where it all started to go wrong in terms of making life easier for the gamer.

I like LFR, I like Guild raiding, I like Flex. I dislike giving items away and instead of telling the player base to try harder, making it easier for them.
 
Ralph_ENG said:
I do hear what everyone is saying but also wasnt that what HC modes where introduced for? keep the hard corers happy, keep the guilds happy??

I also agree with Woogie i am a healer who quite frankly hasnt even really read tactics of Hc bosses but Winged most of it and after a few wipes you get the general gist or get told by the RL that i should have done this that and then not when i did it etc. In the same breath you dont learn a fight unless you wipe a few times anyway

Its a fine line keeping everyone happy but wasnt subs tailing off towards the end of WofLK and then it got changed and stablised? Correct me if i am wrong i dont really look into the whole how many subs etc i just enjoy and play the game how i want.
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I believe the subs trailed off towards the end of WotLK due to stagnation of nothing to do for months on end once people had done ICC & RS rather than the state of the game making people happy/unhappy. But as you rightly say, numbers shouldn't influence how you play the game.
 
Thought id bump this as the Panda thread is being used for WoD talk

New healing looks interesting

I have always said early raid tiers are harder until your mana regen gets to a level when you dont need to worry about it.

Not sure ill be paying £40 for Char Boost, takes about a week or so to get to 90 now anyway if you do it properly
 
I don't agree with the boosting at all - I also read that it looks like Blizzard are going to be charging $60 for a L90 boost, what's the difference between them and the botters now?

To be fair, charging for anything after taking £9 a month is an utter joke regardless. Either paid subscription or microtransactions - not both, greedy ****s.

I've never paid for anything on WoW apart from the subscription and games themselves and I think that anyone who has is an utter mug. You're just encouraging this crap.

[Edit] Yep, £40 for a L90 boost.
 
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Tute said:
I don't agree with the boosting at all - I also read that it looks like Blizzard are going to be charging $60 for a L90 boost, what's the difference between them and the botters now?

To be fair, charging for anything after taking £9 a month is an utter joke regardless. Either paid subscription or microtransactions - not both, greedy ****s.

I've never paid for anything on WoW apart from the subscription and games themselves and I think that anyone who has is an utter mug. You're just encouraging this crap.

[Edit] Yep, £40 for a L90 boost.
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Agreed, unfortuantely their cash shop does fantastic numbers. And well microtransactions are the way forward for MMO's, its just if you have the balls to have a sub on top!
 
I could accept the mounts and pets but this crap makes me want to walk away at the end of MOP. I utterly despise pay2win games, and all they stand for.

Regardless, if I get WOD I won't be using the boost. If I do level something i'll be doing it the old fashioned way.
 
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