*** The 2012 Gym Rats Thread ***

[LiE]

If one can leg press with no knee pain, one can probably squat with no knee pain. Squat form is easier to get wrong, because it's more technical. Obviously nothing technical about a leg press, so less room for mistakes.

Syla5, your progress has been great. You really aren't going to make strides in strength progress when you're not training for it. It really shouldn't bother you how much you lift when your training for aesthetics.

 

[Cat_In_Pyjamas]

Evening all. This is going to be a bit lengthy so please bear with me.

Backstory: I was (am?) what one could refer to as a dweeb. Avoided exercise beyond walking to work and occasionally unloading pallets of food during deliveries (more on this in a bit) and stayed in front of my pc all afternoon wasting time for no good reason. A few years ago I had a go at joining the gym. Lasted about 2 months then lost all motivation and reverted to my old ways. At the age of 28 I was 1.82 m tall weighing anything between 80 and 85 kg (depending on how stressful the week was for me - I'm a comfort eater), size 32 waist with no biceps to speak of, and around 17% b.f.
This September I decided I've had enough of my old life style and signed up at the gym again. This time, I went with a specific programme, recommended to me by a friend: the 5x5 strength training regime.

The regime: consists of two different days of training alternating Monday, Wednesday and Friday.
Day 1: Squat 5x5; Bent over Row 5x5; Bench Press 5x5
Day 2: Squat 5x5; Shoulder Press 5x5; Deadlift 1x5

All these excercises started at 20 kg each, then on each session this was to be increased by 2.5 kg except deadlift which was to go up by 5 kg each new session.

Each day, the first two of these excercises are preceded by a warm up that consists of 3 reps starting at 20 kg below the target weight for the day increasing by 5 kg until I hit the target (making it a 4x3 warm up set). Last excercise is done without a warm up.

The progress so far: I am at a weird situation right now. When I first joined my gym, I didn't have access to the power rack, and the weights available were: 10/15/20/25/30/35 kg which was going against the 2.5 kg increment plan and got me to a capped weight for some exercises rather fast.
A few weeks into my regime I went away for a 3 week holiday where I had no access to the gym (but plenty of cake to go on...). Even before that however I noticed a rather worrying pattern: the upper body exercises (with the exception of the bent over row) were causing me more trouble than lower body ones.
Back from holiday; the gym opened up a new section giving me access to heavier weights, olympic bars and most importantly the power rack.

Due to a miscalculation of the weight of one of the bars (assumed it to be a 10 kg when in fact it weighs 15 kg) again I started hitting plateaus on the shoulder press and bench press due to not going up according to the plan but jumping to weights my arms/chest were not ready for. That said, as of last session the weights I completed sets on were:
squat: 5x5 57.5 kg
bent over row: 5x5 37.5 kg
chest press: 5x5 30 kg
shoulder press: 5x5 27.5 kg
deadlift: 5*x5 65 kg

*I did this as my legs were nowhere near as tired after squats as the exercise guide said they would. At higher weights I may drop to 1x5 as suggested if I find I really can't cope.

Figuring I'd need more of the core muscle support for the deadlifts, squats and rows at some point I started doing some core exersises after all the 5x5 sets are done. This includes abdominal crunch with a cross punch (2x20 at the moment), leg lifts (2x20) and the plank.
At the same time, getting annoyed at lower strength in the arms I added 5x5 bicep curl and 5x5 preacher curl to day one and 5x5 barbel triceps extension and 5x5 bent over dumbbell triceps extension to day two. This change was done this week.

So that's the exercise. Now for the daily plan:

Wake up half 3 am; showered and dressed by 4; between 4 and half 4 I drink some water; get my backpack ready (if it's a workout day I get the clothes and shakers ready) - any remaining time (which there usually isn't much of) I check emails/facebook then set off to work.
This takes me about half an hour of walking (don't do it anymore); 10 minutes of slow cycling (+another 5-7 minutes to fiddle with chains etc; currently not doing it as the bike's wheel is off centre and I can never be bothered to fix it) or 10-15 minutes of jogging (time variance depends on weather; regardless of which I jog). The last of the 3 options is the means of travel I've been choosing past few weeks.
Work starts at 5 and towards 7 I have to put away goods from delivery which I suppose counts as a minor exercise of its own but I don't treat it as such. Half 7 I get a breakfast break which includes a portion of porridge with a dollop of honey - 307 kcal and 1/4 l of water (sometimes an apple as well if I'm peckish).
By 11 o'clock I get an early lunch which almost always consists of a chicken/red pepper/onion/spinach/cucumber/cucumber yoghurt dressing wrap - 288 kcal (sometimes replaced by an avocado/basil/tomato/parmesan/spinach/cucumber/pine nuts/yoghurt dressing wrap - 458 kcal); a honey/granola/shredded apple/pistachio/pomegranate/dried cranberry/yoghurt pot - 304 kcal (sometimes replaced by a single piece of fruit); and around 0.75 litre of water.
Work finishes usually half 1 after which I relax for a bit then 30 minutes before hitting the gym (any time between half 2 and 3) I have a portion of mixed nuts and a strength building protein shake mixed with carrot juice (or a berry smoothie if the former isn't available) - 60 kcal + protein powder . During work out I consume around 2-3 litres of water.
Post work out (anywhere between an hour and 90 minutes) I have another shake (this one is meant to burn fat as well as build muscle if the labels are to be trusted) based on skimmed milk -178 kcal.
After that things sort of go uncontrolled. I'll either have another quick protein fix in form of a chicken wrap if I feel really hungry or simply go shopping for dinner ingredients. This results in me getting home anywhere between 5 and 6.
If I choose to cook dinner it either consists of chicken breast (prepared depending on what I feel like cooking that day); 4 potatoes and a salad (sometimes served with sauce/ sometimes not); or a thin beef steak served with 4 potatoes a mushroom sauce and a salad. This I end up eating around 7 ish.
If I don't cook, I'll usually just eat whatever I bought on the go (usually a sandwich). Which has me having my last big meal around 6 ish.
After that I have an evening snack of either a portion of pineapple or grapefruit.
Bed time is anywhere between 9 and 10. (resulting in 5-6 hours of sleep)

Now for the crux of the problem - I'm worried that my upper body isn't developing at the pace it should. I feel like my diet has a fair bit to do with it (at the same time I fear that if I start eating loads more I'll just put on inches around my waist as I'm not sure just how effective the routine is at burning up calories). On the positive side my waist size appears to have gone down (going by how much I have to tighten the belt, haven't done actual measurements); I don't feel like I'm about to hit a cap on lower body/back exercises yet; I feel more energised and I can jog all the way to work without losing breath whether I'm running against the wind (Mancunians will testify to how strong it can get) or on a calm day (which I wouldn't dream of before).

So there we go - accounting for all that's said above; what sort of adjustments would you guys suggest I do in order to achieve the following: body weight lowered to 70-75 kg range; body fat lowered by say 3-4% (not sure how realistic this is); and improved muscle strength.

EDIT: Also as a disclaimer - progress of exercises involving me pushing something up with my wrists are temporarily hampered by a minor case of RSI on my right wrist. I use anti-inflammatory gels that lower the pain and it's not as impeding as it used to be, but it's still there and will be until I get put on physio (only God and NHS know when that's gonna happen).

 

[LiE]

I assume you don't track calories? That would be my first recommendation, especially as losing weights require control over the amount of calories you eat.

Olympic bars are 20kg standard, unless they are the ones with plastic ends. 5x5 is fine for building strength on the compounds, but I would hit 10-12 reps for isolation exercises to induce growth (which will be hard on a calorie deficit).

 

[Cat_In_Pyjamas]

I assume you don't track calories? That would be my first recommendation, especially as losing weights require control over the amount of calories you eat.

Olympic bars are 20kg standard, unless they are the ones with plastic ends. 5x5 is fine for building strength on the compounds, but I would hit 10-12 reps for isolation exercises to induce growth (which will be hard on a calorie deficit).

Tracking calories pre dinner is much easier than what I make for dinner (I'll add them to my main post in a sec). Also the 15 kg bar I was referring to wasn't the olympic bar that I use for squats and deadlifts but the shorter barbel bar that I use for all the other barbel exercises.
Isolation exercises being the curls and extensions that I added this week I assume. Would that be 5x10 or 3x10?

 

[King Damager]

Ok, so, first thing. Ditch the scales. Go by how you look in the mirror, not by how much you weigh. Get some photos for reference.

That diet definitely needs more structure. The basic theory behind it doesn't sound too bad, but the 'might grab a sandwich or wrap' at various points worries me slightly. You'll need to be stricter with your diet really. Read Steedies diet thread (it's in the sticky of links at the top of the forum), also, I'd put it all into a spreadsheet and actually calculate it. Work out your macros!

I'd say try and switch to three days a week in the gym if you can. I'm not quite sure what 5x5 program you're looking at, but it sounds very similar to strong lifts, but strong lifts is a three day plan, with some additional arm exercises most days, and minimal warm up weight lifting, but is designed for beginners.

Final thing.
Get more sleep. Your body relies on sleep to recover, and your progress will be hampered by not getting enough sleep!

kd

 

[Cat_In_Pyjamas]

It is 3 days a week. Didn't word it properly perhaps but the workout spread over 2 weeks is D1 off D2 off D1 off off D2 off D1 off D2 off off. Rinse repeat. Biggest problem with getting more sleep is the time I consume my dinner at. If I don't cook it's a non-issue (but then it consists of processed food), but when I do cook (4 days out of 7) it doesn't leave my body enough time to digest everything I've eaten.

 

[King Damager]

Ah ok, makes more sense then

Yeah I understand it, as I'm doing it myself atm.

Sleep though is still key. If you get up at 3 and work finishes around half 1, couldn't you shift your hours to what people would normally do in a day starting at 3 instead of 7?

kd

 

[Cat_In_Pyjamas]

Well you had my breakdown of the day. I don't have much space to work on unless I run around everywhere like a goon in order to get to the gym asap after work (I already do, but more often than not I need that half an hour to wind down after my shift some of which extend into a 2 - half 2 finish), then get the shopping asap (again, I do that straight after the gym) and then get home asap to cook dinner (biggest time loss here - my other half won't approach the oven for fear of burning water let alone anything more complex; so I have to cook on my own).

 

[Begbie]

You shop everyday?

 

[Cat_In_Pyjamas]

You shop everyday?

Pretty much yes - mainly for veg/fruit as I like them fresh and my storage space is limited, but then every now and again other necessities pop up. I buy meat in bulk from the butchers then freeze it. Looking at it now, perhaps I'd benefit from making a cooking plan for the week on my off days and getting the non-perishable ingredients then, and only popping in fast for the few fresh ones I'll need on the days I cook.

 

[Ultra_Extreme]

Pretty much yes - mainly for veg/fruit as I like them fresh and my storage space is limited, but then every now and again other necessities pop up. I buy meat in bulk from the butchers then freeze it. Looking at it now, perhaps I'd benefit from making a cooking plan for the week on my off days and getting the non-perishable ingredients then, and only popping in fast for the few fresh ones I'll need on the days I cook.

Its generally good to plan, especially in the first few years of training where you will unconsciously make mistakes.

Just want to put it out there that im down with an awful cold at the moment, cant breathe too good, terrible headache, joints all ache, its a real effort just to move. I havent missed a single training session, set of deads tonight 5x8 160,170,180,200,215 threw up on sets 4 and 5 as the headache got really bad.

So next time its raining, you know, or cold, go to the sodding gym!

 

[Skillmister]

Its generally good to plan, especially in the first few years of training where you will unconsciously make mistakes.

Just want to put it out there that im down with an awful cold at the moment, cant breathe too good, terrible headache, joints all ache, its a real effort just to move. I havent missed a single training session, set of deads tonight 5x8 160,170,180,200,215 threw up on sets 4 and 5 as the headache got really bad.

So next time its raining, you know, or cold, go to the sodding gym!

Walking to the gym in torrential rain today was highly motivating.

 

[Ultra_Extreme]

Walking to the gym in torrential rain today was highly motivating.

Bosh! Its what men do!

 

[Delvis]

All things weighed up though, I'd appreciate someone's support instead of zero replies. I was rustled when he gave out bad advice (you don't any more Delvis <3), but even then he was still trying to help. It would be a shame if people thought they could be supportive (even if it isn't the most productive support!) and so didn't post.

Not having a go at you either mate, just feel like bro-ing out with the bros.

Well, I try not to give bad advice anyway, still learning mind. <3

And I dont understand why we have gone in this direction with this conversation. All I was asking for was advice etc... and we ended up arguing.

No ones arguing, I was just being a douche and caused some confliction, don't worry about it

'Lifestyle choice' that sounds so pretentious...

Maybe, but I can bet you more people who have made a lifestyle change with regards to their food have stuck to it more than people who have 'gone on a diet'.

Just to clear up a couple of points, delvis <3 keep doing what your doing, I appreciate your input, sometimes you still don't think before you type, but your getting better, and this is defiantly something everyone suffers from, myself included.

I blame work entirely to be honest

------------------

Anyway, gym tonight went well, 3x8x90kg, nearly failed rep 8 on set 3.

Pleased though.

Video in my log

 

[semi-pro waster]

IOk, I'll stick up a food diary, in the next few days.

All I'm saying is that I expect to see this diary, not just because it'll be good for you and allow people to help more but principally because I'm relying on you not to be selfish and deny the rest of us the pleasure of seeing Ultra_Extreme eat a hat*.

I'm hoping the hat is a deerstalker but a straw boater might be a bit more palatable, either way I'm wondering how it'll fit with the macros.





*n.b. if you fail in keeping the diary properly then I'm still expecting to see posts detailing your imaginary food intake - don't ruin this for everyone else...

 

[Morba]

Better session tonite.

Deadlifts:
Warm up
110x10
160x8
160x3
Straps on. Earlier than normal, bar was freezing and grip felt ****
180x5
180x3
200x3
Belt on
220x2
240x1

1 hour gone. 25 mins left before I had to leave. Hmm what else can we do....

Stone shouldering!
85kg atlas stone, no tacky
Just the 2 of us so go 1 for 1 (him then me then him etc)
1 left
1 right
1 left
1 right
Did this 6 times so 3 each side
Left and right 1 for 1
1 left and right
Did this 5 times
Faster now:
1 for 1
4 time (2 each shoulder)
5 mins left, let's go: 1 each shoulder again, no break. When the other person has done his two you go straight away:
6 x left and right.
20 mins of stone shouldering!
God damn, huffing and puffing after this, great finisher lol

Much happier with this session

 

[Volcs]

I've had a weird loss of strength in my right arm the past couple of sessions in the gym - really noticeable on OHP but also did bench yesterday and it just felt incredibly weak. No pain, no impinged movement, no pins and needles that would imply a trapped nerve somewhere - it's just being lame. Anyone had anything like this before?

Excuse the self quote...little bit better training today but still far from normal. My googling turns up that this could be nerve issues even though I have no pain - bit of a worry. Will rest up for a week, see if there's any improvement and if not will book myself in for a referral.

 

[Morba]

Wonder if there might be some tightness somewhere. Icecold might be able to recommend a few things in the mobility thread, post in there and see what comes up

 

[tom_nieto]

My bread had gone mouldy this morning so was forced to buy lunch rather than make it today. Incredible what a difference having a crap Ginsters sandwich compared to something made at home makes in the gym. Perhaps I had a harder day at work, but I'm blaming the lunch.

Managed to add 2.5kg to squat and deads but it felt much more hard fought than last week!

 

[Ultra_Extreme]

Excuse the self quote...little bit better training today but still far from normal. My googling turns up that this could be nerve issues even though I have no pain - bit of a worry. Will rest up for a week, see if there's any improvement and if not will book myself in for a referral.

Possible nerve occlusion, when i was ill with coeliac neuropathy (which manifests neurologically) i had symptoms akin to that and nerve occlusion was high on the list, was sent to a neurologist who cleared me after some scans, worth talking to a doc if it persists, could be anything from stress related psychosis to a brain tumour. Not that i say it often, but best see a GP.