Aero/Gains Thread
- Thread starter xdcx
- Start date
Soldato
- Joined
- 25 Nov 2009
- Posts
- 5,356
I hadn't thought of it like that, makes sense though and I am logging the changes I have made.
21:38 last night off 324w. That is 5.35w/kg so I am now into the convinced realms that I am as aero as a lorry.... 
Dowsett done a mid week 10 short 19, here is his data so you'll see why I am getting frustrated at the watts I am doing and it not bagging me serious times -
Dowsett done a mid week 10 short 19, here is his data so you'll see why I am getting frustrated at the watts I am doing and it not bagging me serious times -
21:38
last night off 324w. That is 5.35w/kg so I am now into the convinced realms that I am as aero as a lorry....
Dowsett done a mid week 10 short 19, here is his data so you'll see why I am getting frustrated at the watts I am doing and it not bagging me serious times -
Ouch, not even a lumpy course, going by those times and vague guestimations with the guys down here I'd say they'd be doing 19:20-30 on that course when they're hitting sub 19s on our local 10 that Tom PBed on the other week, where I've run a 21:02, 21:08 at 270W, your aero is nae good
What is your full bike spec, everything down to tyres? I think you may have some rolling/drivetrain losses that could be improved with some choice changes.
I'm aiming to get lower next week and get my extensions under my base bar, think I've got enough flexibility and no events for a while so will give me time to adapt.
Ouch, not even a lumpy course, going by those times and vague guestimations with the guys down here I'd say they'd be doing 19:20-30 on that course when they're hitting sub 19s on our local 10 that Tom PBed on the other week, where I've run a 21:02, 21:08 at 270W, your aero is nae good
What is your full bike spec, everything down to tyres? I think you may have some rolling/drivetrain losses that could be improved with some choice changes.
My gear is ****. Let's not beat about the bush here:
Cube Aerium C:62 framset - Mech Ultegra everything.
Profile Design Svet R base with T4+ carbon extensions.
FFWD F4R tubs running Vittoria Corsa CX3 23mm.
Cheapest ImpSport club skinsuit.
Kask Bambino Pro 2016 model (first ride with it last night, just got this to replace my 2014 non pro Bambino).
Velotoze.
@SoliD you are obviously more aero than me, but compare pictures here, they say if it looks aero then it is but I LOOK more aero than you frontal wise surely????
https://www.instagram.com/p/BTlTE8nFC0o/
EDIT - Quick screw around with the data in Aerolab and CDA = 0.2315
I know that ain't exactly accurate but I reckon CDA quite simply could be as bad as that!
Also, plug it to the Aeroweenie calculator thing:
Last edited:
Haha, end of the day it's all about small differences making big time
Some suggestions:
You'd see big gains by using a tripsuit, that is probably best bang for buck upgrade.
Few other things, single larger chainring and dumping the front mech, getting rid of your QR skewers and getting the allen key ones, TriRig front brake are potential avenues of exploration.
Also how is your power measured? Vectors, it may be that you're losing some time through your drivetrain, maybe good clean up all round.
Some suggestions:
You'd see big gains by using a tripsuit, that is probably best bang for buck upgrade.
Few other things, single larger chainring and dumping the front mech, getting rid of your QR skewers and getting the allen key ones, TriRig front brake are potential avenues of exploration.
Also how is your power measured? Vectors, it may be that you're losing some time through your drivetrain, maybe good clean up all round.
Forgive my inexperience but on a particularly flat course, perhaps with some wind too, is it not the absolute power that will deliver the fastest time rather than relative power? (CDA & pacing being equal between two riders)
I'm just curious how much, if any of, the difference xdcx is seeing is due to relative power as there is a 100w~ between them based on AD's NP.
I'm just curious how much, if any of, the difference xdcx is seeing is due to relative power as there is a 100w~ between them based on AD's NP.
Thanks buddy.
Power is measured from Vectors yeah. Drivetrain was seriously immaculate last night, the TT bike is slaved over cleanliness wise!
Xav posted some info on the TT forum recently stating that the Trip Socks (full calf things now illegal in Scottish events) are the best saving, but Velotoze are actually faster than the Trip Overshoes (these ARE allowed in Scotland as they don't go right up to the knee). I think from memory it was 7w vs 9w in favour of Velotoze over Trip Overshoes.
TripSuit I totally agree. It would be £280 and I could get them to do my club colours as I have investigated it.
Tyres are good option I think to start for the money it would cost as I am massively limited now on spending. Like I very much doubt I can get the TripSuit and will need make do. Tyres are possible.
I am getting a loan of a FFWD rear disc potentially which is running a Conti Grand Prix TT but is a clincher. I don't see the rear disc making any massive gains at all but better tyre choice on front might see me something.
The T4+ extensions can't simply be swapped round to get more degree's as they are shaped and wider up top for hands. Would need ot be a extension change completely which is another avenue I was investigating. Fancying the D2Z 40 degree's possibly, but again, money
Soldato
For the national 25?
You can use my FFWD disc if you want? It's a tub and I think it's got a vittoria corsa on it.
You're a lej. I will WhatsApp you, would be much better sticking tub/carbon brake pads!
Yes pretty much, I just used Dowsetts example to put a guesstimation of my sort of times/power to that course. I've no doubt xdcx would beat me on a 10 down here, but I don't think it'd be by much. I reckon the tripsuit and socks saved me 30s straight off the bat.
Soldato
Hopefully will also be entering the national 25.
With regard to low hanging speed fruit, as has been already mentioned tyres and latex tubes will make a big difference. Corsa speed tyres from Vittoria are fast.
Helmet may also be worth looking at. Realistically frame differences are going to be pretty small.
With regard to low hanging speed fruit, as has been already mentioned tyres and latex tubes will make a big difference. Corsa speed tyres from Vittoria are fast.
Helmet may also be worth looking at. Realistically frame differences are going to be pretty small.
Soldato
Think you misread, I believe fastest to slowest was Trip Socks + Velotoze, Trip Overshoes and Velotoze. Trip Overshoes just 2w worse than the socks and don't look ****!
Soldato
Also, looking at that course I don't think you can be that un aero. On a properly fast DC course I think you'd be knocking on the door of long 19s. Especially if you start using better wheels/disc and fast tyres.
Last edited:
Soldato
Joint second today with a 19:57 at Bentley. Happy with that considering conditions and it not being the fastest course. My best result to date in terms of placing at TTs.
Soldato
Cheers, yes I can just about handle a 10 there. Won't be doing another 25 there though.
Had my first effort at a local 10 mile TT course last night, something I've been long overdue trying before possibly trying the 'real thing'! 
https://www.strava.com/activities/1000645979 28:09 @21.4mph avg.
Smashed the 30 minute goal I'd set myself coming in just over 28 minutes, really pleased with that as I wasn't rested (rode sunday), wasn't fuelled (was before dinner & after work) and wasn't that prepared (vents 90% closed on my KASK Infinity was about the only aero kit!). Strong headwind from the West-South/West made the draggy return leg super slow, it's an old 10TT course that's hardly ridden any more with quite an undulating profile and heavy/rough & broken roads in places. Rode 99% of it in the drops dipping my head as much as possible, wasn't as uncomfortable as I thought but damn it aches this morning!
First half has some great gradual downhill and with the parts of tailwind I was pretty quick (25.8mph & 259W). I was conscious about saving as much as possible for the return leg, yet also wanting to make up as much time as possible, putting a little more effort into the slight climbs than I probably should've (350W+) to carry my speed. The kicker into Credenhill was memorable because I paced it really well, remaining seated and in the drops just cranking it (and not stamping it!), pretty much reaching my limit as I crested. The rougher roads after that to the turnaround point (and back) I know quite well as they're my commute. I've done them faster but not as consistently quickly, very close to my limit at this point but going well! Ever so slightly pedal scuffed the 180 roundabout turn (and the end was sharper than I expected) so backed off a little too much there.
The 5 mile return headwind & uphill slog was a different story! Slightly down on power as I was trying to hold 280-350W on the uphill sections and riding the flatter at 240W(ish) to recover. There's a slight drag past the Brinsop turn and I thought I'd blown struggling to carry any speed! I was very close to calling it then and heading home! Thankfully I got some shelter from hedgerows just afterwards and somehow recovered. The end part of this leg is brutal, rough roads at the base of an uphill drag (so it's hard to carry speed), then a section of new tarmac (to makes you realise how slow you're going) before things ramp up slightly to the drag at the top. I was blowing hard and probably paced it terribly, literally holding cadence to try and stay on top of the gear and hanging on! I eased up a little sooner than I should've belatedly remembering the segment ended a little after the start point over the crest. This end section was one of the hardest times I've had on the bike outside, literally emptying/turning myself inside out!
TLDR; Hard. Brutal. Sadistically enjoyed it & will do again!
https://www.strava.com/activities/1000645979 28:09 @21.4mph avg.
Smashed the 30 minute goal I'd set myself coming in just over 28 minutes, really pleased with that as I wasn't rested (rode sunday), wasn't fuelled (was before dinner & after work) and wasn't that prepared (vents 90% closed on my KASK Infinity was about the only aero kit!). Strong headwind from the West-South/West made the draggy return leg super slow, it's an old 10TT course that's hardly ridden any more with quite an undulating profile and heavy/rough & broken roads in places. Rode 99% of it in the drops dipping my head as much as possible, wasn't as uncomfortable as I thought but damn it aches this morning!
First half has some great gradual downhill and with the parts of tailwind I was pretty quick (25.8mph & 259W). I was conscious about saving as much as possible for the return leg, yet also wanting to make up as much time as possible, putting a little more effort into the slight climbs than I probably should've (350W+) to carry my speed. The kicker into Credenhill was memorable because I paced it really well, remaining seated and in the drops just cranking it (and not stamping it!), pretty much reaching my limit as I crested. The rougher roads after that to the turnaround point (and back) I know quite well as they're my commute. I've done them faster but not as consistently quickly, very close to my limit at this point but going well! Ever so slightly pedal scuffed the 180 roundabout turn (and the end was sharper than I expected) so backed off a little too much there.
The 5 mile return headwind & uphill slog was a different story! Slightly down on power as I was trying to hold 280-350W on the uphill sections and riding the flatter at 240W(ish) to recover. There's a slight drag past the Brinsop turn and I thought I'd blown struggling to carry any speed! I was very close to calling it then and heading home! Thankfully I got some shelter from hedgerows just afterwards and somehow recovered. The end part of this leg is brutal, rough roads at the base of an uphill drag (so it's hard to carry speed), then a section of new tarmac (to makes you realise how slow you're going) before things ramp up slightly to the drag at the top. I was blowing hard and probably paced it terribly, literally holding cadence to try and stay on top of the gear and hanging on! I eased up a little sooner than I should've belatedly remembering the segment ended a little after the start point over the crest. This end section was one of the hardest times I've had on the bike outside, literally emptying/turning myself inside out!
TLDR; Hard. Brutal. Sadistically enjoyed it & will do again!
Last edited:
Soldato
As a completely unscientific comparison, my last TT was almost exactly the same avg power as you and I was almost 4 mins faster using my TT bike:
https://www.strava.com/activities/933702826/analysis
https://www.strava.com/activities/933702826/analysis
Was that on your TT bike with lots of aero kit? Good comparison though, any notable 'climbs' on yours & how were the wind conditions? You're 3mph avg faster!
The long drag back is what killed my average (25.8mph out & 18.5mph back). Am I realistic to hope for a 22/23mph avg on a flat course?
The ride out I was 1.5 minutes faster than my previous PR (group social ride). The ride back I was 45s slower than my PR. A guy with the same time leg out did the TT (back in 2013) in 27:42 so that should be around the time I'd expect without the winds on that course (only around 30s quicker)?