AMD RDNA3 unveiling event

Calin Banc · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:10

Curlyriff said:
People always say that and it's never worked before when they have so I can't imagine they will bother doing that any more.

On the other hand, if they keep it up like this, they could soon close shop.

Nexus18 · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:14

Calin Banc said:
On the other hand, if they keep it up like this, they could soon close shop.

With amds marketshare in the dgpu space now, it wouldn't be a terrible idea for them tbh but I think rDNA 3 could do quite well this time.

Calin Banc · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:14

kieran_read said:
But i don't really get the argument. Stuff naturally increases in price overtime.

I paid £750 for a 1080ti in 2018 on OCUK. The 7900XTX is a £999 card 3 generations later for the class equivalent only being £250 more isn't too bad considering the absolute mess our economy is. AMDs card is $100 less than their top tier 6950XT from last gen at $1099.

For me to get a new graphics card in the same class 6 years later, skipping 2 generations entirely alongside, brexit, covid, war, energy crisis, economic crisis and the worst cost of living crisis since records began, for it to ONLY be £250-£300 more expensive all things considered is pretty damn impressive.

You can always see it the other way around: IHV should be happy someone is paying over the top for their expensive cards considering the state of the world.

kieran_read · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:15

Calin Banc said:
On the other hand, if they keep it up like this, they could soon close shop.

Not really their CPU division is a huge success, and they are probably still profitable in the GPU division or they wouldn't keep doing it.

Mr Evil · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:20

Gibbo said:
...As always with AMD whatever the performance is today, you can be sure that in 6 months time it will probably gain 15-25% more performance from updates as well.

Probably, but it would be foolish to make a buying decision based on something that may or may not happen at some point in the future. nVidia are quite capable of making improvements too, so the relative performance could change in any direction.

kieran_read · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:20

Calin Banc said:
You can always see it the other way around: IHV should be happy someone is paying over the top for their expensive cards considering the state of the world.

This is very true, in comparison the prices of the AMD cards are at least reasonable i would say in regards to the state fo the world and how the value of currencies/inflation has changed over the years, it's far closer to that lock step than Nvidia is that's for sure.
The problem you have is that wages havn't increase inline with that inflation, so while the products themselves are inline with what should be expected, people have less of that disposable income to actually buy them.

That could drive the prices down a little, but it would mean companies making less profit, and of course their shareholders are more important than their customers.

Really what it boils down to is if you have a 3000 series GPU than the value of this new generation is exceptionally bad, but if you have an older CPU like myself then the value is far far better.

Hopefully this means going forward people wont jump into the deep end each generation from now on. Will help lower demand and prices!

Joxeon · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:30

Curlyriff said:
But the point is it doesn't matter to AMD, they have lower prices, Nvidia respond and people still buy Nvidia even if they are stil hundreds more. It really would have just meant the same people whom was buying AMD already was just going to be buying cheaper not that they would suddenly see a 10-15% market share increase and greater sales and this has been shown for the last decade even when it has previously made sense with same argument.

As a regular Nvidia customer I was all set to buy a 7800XT for £700 but I'm not paying £900 for one.

Curlyriff · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:30

Calin Banc said:
On the other hand, if they keep it up like this, they could soon close shop.

Yeah okay then....

Curlyriff · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:33

Joxeon said:
As a regular Nvidia customer I was all set to buy a 7800XT for £700 but I'm not paying £900 for one.

Okay but you I am assuming not buying a 4060ti for £999 or a 4070 for £1179 either as the other option?

I'm not saying AMD pricing is good or even okay to push the 6800xt to a 7900xt is mental but if you ignore the extra x and see the 7900xtx as the 6900xt replacement which is still what it is give you the performance uplift of about 60% for the same price which is similar to Nvida previous generations too such as 700, 900, 1000 series it's just prices are mental high still.

kieran_read · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:36

Curlyriff said:
Okay but you I am assuming not buying a 4060ti for £999 or a 4070 for £1179 either as the other option?

I'm not saying AMD pricing is good or even okay to push the 6800xt to a 7900xt is mental but if you ignore the extra x and see the 7900xtx as the 6900xt replacement which is still what it is give you the performance uplift of about 60% for the same price which is similar to Nvida previous generations too such as 700, 900, 1000 series it's just prices are mental high still.

This is always the problem with AMD they make good products, driver issues are a thing of the past no worse than Nvidia (as a current Nvidia user) but people always will ONLY buy AMD if they have the EXACT same performance or better but they have to be half the price of Nvidia.

It's crazy they just can't win.
I'm hoping the 7000 series is a AMD awakening like Ryzen was.

Alt0153 · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:45

kieran_read said:
This is always the problem with AMD they make good products, driver issues are a thing of the past no worse than Nvidia (as a current Nvidia user) but people always will ONLY buy AMD if they have the EXACT same performance or better but they have to be half the price of Nvidia.

It's crazy they just can't win.
I'm hoping the 7000 series is a AMD awakening like Ryzen was.

its probably going to be within spitting distance of a 4080 for maybe £100 cheaper

Joxeon · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:47

Curlyriff said:
Okay but you I am assuming not buying a 4060ti for £999 or a 4070 for £1179 either as the other option?

I'm not saying AMD pricing is good or even okay to push the 6800xt to a 7900xt is mental but if you ignore the extra x and see the 7900xtx as the 6900xt replacement which is still what it is give you the performance uplift of about 60% for the same price which is similar to Nvida previous generations too such as 700, 900, 1000 series it's just prices are mental high still.

Nvidia's pricing is terrible so I'll be ignoring all their cards but AMD are not going to win me over either by doing the same just to a lesser degree.

If AMD want to win market share then they need to do more to convince people like me to part with their cash.

Curlyriff · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:53

Joxeon said:
Nvidia's pricing is terrible so I'll be ignoring all their cards but AMD are not going to win me over either by doing the same just to a lesser degree.

If AMD want to win market share then they need to do more to convince people like me to part with their cash.

Okay bur the 7900xtx is actually priced at the right point to the 6900xt (being the differemc eis the exchange rate difference).

It is the 7900xt (7800xt) that's £150-£200 too much. And it's fine to not buy either but previous couple of gens from AMD were priced better for their performance to price side and yet made zero difference to sales, its pretty much always been same too. They have tried to win market share by being significantly cheaper for same or similar performance and it made zero difference to them in terms of market share.

Giving their cards away compared to Nvidia this gen seems it generally wouldn't of been enough. It isn't going to get any better the next generation which is the frustration. Nvidia might correct by 10% or so but it isn't going back to what we'd all like back to 2010 prices or prior for the generation pricing.

Curlyriff · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:55

Alt0153 said:
its probably going to be within spitting distance of a 4080 for maybe £100 cheaper

You mean compared to the 4070 10GB yeah? The 4080 is around £270 more than the 7900xt even at the higher prices discussed prior to the £ to $.

kieran_read · 8 Dec 2022 at 18:59

Alt0153 said:
its probably going to be within spitting distance of a 4080 for maybe £100 cheaper

Right but for Nvidia fans that's not cheap enough it needs to be £400 cheaper, that's the issue.

Besides from what Gibbo was saying the 7900XT should be faster than the 4080 so the XTX will easily be, and both are cheaper (should be)

vapor matt · 8 Dec 2022 at 19:07

The only way AMD will increase market share is if they can beat Nvidia's offerings by 15 to 20% in performance. and be cheaper as well. AMD have not held the performance crown for so long now, Nvidia hold all the cards. but having had 3 x 3090 cards I still pref my 6900xt cards. If AMD do release a 7950XTX
Nvidia will be releasing the 4090ti to make sure they retain the performance crown. RDNA-4 will be the game changer i hope. but a 7900xtx will be the way i go. dual 8 pin and not a huge 4 slot card.

Calin Banc · 8 Dec 2022 at 19:25

Nexus18 said:
With amds marketshare in the dgpu space now, it wouldn't be a terrible idea for them tbh but I think rDNA 3 could do quite well this time.

They still sell a lot of cards. Look from q1 2019 and to q4 2021 (to not take the height of previous crypto buble and to account for about 2 years/gen), there are about 129.24 million cards. Even with 10% market share overall and those are almost 13million cards. Even if they've spend $1 billion on R&D (as that seems to be the new theme in justifying high prices), that's like $76 / card (WITHOUT including professional cards where margins are even higher). Peanuts. Image how many $ nvidia makes out of that 115 +/- million units.

kieran_read said:
Not really their CPU division is a huge success, and they are probably still profitable in the GPU division or they wouldn't keep doing it.

They keep it as I suspect Microsoft and Sony also pays for R&D, plus can also offer custom solutions to customers like the Steam Deck.

kieran_read said:
This is very true, in comparison the prices of the AMD cards are at least reasonable i would say in regards to the state fo the world and how the value of currencies/inflation has changed over the years, it's far closer to that lock step than Nvidia is that's for sure.
The problem you have is that wages havn't increase inline with that inflation, so while the products themselves are inline with what should be expected, people have less of that disposable income to actually buy them.

That could drive the prices down a little, but it would mean companies making less profit, and of course their shareholders are more important than their customers.

Really what it boils down to is if you have a 3000 series GPU than the value of this new generation is exceptionally bad, but if you have an older CPU like myself then the value is far far better.

Hopefully this means going forward people wont jump into the deep end each generation from now on. Will help lower demand and prices!

From around 2013 until now inflation was around 27.93%.
$500 in 2013 are now around $640.

Back then AMD launch the r290 (AMD 2nd most powerful card) for $399. That would be $510 now, not $899.
$648 was the gtx 780 3gb version back in 2013. 3080 was $699 in 2020 ($50 jump in 7 years!). 4080 16gb (actually a 4070 class card) is $1199 ($500 or 72% increase in 2 years! - more if you consider is truly a lower tier card :cry:

).
Inflation has little to do with it as you can compensate a lot through technology and innovation.

Not the least, I agree, people wages haven't increase in line with this crazy world pricing. Will be interesting to see how many will spew crazy money on overpriced hardware.

Grim5 · 8 Dec 2022 at 19:41

What the heck is wave?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1600309445447520256

"RDNA 3 can't dual issue FMAs in Wave32, so a lot of applications predictably don't see any increases vs RDNA 2 on a per WGP and per clock basis"

Grim5 · 8 Dec 2022 at 19:48

kieran_read · 8 Dec 2022 at 19:59

Calin Banc said:
They still sell a lot of cards. Look from q1 2019 and to q4 2021 (to not take the height of previous crypto buble and to account for about 2 years/gen), there are about 129.24 million cards. Even with 10% market share overall and those are almost 13million cards. Even if they've spend $1 billion on R&D (as that seems to be the new theme in justifying high prices), that's like $76 / card (WITHOUT including professional cards where margins are even higher). Peanuts. Image how many $ nvidia makes out of that 115 +/- million units.

They keep it as I suspect Microsoft and Sony also pays for R&D, plus can also offer custom solutions to customers like the Steam Deck.

From around 2013 until now inflation was around 27.93%.
$500 in 2013 are now around $640.

Back then AMD launch the r290 (AMD 2nd most powerful card) for $399. That would be $510 now, not $899.
$648 was the gtx 780 3gb version back in 2013. 3080 was $699 in 2020 ($50 jump in 7 years!). 4080 16gb (actually a 4070 class card) is $1199 ($500 or 72% increase in 2 years! - more if you consider is truly a lower tier card ).
Inflation has little to do with it as you can compensate a lot through technology and innovation.

Not the least, I agree, people wages haven't increase in line with this crazy world pricing. Will be interesting to see how many will spew crazy money on overpriced hardware.

Right but those MSRPS are also false.

The 1080ti MRSP was $699 it was selling for well over £1000 for well over a year, and i paid £750 for it on a really good Forum deal Gibbo done, at the time it was selling for about £1100 on the website i think.

MRSRPS have hardly been accurate for years now.