AMD Zen 5 rumours

[Dave2150]

I have seen no confirmation for that at all, just rumors at best.


These work on current boards already just not 1:1 with CPU. That won't change on new chipset (reason stated below).


4 dimm slots not working today well are mostly the fault of the board (daisy chain topology of ram slots etc.) and not chipset's. Chipset has nothing to do with RAM, memory controller is inside the CPU for a long time now and is said to be identical in coming CPUs.

X870E boards support faster memory - this is not a rumour and is confirmed. It's similar to Intel, where the Z790 boards support faster memory than Z690 boards etc.

AMD Readies X870E Chipset to Launch Alongside First Ryzen 9000 "Granite Ridge" CPUs

AMD is readying the new 800-series motherboard chipset to launch alongside its next-generation Ryzen 9000 series "Granite Ridge" desktop processors that implement the "Zen 5" microarchitecture. The chipset family will be led by the AMD X870E, a successor to the current X670E. Since AMD isn't...

www.techpowerup.com

 

[Tinek]

X870E boards support faster memory - this is not a rumour and is confirmed. It's similar to Intel, where the Z790 boards support faster memory than Z690 boards etc.

AMD Readies X870E Chipset to Launch Alongside First Ryzen 9000 "Granite Ridge" CPUs

AMD is readying the new 800-series motherboard chipset to launch alongside its next-generation Ryzen 9000 series "Granite Ridge" desktop processors that implement the "Zen 5" microarchitecture. The chipset family will be led by the AMD X870E, a successor to the current X670E. Since AMD isn't...

www.techpowerup.com

That's absolutely not what that article says about anything above 6400MT ("might get support" - and I might win in lottery ). 6400MT is already supported even on B650 with a new UEFI - it's not guaranteed, as a lot depends on the CPU (same as with oc) and ram controller in it. And new coming CPUs have apparently same RAM controller, which is 6400MT max 1:1, same a current 7k series. Nowhere in the article it says this is guaranteed on every CPU (same as with current series).

Sure, vendors also tend to offer boards with better wired ram slots, but they are the expensive ones - daisy chain topology isn't the only one, it's the cheap one (hence present on most b650 boards, if not all). You can usually say that 8 layers boards have better memory support (speed-wise) than most 6 layers ones, but recently even some 6 layers ones got said 6400MT support.

 

[Tinek]

I'll say this, every new Zen leak is all over the place, this is no different to Zen and Zen 3 "leaks"

I think they are all making stuff up for clicks, one day has really good results, the next really bad, then really good, then really bad again.... its all just click bait.

Might not be making stuff, might simply be multiple versions of engineering samples, with various bugs, much lower clocks, wrong power limits etc. We just can't know. Need to wait for production sample and proper tests.

 

[Grim5]

From what I've read there is still no reason to go above 6400 even with Zen5 and X870E

 

[Dave2150]

That's absolutely not what that article says about anything above 6400MT ("might get support" - and I might win in lottery ). 6400MT is already supported even on B650 with a new UEFI - it's not guaranteed, as a lot depends on the CPU (same as with oc) and ram controller in it. And new coming CPUs have apparently same RAM controller, which is 6400MT max 1:1, same a current 7k series. Nowhere in the article it says this is guaranteed on every CPU (same as with current series).

Sure, vendors also tend to offer boards with better wired ram slots, but they are the expensive ones - daisy chain topology isn't the only one, it's the cheap one (hence present on most b650 boards, if not all). You can usually say that 8 layers boards have better memory support (speed-wise) than most 6 layers ones, but recently even some 6 layers ones got said 6400MT support.

You sound anxious that x870e will support higher memory speeds than x670e. This is a certainty - it's how motherboard manufactures work. They qualify/test higher memory speeds (EXPO/XMP) on newer boards/chipsets, making higher speeds work out of the box with one click EXPO/XMP. There are sometimes hardware improvements, though most often it's simply they put in the effort to qualify/test/program the EUFI on newer boards to work without tedious manual overclocking/tinkering that most don't have time for.

Why are you so bothered and concerned about this? Because you own a x670e board and realize it's about to lose half it's value or more? It's how technology works!

 

[Dave2150]

From what I've read there is still no reason to go above 6400 even with Zen5 and X870E

The Zen5 non X3D chips will probably see bigger benefits from 6400Mhz - 8000Mhz kits, as no 3d cache, so they benefit more from higher memory bandwidth.

Zen5X3D will probably not care as much, if it's behaviour is similar to Zen4 X3D.

 

[Tinek]

You sound anxious that x870e will support higher memory speeds than x670e. This is a certainty - it's how motherboard manufactures work. They qualify/test higher memory speeds (EXPO/XMP) on newer boards/chipsets, making higher speeds work out of the box with one click EXPO/XMP. There are sometimes hardware improvements, though most often it's simply they put in the effort to qualify/test/program the EUFI on newer boards to work without tedious manual overclocking/tinkering that most don't have time for.

Why are you so bothered and concerned about this? Because you own a x670e board and realize it's about to lose half it's value or more? It's how technology works!

So, your arguments are hopium and ad hominem? QVL changes even on current boards and gets updated with time - it's not an argument in any way supporting your position, though. As I said, 6400MT is the current max 1:1 on many existing boards (even on b650) and it's said to be the same in coming boards. And if you still don't understand, I'll underline it again - RAM controller is in the CPU, not motherboard, for many years now. RAM support has nothing to do with the chipset on the board, at all. RAM slots topology and physical wiring is the only thing that matters, aside the CPU. Also, physical wires go from RAM slots directly to the CPU, never touching chipset on the way.

And as last and the least important thing - I don't own x670e board.

 

[Tinek]

The Zen5 non X3D chips will probably see bigger benefits from 6400Mhz - 8000Mhz kits, as no 3d cache, so they benefit more from higher memory bandwidth.

So far most tests I've seen of memory over 7000MT with 2:1 mode shown that in most cases timings matter more than speed. It's usually better to run 6400MT with tighter timings than the faster modules. But it depends on use case. There's a reason AMD said new CPUs have sweet spot of 6400MT 1:1.

Zen5X3D will probably not care as much, if it's behaviour is similar to Zen4 X3D.

They both have same memory controller apparently (current and 9k series), so should behave in almost the same (if not identical) way with memory

 

[Dave2150]

Tinek - I'll leave you to it buddy. Once reviews and official specifications leak out, you'll hopefully come to the realisation that x870e boards and Zen5 support higher speed EXPO/XMP kits than x670e/Zen4.

 

[Marak]

So, your arguments are hopium and ad hominem? QVL changes even on current boards and gets updated with time - it's not an argument in any way supporting your position, though. As I said, 6400MT is the current max 1:1 on many existing boards (even on b650) and it's said to be the same in coming boards. And if you still don't understand, I'll underline it again - RAM controller is in the CPU, not motherboard, for many years now. RAM support has nothing to do with the chipset on the board, at all. RAM slots topology and physical wiring is the only thing that matters, aside the CPU. Also, physical wires go from RAM slots directly to the CPU, never touching chipset on the way.

And as last and the least important thing - I don't own x670e board.

This is my understanding as well. A well designed X670/B650 board will be just as good as an X870 and later boards with regards to RAM speeds because its just a matter of wiring and the CPU memory controller.

Tinek - I'll leave you to it buddy. Once reviews and official specifications leak out, you'll hopefully come to the realisation that x870e boards and Zen5 support higher speed EXPO/XMP kits than x670e/Zen4.

'Support" is of course very different from being able to do those speeds. Support means the manufacturer has qualified that board to do X speeds and can potentially be used as an RMA argument if it doesn't.

Boards without official support for X speeds may sti be able to do them if the board has been well designed and made

 

[Mightyashy]

Question regarding the 7800X3D v the 9k chips. If getting a new system purely for gaming, is it worth holding on for the 9k or upgrade to the 3D version further down the line (read this version will release a bit later?) from the 7800?

 

[Rob_B]

If you have a 7800 already I'd hold out for now, see what the 9x00 prices are, and what the jump from a 7800 to an X3D or 9x00 is and decide then

 

[Mightyashy]

If you have a 7800 already I'd hold out for now, see what the 9x00 prices are, and what the jump from a 7800 to an X3D or 9x00 is and decide then

I’m doing a completely new custom build. Don’t have anything atm

 

[Rob_B]

I'm being silly as there isn't a 7800 anyway. Personally I'd hold for the 9x00 series, if you can't wait then you either buy a 7600 to tide you over, or go for a 7800X3D as you know they're great chips and can be had for a touch over £300

 

[Joxeon]

this is not exactly stellar performance, those with 7000 series chips not worth upgrading tbh not for 14%-16% anyway. Multicore performance is even worse, assuming this might be driver issue?

It maybe worth going from a 7000 non X3D to a 9000 X3D but even then it won’t be groundbreaking.

 

[Tinek]

Question regarding the 7800X3D v the 9k chips. If getting a new system purely for gaming, is it worth holding on for the 9k or upgrade to the 3D version further down the line (read this version will release a bit later?) from the 7800?

Impossible to say at the moment, as AMD's employer said (amongst other things): "It's not like, hey, we've also added X3D to a chip. We are working actively on really cool differentiators to make it even better. We're working on x3D, we're improving it." - whatever that means. It could be just marketing blabbering, it could actually be some significant improvements to new x3D chips (e.g. higher clocks matching the non-x3D version, higher power limits etc.). It's wait and see what it really brings to the table. That said, 7800x3D is still plenty fast for gaming as is and there's no reason to think this will change with the release of 9k series. One thing will happen for sure - new CPUs will be more expensive than you can get 7k series for currently.

 

[Tinek]

Tinek - I'll leave you to it buddy. Once reviews and official specifications leak out, you'll hopefully come to the realisation that x870e boards and Zen5 support higher speed EXPO/XMP kits than x670e/Zen4.

So, again, you have no clue what will really happen but instead you have plenty of hopium. That might work for you, it doesn't for me - I need evidence. I'll be very happy to see real evidence proving much faster EXPO memory will work just fine with new CPUs on new motherboards. I find this highly improbable, though, knowing enough about how these things actually work.

Now, you could also check what GN, Buildzoid (I recommend you to watch his videos about RAM topology and signaling and how it actually works and what really influences RAM speed and stability), HU (who poked AMD directly to get confirmation either way and got nothing of use in response) and few other good testers already said about this. TLDR/TLDW - they have high doubts it will be any different/better than in current generation.

 

[KillBoY_UK]

So, your arguments are hopium and ad hominem? QVL changes even on current boards and gets updated with time - it's not an argument in any way supporting your position, though. As I said, 6400MT is the current max 1:1 on many existing boards (even on b650) and it's said to be the same in coming boards. And if you still don't understand, I'll underline it again - RAM controller is in the CPU, not motherboard, for many years now. RAM support has nothing to do with the chipset on the board, at all. RAM slots topology and physical wiring is the only thing that matters, aside the CPU. Also, physical wires go from RAM slots directly to the CPU, never touching chipset on the way.

And as last and the least important thing - I don't own x670e board.

I'll be surprised if there's much of a difference in stable memory clocks between 7xxx & x670 vs 9xxx & x870 as zen 5 is using the same io die isn't it ? so the same memory controller. I

 

[Tinek]

I'll be surprised if there's much of a difference in stable memory clocks between 7xxx & x670 vs 9xxx & x870 as zen 5 is using the same io die isn't it ? so the same memory controller. I

That's exactly my point. The only thing going for x870 could be better design of physical wires between slots and CPU, to minimise signal interference etc. together with 8 layers board, which means higher price but it could make RAM more stable with higher clocks. Though, many vendors already claim their current boards are really well wired for that as is. In the end, that is pretty much all the board can do, as the rest sits with a given CPU and it's memory controller.

 

[KillBoY_UK]

That's exactly my point. The only thing going for x870 could be better design of physical wires between slots and CPU, to minimise signal interference etc. together with 8 layers board, which means higher price but it could make RAM more stable with higher clocks. Though, many vendors already claim their current boards are really well wired for that as is. In the end, that is pretty much all the board can do, as the rest sits with a given CPU and it's memory controller.

I just want way more PCI lanes, mainstream chipsets like my current x570 just have too few today even is 670/870 have 40 now its not really enough imo eps as more and more peeps want to run several SSD's and or a 10gb lan card/port/USB4(thunderbolt) taking up lanes too but thats just me.