Cities Skylines 2 is Official!

High density demand doesnt seem to pick up until around 25k. Not really sure what the reason is for that.

People on reddit seem to be coming up with theories around a lot of things that dont work as they did in CS1, and typically its thinking more towards reality (if people want low-density homes, they're not going to relocate to live in a tower simply because thats all you've got available. They know what they want, and you havent got it etc), but i think most of it is people coming up with fancy excuses to wiggle around things that arent quite right. Still, i think in some cases its worth dropping preconceptions based on how it worked in CS1, and consider things are being done differently. Personally i think it's rather odd if there are a lot of reworked logic, and CO just didnt bother mentioning it, it means people go into it with an expectation of how things should work and when they dont, they're broken etc. So im not sure how much weight to put into theories/excuses.
 
I continue to play, whilst constantly getting frustrated with nearly every element of the game... lol.

Economy, trade, residential requirements, all seem to be a bit of a black art to get around. I did manage to fix my commercial and industrial businesses making no profit earlier - that turned out to be a combination of high electric/water costs despite low tax rates, along with not having any communications as I'd completed missed that. Added the comms, reduced water/electric cost and increased tax - suddenly businesses are doing better and making some money. Which makes sense, but the game doesn't make things super clear, and I mainly stumbled across this with trial and error and searching reddit.

In between bits of balancing economy, I've been tinkering with finely made intersections and quay like areas of road. Whilst the new road building is way better than stock, it's still frustrating as hell in certain areas. The lack of a button to say "keep this road entirely level" is a massive frustration, and the game doesn't want to consistently place the quay walls. I've had times where I'll replace something multiple times in the same location and get different behaviours each time. Sometimes it'll auto level half of the nearbye terrain, then the next it'll build a quay wall one side and have no zoning on the other, then try again and I get the wall and the correct zoning. Would be great if I could find a consistent way of controlling all this! The zoning is a damn frustration, I've made parallel roads in one spot, and on one road I've got solid grid all the way along, and on the other it's split into chunks with gaps and no matter what I do, replacing the road or upgrading it - I can't get that to grid fully!
 
Yeah, quay walls can be a real PITA. When i built a large water treatment area i noticed that the game does highlight whether or not theres zoning on one, both, or neither side. Where it zones, it shows the area of reach. Its pretty damn obvious really, but I hadnt noticed sometimes it wasnt there and i'd end up plonking down the road and then be unhappy with it bending and zoning the side water would be.

Its the water thats killing me mostly. Its just horrible. CS1s water i remember it being much more realistic although too easy to accidentally create a tsunami and flood areas, but at least it was typically user error and aside from water damage and some buildings needing to be bulldozed, you could simply move on. CS2 it just straight up defies logic, the game see's it as a problem when its underground, and its an absolute nightmare trying to move bodies of water. Water seems to glitch up, and if not careful the water will become unstuck and create a wild ripple that floods areas that were fine, and once water is somewhere, it doesnt go of its own accord, you have to terrafrom over it and hope it goes away, and you cant terraform over buildings & road so they have to go to fix it. Its just devastating, and typically caused by these new terrible water physics.

Currently up to 65k and just bulldozed my starting tile (90% row housing) to build an education area, and shifting a nearby low density neighbourhood further away to extend my downtown area. Playing on Waterway Pass map.
 
PaulC2K said:
Yeah, quay walls can be a real PITA. When i built a large water treatment area i noticed that the game does highlight whether or not theres zoning on one, both, or neither side. Where it zones, it shows the area of reach. Its pretty damn obvious really, but I hadnt noticed sometimes it wasnt there and i'd end up plonking down the road and then be unhappy with it bending and zoning the side water would be.

Its the water thats killing me mostly. Its just horrible. CS1s water i remember it being much more realistic although too easy to accidentally create a tsunami and flood areas, but at least it was typically user error and aside from water damage and some buildings needing to be bulldozed, you could simply move on. CS2 it just straight up defies logic, the game see's it as a problem when its underground, and its an absolute nightmare trying to move bodies of water. Water seems to glitch up, and if not careful the water will become unstuck and create a wild ripple that floods areas that were fine, and once water is somewhere, it doesnt go of its own accord, you have to terrafrom over it and hope it goes away, and you cant terraform over buildings & road so they have to go to fix it. Its just devastating, and typically caused by these new terrible water physics.

Currently up to 65k and just bulldozed my starting tile (90% row housing) to build an education area, and shifting a nearby low density neighbourhood further away to extend my downtown area. Playing on Waterway Pass map.
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Noticing that you have a 7950x3D how does this game reflect on the CPU's core utilisation...? I have a 12700k.................

CPU-usage.png


as you can see it does seem to use both the P and E cores. With the AMD chip does it also seem to use all the cores in a similar way, both the 3D cached as well as the 8 others...?

Thanks
 
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Admittedly haven't played it yet, but its looking very much like CS was in its infancy, which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

Although I remember playing that game not long after launch and getting fed up of it reasonably quickly.

Once the modders got hold of it and the likes of Strictoaster on YouTube started off his Cedar Valley project and onwards is when I started getting properly in to it.

As a minimum though, they need a mod that allows you to place props (I forget the name) as that one was basically essential. Also the mod that allows you to place buildings and clip them into each other (not RICO there was another one) because once you have those tools you can start properly designing areas that look quite different to the base game and pretty much do anything you want. Then things like prop line tool, suface painter etc

Hopefully it will all come. I will keep an eye on the price though as may be worth just playing it a bit to get to grips with the base game, but if I am honest I was more of a city painter type on CS and wasn't too bothered about the city management aspect of the game, which is where it is at, at the moment.
 
I've put one of those inland water buildings, it's the one that's supposed to supply water? But it doesn't do anything? Still need water pumps?

Also I'm getting issues with builders collapsing / going abandoned for reasons I can't work out.

Low density residential demand is insane, I already have low density zones to an area 3 times larger than anywhere.
 
Vimes said:
Noticing that you have a 7950x3D how does this game reflect on the CPU's core utilisation...? I have a 12700k.................

CPU-usage.png


as you can see it does seem to use both the P and E cores. With the AMD chip does it also seem to use all the cores in a similar way, both the 3D cached as well as the 8 others...?

Thanks
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Not sure how to get a similar display, so only using task manager to get the CPU load.

1toK3gG.png


Thats the system pretty much on idle and then launching the game and letting the simulation play. So half before, half during loading/gameplay.
Everything should be stock settings.

On a side note, i saw a few days ago a couple of threads on reddit talking about the cims being allocated the same number of polys as buildings, and stupid things like them having TEETH are resulting in performance tanking when the populations start to build up.
I havent tried it yet, but in DevMode you can apparently disable cims (purely from rendering them) and go from like 35fps to 55fps on half decent hardware.

Still on patch 1.0.9f on GamePass, and it occurred to me last night that likely means when modding is released, and they send out patch 1.0.20f or whatever, im gonna be waiting a week for that to come through GP too, unless they treat it like DLC and send it to Xbox and launch it on all platforms once everyone has approved it etc. Either situation sucks though.
 
willhub said:
I've put one of those inland water buildings, it's the one that's supposed to supply water? But it doesn't do anything? Still need water pumps?

Also I'm getting issues with builders collapsing / going abandoned for reasons I can't work out.

Low density residential demand is insane, I already have low density zones to an area 3 times larger than anywhere.
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Groundwater buildings need to be placed over groundwater deposits, and it'll tell you how much it'll collect and what % of usage (so 50% means you can place a 2nd on it for 100% usage etc).
You can double check where you've placed it by attempting to place a 2nd and make sure its over a water source. If it is, then i have no idea. It worked fine for me in my first playthrough.

Try clicking on building in the same area, and hover over the smiley face, and it should identify problems. Crime is a big one early on when you have sprawl and still trying to balance the budget.

Somewhere around 25k population there starts to be more interest in high-rise, its a bit odd that the game makes it available around 15k (via XP gains, not cos of population) but it does seem to kick in all of sudden. You just need to create huge suburbs, which support a lot of the services & industry folk, and eventually you can start seeing the downtown area come together with high residential & offices.
 
Just seen this in my subscriptions


... well, not really that interesting because they've chosen to start with a tool that we're already pretty familiar with - map editor, which unsurprisingly, works exactly the same way, with the same features as the game does.

The first minute is more interesting as it looks like theres an in-house asset builder that *might* let you create new assets with components within the game itself, like a small nuclear power plant using pieces used in the original, and all pieced together to make something new.
 
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PaulC2K said:
Not sure how to get a similar display, so only using task manager to get the CPU load.

1toK3gG.png


Thats the system pretty much on idle and then launching the game and letting the simulation play. So half before, half during loading/gameplay.
Everything should be stock settings.

On a side note, i saw a few days ago a couple of threads on reddit talking about the cims being allocated the same number of polys as buildings, and stupid things like them having TEETH are resulting in performance tanking when the populations start to build up.
I havent tried it yet, but in DevMode you can apparently disable cims (purely from rendering them) and go from like 35fps to 55fps on half decent hardware.

Still on patch 1.0.9f on GamePass, and it occurred to me last night that likely means when modding is released, and they send out patch 1.0.20f or whatever, im gonna be waiting a week for that to come through GP too, unless they treat it like DLC and send it to Xbox and launch it on all platforms once everyone has approved it etc. Either situation sucks though.
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So it seems to utilise each of your 16 cores somewhat equally and not just those with the 3D cache being preferred. Interesting. If I understood what I'm seeing.

I did read a post from one of the Devs, forgotten where but probably Steam, where the "teeth" concern was answered, to a point. Well answered in the context of much of what is being rendered and seem unnecessary at this point will have relevance later in the game when other features that are intended are added. Not sure if that gets to reflect directly on the teeth concern but I would be more concerned at this point about the missing animations etc that I posted about than some future content that may become relevant.

You will probably remember when CS1 was being patched many mods would require an update. Later on they got a little smarter and gave access to the most popular mod creators the patches before they were generally released, hence often an updated TMPE as well as a patch within a short period of time. This could be an issue for those playing on GP, in terms of synching with mods and updates etc, that you elude to.
 
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Vimes said:
So it seems t 0outilise each of your 16 cores somewhat equally and not just those with the 3D cache being preferred. Interesting. If I understood what I'm seeing.

I did read a post from one of the Devs, forgotten where but probably Steam, where the "teeth" concern was answered, to a point. Well answered in the context of much of what is being rendered and seem unnecessary at this point will have relevance later in the game when other features that are intended are added. Not sure if that gets to reflect directly on the teeth concern but I would be more concerned at this point about the missing animations etc tha tI posted about than some future content that may become relevant.

You will probably remember when CS1 was being patched many mods would require an update. Later on they got a little smarter and gave access to the most popular mod creators the patches before they were generally released, hence often an updated TMPE as well as a patch within a short period of time. This could be an issue for those playing on GP, in terms of synching with mods and updates etc, that you elude to.
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tbh ive no idea which of those cores have the 3D cache in them, and havent really looked into the whole tethering aspect, i just know its a thing.

The whole teeth thing does sound weird though, i mean what missing content is likely to come that makes it make sense? :D Are we getting a restaurant DLC where cims have pizza eating animations or something, and if so, do we really need to render their teeth?
In all fairness, i know the teeth thing as a headline and little more than that, but i'd imagine we're talking like 100 of 40,000 polygons (iirc it was 40-45k polys for cims, as it is for buildings) which ultimately isnt the issue, but its still very odd to think they have teeth modelled. I dont think ive got close enough to see if they have faces, let alone teeth!
 
PaulC2K said:
tbh ive no idea which of those cores have the 3D cache in them, and havent really looked into the whole tethering aspect, i just know its a thing.

The whole teeth thing does sound weird though, i mean what missing content is likely to come that makes it make sense? :D Are we getting a restaurant DLC where cims have pizza eating animations or something, and if so, do we really need to render their teeth?
In all fairness, i know the teeth thing as a headline and little more than that, but i'd imagine we're talking like 100 of 40,000 polygons (iirc it was 40-45k polys for cims, as it is for buildings) which ultimately isnt the issue, but its still very odd to think they have teeth modelled. I dont think ive got close enough to see if they have faces, let alone teeth!
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Oh, I'm not trying to make it sound"right", in regards to the teeth aspect of the rendering concerns.
Cumulatively the adding up and rendering of those extra polys, could be an issue, if not being intended for a future use.

Heck, I could even suggest that at one point in the future they will tie the game into their up and coming release for next year, "Life by you", the Sims4 wannabe.
Could you imagine that..?
Hence the focus and emphasis on the life and following aspect of the games citizens. Just a thought, I have had worse.

Btw I like the :D in your post, kinda relevant considering what we are taking about lol.
 
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I didnt know about the Sims challenger. It was something that i was wondering, that they might not be used exclusively by CS. I was thinking back to Planet Coaster, where you tended to get closer to the visitors compared to a CS/SC type game. A Sims competitor actually sounds like a decent idea really and its existing business model is absolutely perfect for Paradox and their 'heres a game, and heres 120 DLCs for it' approach :D
Looking on youtube for Life by You, it kinda makes a lot of sense now, they're more than likely sharing assets and LBY likely gives them a much greater range of animations than they'd likely need (or could justify) for CS use alone.


lol, hadnt even thought of that and it took me moment to figure out what you meant :D
 
It wouldn't surprise me if there has been more code and or asset sharing between those two games.
Yup, the Paradox glut of DLC'S, but with years of updates, is indeed ideally suited to a Sims type game.
There have been some concerns expressed over at Steam regarding the lack of deaths, illnesses or types of violence etc being missing from the game.....

Sanitised life.....

...... Not sure what they wanted to portray in the game.... Eek.

It is suggested that you will need a powerful PC to play the game.....
CS2, says "hold my beer"..!
 
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One little AI glitch that's causing me issues.. When I started my Map I set driving to be on the Left (Thinking it would make it easier to work out roads etc), However with a lot of buildings, the cars drive on the left to the entrance, then switch to the right when entering.

In particular this is causing an issue with my port, trucks arrive on the left hand side, then get into a massive traffic jam as they try to switch to the right to enter, while trucks are leaving on the right and trying to switch to the left to exit.
 
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