'Contact lost' with Malaysia Airlines plane

Westyfield2 said:
And in the Airbus the flight controls are not linked between the two pilot seats. So one pilot might not have known that the other was holding the stick back the entire time, and when the pilot finally went nose down (unless he said outloud what he was doing) the co-pilot might not have known!
In the Boeings the two sides of the cockpit are linked, so even if the pilots aren't talking to each other they can see what they're doing.
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they are linked it's just that like in many fighter jets (a10 for example) they don't move at all and instead rely on force sensors the actual stick stays perfectly still all the time you just push or pull against it. so there's no way to transmit the information between them.

normally the computer interprets the info and decides who's doing the right thing and does that (and even then only what it considers safe) but in this case it had returned all control to the pilots as it couldn't trust it's instruments.

usually though a modern airbus will happily tell pilots to sod off if they do something stupid.
 
ChroniC said:
It was the combination of a huge storm hidden from radar and the airspeed & altitude detectors freezing over, confusing pilots who had not be taught to deal with such a situation. Frankly the blame should have been laid on the airline for putting them in those circumstance without proper training.
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no it was pilot error plain and simple, if you've ever listened to the recording the idiot is merrily sat there in a cockpit with the computer screaming "STALL STALL STALL STALL " over and over and when the captain asks whats happening he says "I don't understand I've been pulling back the whole time".

iirc he'd done such a through job of crashing that when they hit the sea their forward air speed was around 20 miles per hour.

air France and it's usual incompetence at it's very best.
 
Lysander said:
Because the co-pilot panicked. He actually had all the necessary data to fly the plane properly. However, in panicking he thinks he is in TOGA and can climb away to safety. The pilots are used to doing most of their hand-flying at low altitude and, being disorientated, the co-pilot reverted to flying the plane like it was nearer the ground, when at 37,000 feet the air is much thinner and the wings give less lift.
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So the correlation between the loss of altitude, stall warning and the attitude of the plane (which in hindsight to me would determine immediate stall recovery actions) did not in this case help with the panic combined with disorientation in the cockpit?
 
Hitman_Leon said:
So the correlation between the loss of altitude, stall warning and the attitude of the plane (which in hindsight to me would determine immediate stall recovery actions) did not in this case help with the panic combined with disorientation in the cockpit?
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the pilot was incompetent that's all there is too it really.

seriously s small child who's been allowed to play any flight game for a few minutes would have understood the issue.

and no the stall warning isn't affected by the pitot tubes we have sensors in the wings as well that help detect stalls.

Air France is a horrific air line though for cutting corners, taking huge risks terrible attitude to safety in general. if the french government didn't protect them so much they'd have been in court many times with most of the bosses in prison by now.

thier fuel calculations are so penny pinching and worked out by the same type of number crunchers that did jimmy Carr'stax return that pilots have usually no choice but to fly in a straight line, no option for deviation around storms etc.
 
Energize said:
Must admit I've been looking forward to series 14 of Air Crash Investigation, I'm sure this will make for an interesting episode.
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WMdKsx8.gif

If that is the first thing that pops into your head after hearing that 239 people have almost certainly lost their lives than you really should keep it too yourself!
Unless of course you want people to know you are a sociopath!
 
Lysander said:
Two passports on board were stolen.



Yeah OK one.. but two?
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To what end though? No one has claimed any responsibility for bringing it down so what are our 2 stolen passport holders doing and for what reason?

What's the sea like in that area - it took a long time to recover the air France data recorder because of the depth and topography of the ocean floor. How does this compare?
 
C.R.A.Z.Y said:
after hearing that 239 people have almost certainly lost their lives than you really should keep it too yourself!
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So when you hear about 50 people dying in an Afghanistan bomb or Bono killing a hundred Africans because the ****er won't stop clicking his fingers, do you immediately collapse with grief and rush to the internet to express your anguish?

Or do you do what everyone else does and click the next news story.

Expecting everyone to display the same level of sympathy as you choose to do isn't really planting your flag on the high ground of moral superiority.
 
C.R.A.Z.Y said:
If that is the first thing that pops into your head after hearing that 239 people have almost certainly lost their lives than you really should keep it too yourself!
Unless of course you want people to know you are a sociopath!
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Yet the first reply referencing "Lost Season 14" apparently doesn't bother you?

Every other news story is about how some bomb in the middle east or natural disaster has killed hundreds, call me cynical but I just don't find it credible that you actually care that much.
 
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Energize said:
Every other news story is about how some bomb in the middle east or natural disaster has killed hundreds, call me cynical but I just don't find it credible that you actually care that much.
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Human nature isn't it, the mind relates to things it perceives could affect it. Natural disasters on the other side of the world are tragic but won't ever affect most people in the UK. Whereas a plane crash involving one of the worlds safest major airlines, which many here will have flown with, and a plane with an exceptional safety record just might, hence the natural tendency to care more about the outcome than for other events that are equally as tragic.

Looking at it completely objectively and without emotion and you are absolutely spot on, but obviously you know the human mind doesn't work like that.
 
Energize said:
Yet the first reply referencing "Lost Season 14" apparently doesn't bother you?

Every other news story is about how some bomb in the middle east or natural disaster has killed hundreds, call me cynical but I just don't find it credible that you actually care that much.
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This isn't about how much he cares about the incident, its about how you manage to trivialize the deaths of more than 200 people by pointing out that its going to improve your TV viewing enjoyment.
 
Energize said:
Yet the first reply referencing "Lost Season 14" apparently doesn't bother you?

Every other news story is about how some bomb in the middle east or natural disaster has killed hundreds, call me cynical but I just don't find it credible that you actually care that much.
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You obviously just posted this on the wrong forum. Just forget it. People are too self-righteous here.
 
Looks like the Air Force has found oil slicks in the sea. Apparently 2 passengers boarded the plane with stolen passports.

Wonder if the plane as hijacked.
 
Tefal said:
they are linked it's just that like in many fighter jets (a10 for example) they don't move at all and instead rely on force sensors the actual stick stays perfectly still all the time you just push or pull against it. so there's no way to transmit the information between them.

normally the computer interprets the info and decides who's doing the right thing and does that (and even then only what it considers safe) but in this case it had returned all control to the pilots as it couldn't trust it's instruments.

usually though a modern airbus will happily tell pilots to sod off if they do something stupid.
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Tefal said:
no it was pilot error plain and simple, if you've ever listened to the recording the idiot is merrily sat there in a cockpit with the computer screaming "STALL STALL STALL STALL " over and over and when the captain asks whats happening he says "I don't understand I've been pulling back the whole time".

iirc he'd done such a through job of crashing that when they hit the sea their forward air speed was around 20 miles per hour.

air France and it's usual incompetence at it's very best.
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IIRC though I'd have to check that Airbus had suffered Air France's usual and not been upgraded to the linked control package.
 
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