Do you charge your children "keep" or rent? Do/did you pay it yourself?

[[FnG]magnolia]

Strange straw man given I've explained my reasoning ad nauseum.

Still, I'll bite.

"Equal" is one of those words that sounds like it has meaning, but it's really highly contextual and subjective. If by this you mean "the same" then, this is a silly hypothesis on which to base any argument. Your wording, pitting "being supported" against "being equal" makes me think this is your intended meaning, which is a disappointingly simple way of looking at things given my effort in explaining my thoughts thus far. Almost no two people are "the same" however much our society might like us to pretend they are. In the context of my feelings on this, it's important to remember that men and women are fundamentally different, and so expecting default so called "equal" treatment is... I'm afraid, not based in reality.

Ref "Supported by a man", well it depends on what you mean by supported. I would expect my daughter to understand the importance of children in her future and her role in their upbringing. By this, I mean that she would understand that the optimal support for children is a traditional family unit consisting of both biological mother and father, with the former spending a good period of her time - especially with children in infancy - out of the traditional worker/employee economic category. She does this in order to focus her attention on the children, avoiding at all costs abdication of responsibility/arguably neglectful practice that is handing them over for someone else to care for, as well as to fulfil her maternal instincts. This obviously informs mate selection criteria towards those that will be able to support her and their future family.

I'm particularly proud of my achievement to free my wife from the chains of having to "go to work". She is free to focus on more important things and take risks with her own business ventures, comfortable in the knowledge that her husband is supporting them. Is this "being equal'. You tell me. Is it good? I think so.

So, instead of the boolean "supported by man or equal?", I propose the following:

Supported? Absolutely.
Equal? Yes, but not in the way you're framing it.

You could have saved us all some time and explained that you expressly want a (hypothetical) daughter to be a trad wife, have babies, look after them at the expense of any notion of wanting a career.

"Free my wife from ..." - I assume by this stage that you're on the wind up because no one truly, please, thinks like this?

 

[robj20]

My parents charged me rent and I lived with them until I was about 28 and met my now wife.
When we decided we wanted a house my parents turned round and told me all that rent is paid then they'd actually saved up and it became our house deposit.
My dad often encouraged saving by always offering to double what I saved so birthday money is always save half and spend half, that above bought me my first car.

Already setting my children up they each already have a pension and an ISA. They'll be set for a nice early retirement, ISA should easily cover a car or house deposit.
Times are hard now and 18 year head start is not to be wasted.

 

[Zefan]

You could have saved us all some time and explained that you expressly want a (hypothetical) daughter to be a trad wife, have babies, look after them at the expense of any notion of wanting a career.

"Free my wife from ..." - I assume by this stage that you're on the wind up because no one truly, please, thinks like this?

I typed a reply against my better judgement before I realised engaging with someone who initiates in bad faith is pointless. Ciao.

 

[Slam]

When I was fifteen I'd already had a few jobs. One was a petrol station attendant, wiping down windscreens for tips. Another one was stacking shelves at a seven-eleven (yes, we had those back then) for their out of date crisps / snacks.

Oh and at school I used to sell everything I could get my hands on. I would literally sell used erasers to other kids for 50 cents. It was ace

Nice, I applaud that, you have a good attitude that I'm sure has given you a good options in life.
I'm really careful about bringing up my son to appreciate everything, I hate entitled people! He would def have to earn his own money if he wanted lots of stuff but he actually is very contented and has enough from events like Christmas, Chinese New Year, his birthday and Eid!

 

[Demon]

She got married and got shafted a bit.
She has put £100K down on a house so yes she didn't flitter it away.
Next.

That wasn’t my point:

I'm sure there are reasons, and I wouldn't dream of chastising you, yet there you are knowing nothing about me or the specifics of the entire situation and chastise me as if I'm some selfish or bad parent?

I.e. I already knew in your situation there would be perfectly good reasons, I just was bolstering the point above with an example.
Which was based on:

I think on both sides, anyone lecturing the other to say their parenting approach is 'wrong' is deluded.. you quickly learn that no matter what you do, however well meaning it may not turn out as you expect.. parenting is tough at times!

You seem to want to desperately validate your parenting decisions and just throw this idiotic assumption that asking kids to pay rent is terrible, and worse, you claim is selfishly motivated..

I know how difficult parenting is and you can be torn not knowing what to do when your individual circumstances and individual children’s personalities are so varied.. If there was scientific consensus that showed various things are detrimental to a child, the sure, get on your high horse.

 

[FloppyPoppy]

My wife's brother is similar, I always say to my wife, when your mums gone how is he going to survive? The house is council rent, he only gets dole money £80 per week I think it is, gives his mum and her partner £50 per month.

My wife never answers me, but I can tell she's thinking of saying he can come live with us, so I've made it known That absolutely won't be happening, I've said if it does we're divorcing and I'm taking my half of everything, I'm not paying for no scrounger

i have made that clear with my family also. I have actually mentioned to my parents previously that i would be willing to give them the cash to purchase their 4bed council house on the right to buy scheme as they have been there for 25 years so the discount is astronomical. I offered this with two things noted. They can live there comfortably and enjoy the rest of their money in retirement on the condition that the house is left to me in the will and that he would not be staying there after that.

 

[El Jimben]

I paid a rather nominal £120 per month when I lived at home but my folks were happy with that.

 

[dpbadger]

When living with parents after I left school I paid I think £40 a week then if I earned more it went up slightly. This was mid 90's

 

[[FnG]magnolia]

I typed a reply against my better judgement before I realised engaging with someone who initiates in bad faith is pointless. Ciao.

I was not arguing in bad faith. I have two daughters and your views, well let's say they raised an eyebrow. Apologies if it came across as antagonistic but again, not arguing in bad faith.

 

[Ace Modder]

My son is 20, he pays £80 a month, works part time in Yates, whilst waiting to join the RAF later this year.
His £80 a month is being saved to give him when he wants to buy something big. He doesn't know this though.

 

[Zefan]

I was not arguing in bad faith. I have two daughters and your views, well let's say they raised an eyebrow. Apologies if it came across as antagonistic but again, not arguing in bad faith.

Congratulations, it transpires we have matching credentials in this regard, and conversely views that oppose to mine (as in, encouraging women to focus on careers and discouraging them from focusing on family) raise an eyebrow. I explained my views in the way I did, using the words I did, for a reason. Summing them up in a willfully/accidentally on purpose reductive manner is something you do quite often and I think it's unlikely something that can be explained away as anything other than antagonistic/bad faith.

 

[[FnG]magnolia]

Congratulations, it transpires we have matching credentials in this regard, and conversely views that oppose to mine (as in, encouraging women to focus on careers and discouraging them from focusing on family) raise an eyebrow. I explained my views in the way I did, using the words I did, for a reason. Summing them up in a willfully/accidentally on purpose reductive manner is something you do quite often and I think it's unlikely something that can be explained away as anything other than antagonistic/bad faith.

I can disagree with your view - very strongly, actually - without it being in bad faith. I can understand you used the words you did but I didn't reduce your argument further than you already had.

 

[Roar87]

These traditional gender roles are the same one's exclusively adopted by every single generation of humans that have ever existed, the arrogance and stupidity that we should just say 'men and women are exactly the same', and disregard them like they're some offensive racial slur is mental. It's also damaging to the untold number of women who forego having children to focus on a career, only to realise when it's too late that working 60 hours a week to become a Lawyer isn't very fulfilling when you're going home to a cat, and you're compartively less happy than a woman who works part time but has 3 children and a hard working husband.

 

[[FnG]magnolia]

Imagine being so edgy that you can throw 'men and women are exactly the same' into a conversation where people - adults I mean, not you Roar87 - have not said that and are trying to work their way through a discussion.

And LOL at your made up female lawyer/oh no I should have worked on the farm analogy, Jesus Christ you have simple views (and I bet, I ******* BET - no daughters)

e: swearing redacted, not necessary, apologies mods if it pinged any buttons.

 

[Noakesy85]

I lived at home until i was 21 (I Joined the RAF 2 weeks before my 22nd birthday), I started paying 'Keep' to my parents once i left full time education after 6th Form and started earning a proper wage. I'll be doing the same to both my Daughters once they're old enough. My eldest is 8 and youngest is 4 so we have a few years yet.

My wife and i opened savings accounts for both our girls when they were babies and we split the child support we get for them into both accounts monthly as we have no real need for it, and in some twisted way I see it as the government giving something back to the children they're screwing over anyways. By the time they're 18 they should have a decent amount to put towards a house deposit or university tuition if they so choose.

 

[Trig]

These traditional gender roles are the same one's exclusively adopted by every single generation of humans that have ever existed, the arrogance and stupidity that we should just say 'men and women are exactly the same', and disregard them like they're some offensive racial slur is mental. It's also damaging to the untold number of women who forego having children to focus on a career, only to realise when it's too late that working 60 hours a week to become a Lawyer isn't very fulfilling when you're going home to a cat, and you're compartively less happy than a woman who works part time but has 3 children and a hard working husband.

Thats a leap..
From sons and daughters being made to pay something for their own upkeep once earning and still live at home, to suggesting people are arrogant and stupid an saying that men and women are exactly the same...
So much of a leap infact that, are you, can you, leap over a building in a single bound?

Are you in fact Superman?


Don't know about the other fathers in here that have daughters, but my daughter knows she is a girl, knows the difference between the two and knows that they both have their strengths and weaknesses, for you to suggest that we're off on some sort of 'Woke roadtrip' simply for wanting both sexes to pay something to contribute to the house is, well, a leap..
Are you suggesting that once she is of age I should be marrying her off to the first rich guy she meets and start churning out babies?

 

[helpimcrap]

Keep... I remember when my parents told me about keep back in the day (90s) and I laughed in their face and thought they were joking. Then I learned that it was actually a thing, and gradually began to understand why it was a thing.
Back in the late 90s when I started work I used to pay about £100 a month.
Given inflation 20 years later, that today would supposedly be £184 according to this bank of england calculator
What do you think on the matter?
I know a lot charge it, but then save it up and give it back for a house deposit. For those that will do that, are your kids aware that this is what you will do, or will it be a surprise for when the time comes?

Paid it since i've had a job. Had jobs ever since i was about 12.

A) interest rates were higher in the 80's relatively and my family struggled so hard with my parents working split shifts as couldn't afford babysitters.
B) Used to lend them money if needed and they ALWAYS paid it back even if they needed it more.
C) Gave me a great work and money ethic. The financial crashes, energy crisis etc affected me very minimally because i was taught to plan. Never done the low variable rates because as my parents taught me in the 80's 'all good things come to an end so make sure you are ready for it' because they suffered enormously in the 80's working all the overtime going and multiple jobs if needed. They never took a hand out or claimed anything and that rubbed off on me, if they borrowed they always paid it back. I'd do whatever job going at the time if needed with no shame.
D) They used to charge me a minor amount really - £100 a month in 90's increasing to £200 a month, roughly 25% of my wages at the time. My parents used to pay 50% of their wages so i got it easy. I'd be expecting that to be roughly £300-400 a month nowadays if i had kids.

 

[Roar87]

Imagine being so edgy that you can throw 'men and women are exactly the same' into a conversation where people - adults I mean, not you Roar87 - have not said that and are trying to work their way through a discussion.

And LOL at your made up female lawyer/oh no I should have worked on the farm analogy, Jesus Christ you have simple views (and I bet, I ******* BET - no daughters)

e: swearing redacted, not necessary, apologies mods if it pinged any buttons.

Thats a leap..
From sons and daughters being made to pay something for their own upkeep once earning and still live at home, to suggesting people are arrogant and stupid an saying that men and women are exactly the same...
So much of a leap infact that, are you, can you, leap over a building in a single bound?

Are you in fact Superman?


Don't know about the other fathers in here that have daughters, but my daughter knows she is a girl, knows the difference between the two and knows that they both have their strengths and weaknesses, for you to suggest that we're off on some sort of 'Woke roadtrip' simply for wanting both sexes to pay something to contribute to the house is, well, a leap..
Are you suggesting that once she is of age I should be marrying her off to the first rich guy she meets and start churning out babies?

I was speaking in a more general sense at the derisory tone taken towards traditional gender roles, the general direction of "progressive" culture; which seems to be headed in the amalgamation of women and mens roles by attacking anything and anyone masculine and pushing every woman to be a "girl boss". There wasn't an attack on anyone in here.

 

[Trig]

I was speaking in a more general sense at the derisory tone taken towards traditional gender roles, the general direction of "progressive" culture; which seems to be headed in the amalgamation of women and mens roles by attacking anything and anyone masculine and pushing every woman to be a "girl boss". There wasn't an attack on anyone in here.

I was speaking in a more general sense at the derisory tone taken towards traditional gender roles, the general direction of "progressive" culture; which seems to be headed in the amalgamation of women and mens roles by attacking anything and anyone masculine and pushing every woman to be a "girl boss". There wasn't an attack on anyone in here.

There is no 'tone' here, its text, what people mean when they type something is very much taken based on the mood of the person reading it and not always as the typist intended.

There is no general sense aimed at gender roles, but I don't see why sons/daughters should pay a different level of board/keep or whatever you want to call it, its not like its a huge amount of money but it starts to set the offspring up for paying for things when they move out, some people here stick it in a savings account and then it gets given back to them at a later date, usually unknown to them at the time, the idea being that you have a job, you arent in school, there's no reason why you should expect to live under someone else's roof, be kept warm dry and fed, and all this be free when you have a job...

To talk in 'general sense' especially when your comments are so far from what is actually being discussed just comes across as trolling...

 

[Zefan]

I didn't reduce your argument further than you already had.

Liar.