Don't Pay UK

McPhee said:
That wouldn't actually solve the problem.

Prices are high in Europe because supply is constrained. Supply is constrained because there is less gas coming from Russia, and the infrastructure isn't in place to replace that gas via other sources.

Fixing prices solves the price issue, but not the supply one. And in turn, it would make gas shortages more likely (high prices reduce consumption).

Realistically, the UK has two options:

1. Ride out the storm.
2. Heavily tax or ban gas exports. This would work in the short term, causing a crash in gas prices in the UK. But long-term it would see producers question planned investment in the UK. And it would also make mainland Europe's problems a lot worse, significantly damaging our relationship with our biggest trade partners.
Click to expand...
They’ve had long enough to increase supply. So are they dragging their heels to keep prices high?
High prices doesn’t guarantee lower consumption either so that’s not really a valid excuse.
People would have less of an issue if we didn’t have all these companies making obscene amounts of money off the back of them.
They can’t continue to have there cake and eat it.
 
Last edited:
McPhee said:
That wouldn't actually solve the problem.

Prices are high in Europe because supply is constrained. Supply is constrained because there is less gas coming from Russia, and the infrastructure isn't in place to replace that gas via other sources.

Fixing prices solves the price issue, but not the supply one. And in turn, it would make gas shortages more likely (high prices reduce consumption).

Realistically, the UK has two options:

1. Ride out the storm.
2. Heavily tax or ban gas exports. This would work in the short term, causing a crash in gas prices in the UK. But long-term it would see producers question planned investment in the UK. And it would also make mainland Europe's problems a lot worse, significantly damaging our relationship with our biggest trade partners.
Click to expand...

UK gets the majority of its gas from Norway or domestic supply. Whats the excuse here? Oh its greed.
 
So how many people so far have said they're going to do this? They need a million, apparently. I can't see that happening, that's 1.5% of the entire country.
 
fez said:
I mean, part of it is. They could increase supply and therefore reduce the cost of the resource but why would they do that when they could make just as much and have far more of their product still in their own hands.

Its a borderline racket, just one that functions OK in normal times. Make no mistake these companies are profiteering. The issue is that as a capitalist world we pat companies on the back for it.
Click to expand...
Can they increase to supply to negate the shortfall which usually comes from Russia? No they cant hence prices are rocketing.
 
Reuben klang said:
It’s electric prices that should be the issue, the vast majority of UK electricity is renewable, the stupid regs that say it has to be the equivalent price to gas is stupid as.
Click to expand...
I wouldn’t call 43% in 2020 “the vast majority“.

According to this, the U.K. is Europe’s largest net importer of electricit:

www.powerengineeringint.com

Britain hits power imports record

Britain has set a new record for electricity imports underlining the growing importance of interconnectors to the country’s power mix.
www.powerengineeringint.com www.powerengineeringint.com
 
200sols said:
Can they increase to supply to negate the shortfall which usually comes from Russia? No they cant hence prices are rocketing.
Click to expand...

Have they increased it as much as they can? Not even close. Countries have been asking OPEC+ to increase supply since this all started and they have basically refused. Nothing to do with capacity and everything to do with self interest and profits.
 
200sols said:
They arent getting it cheaper, the price they are being paid on the market is higher and they don't set that price.
Click to expand...
They could set that price though if they wanted to, there is no requirement for them to sell at the 'market' price Shell could give all the oil away for free if they wanted to or the UK government could compel all the north sea suppliers to sell gas only into the UK market at cost price which is clearly well below the current 'market' price if the exploration companies are recording record profits then clearly they could reduce the wholesale price. I'm not saying any of these things should or will happen but to endlessly spout 'the market sets the price' in response to a global crisis in the supply of a basic essential while companies rack up record profits is a little simplistic.
 
a1ex2001 said:
They could set that price though if they wanted to, there is no requirement for them to sell at the 'market' price Shell could give all the oil away for free if they wanted to or the UK government could compel all the north sea suppliers to sell gas only into the UK market at cost price which is clearly well below the current 'market' price if the exploration companies are recording record profits then clearly they could reduce the wholesale price. I'm not saying any of these things should or will happen but to endlessly spout 'the market sets the price' in response to a global crisis in the supply of a basic essential while companies rack up record profits is a little simplistic.
Click to expand...
Its not simplistic at all, its just what is happening. If you want price caps and artificial pricing then that has to come from government.... good luck with that!
 
200sols said:
Its not simplistic at all, its just what is happening. If you want price caps and artificial pricing then that has to come from government.... good luck with that!
Click to expand...
So by having protests like this one is more likely to put pressure on the government than just being a good little citizen, paying up and shutting up. Is it not?
 
Doobedoo said:
So by having protests like this one is more likely to put pressure on the government than just being a good little citizen, paying up and shutting up. Is it not?
Click to expand...

You not paying your bill has nothing to do with the government. It has more to do with the courts and the bailiffs. The government are supplying taxpayers money to offset some billpayers payments but even if oil and gas were nationalised the prices would not come down by much if at all. It is not a national problem either.
You are banging your head on a brick wall to think that nonpayment will be effective at all.
 
I am probably hopelessly naive and wrong............ So am not trying to persuade anyone, I am just going to put why i would not refuse to pay my energy bill (over and above i dont want to nuke my credit rating)

I am not convinced in many cases it would be punishing the "guilty" parties.

Again, maybe i am a mug, but my experience with Octopus Energy has been nothing short of excellent. (and previous to them i was a serial energy company swapper). Their products have been innovative, their customer service friendly and helpful and their prices fair (in relation to everyone else). Currently they are - or were until recently - charging under the price cap on their variable and their fixed octopus go even in on peak was cheaper than many were paying on variable.... **I know its gone up a lot in the last 6 months**

I also trust their green credentials more than most energy companies**, they are actively investing in various green technologies as well as offering electric car products.

The last thing i would want to see is OE go the way of bulb or all the other companies who sank, and then just be left with the likes of British Gas (who i dont have such respect for as a company)

Again tho, if someone actually more clued in wants to disagree i would love to hear why i am wrong.

**(That said Dale Vince who i also have huge respect for has said OE are no where near as green as they claim after they invested in australian coal and frakking company i believe ... So i am not saying they are perfect. :/ )
 
Craterloads said:
They must be getting it cheaper and selling it for a lot more if they are making 6.9b in profit each quarter.
Click to expand...
Ignoring the £20b loss last quarter due to Russia…


So profits from selling engine oil globally should go towards only U.K. residents heating? Same for profits from selling oil in Azerbaijan?

There is already big tax on North Sea production.
 
Hagar said:
You not paying your bill has nothing to do with the government. It has more to do with the courts and the bailiffs. The government are supplying taxpayers money to offset some billpayers payments but even if oil and gas were nationalised the prices would not come down by much if at all. It is not a national problem either.
You are banging your head on a brick wall to think that nonpayment will be effective at all.
Click to expand...
So what course of meaningful action can someone take. And just to clarify I’m not participating, I have a prepayment meter so by default I’m ruled out.
 
Doobedoo said:
So by having protests like this one is more likely to put pressure on the government than just being a good little citizen, paying up and shutting up. Is it not?
Click to expand...
No, personally I think all this does is hurt people who genuinely cant pay as they will get lost in the noise. This 'protest' will result in prepayment meters, trashed credit ratings as missed payments will be on file for 7 years and potentially court action depending how far it goes. I see it as a dumb move myself.
 
Simon said:
Ignoring the £20b loss last quarter due to Russia…


So profits from selling engine oil globally should go towards only U.K. residents heating? Same for profits from selling oil in Azerbaijan?

There is already big tax on North Sea production.
Click to expand...
Has engine oil increased at the same proportion to fuel?

And what has a 20b loss got to do with anything that’s money down the back of the sofa to them.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom