I respected Merson as a player...
Started reading that rant then read the bold quote about Carroll needing to put his hand up to take a pen (or if he didn't he should be ashamed).
I stopped reading then.
England Euro 2012 post mortem thread.
- Thread starter Danthus
- Start date
I respected Merson as a player...
Started reading that rant then read the bold quote about Carroll needing to put his hand up to take a pen (or if he didn't he should be ashamed).
I stopped reading then.
wheres barca coming from ?
there are more teams in europe
and overall they wouldnt get into a european team, be it a european club or euro's championship squad
hart : cassillas, buffon, neuer
rooney : ibra, benzema, gomez, huntelaar
to be fair to carroll, he had experience in front of him wanting to take them with gerrard/rooney/cole and young had started/played most of the games so was more than likely favoured by RH to take a pen.
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wheres barca coming from ?
there are more teams in europe
and overall they wouldnt get into a european team, be it a european club or euro's championship squad
hart : cassillas, buffon, neuer
rooney : ibra, benzema, gomez, huntelaar
those would be my choices in front of the 2 you mentioned.
you might have a point with Hart - but Neuer isnt better by default, I dont think there is much between them , both of the other two are nearly 10 years older (and have the experience to go with it) - not exactly fair
Its laughable you compare Benzema , Huntelaar they arent even close to Rooney in their all round game (Huntelaar has been average to terrible in three? top line teams , now he is with a mid table team in Germany he is starting to look ok , but last season was still his 1st there, so anything can happen) , Benzema (and Gomez) are still very young but former has had an up and down couple of seasons. They can both very possibly improve with age but Rooney's record over the last 4 or 5 seasons cant really be faulted. Ibra is a decent goal scorer but still quite a bit older than Rooney
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Rooney is better then Huntelaar, I'd say about level with Benzema. Not sure about the other two.
Hart I'd say is better than Neuer but not as good as Buffon or Casillas.
Hart I'd say is better than Neuer but not as good as Buffon or Casillas.
the consideration of "better" is based on who i think would get picked in a european team ahead of hart and rooney, i believe that those players i listed would.
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I wouldn't say Benzema is equal to Rooney. The amount of easy chances he messes up for Real Madrid is quite astonishing. He's certainly very capable, but he seems to struggle more often than not.
As for Huntelaar, hah, not even close. He's a good striker but that's about it.
As for Huntelaar, hah, not even close. He's a good striker but that's about it.
ermmm but thats the role thats listed.
if your then going to adjust it to rooneys abilites to play as an attacking midfielders then he's up against xavi, iniesta, fabregas, ronaldo.......
It's not really that simple though, is it.
It depends on the formation and the players around him, rather than pure striking attributes. Even then, I don't think Huntelaar would be picked ahead of Rooney.
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I can't understand all the negativity...
1) Failed to qualify for Euro 2008
2) Terrible at the WC 2010
3) Capello rage quits and leaves us in a mess
4) Terry race row
5) Rio Ferdinand saga - pick me I am black zomg racists :/
6) Wilshire Walker, Smalling injured - can't try youth team now.
7) Rooney suspended for 2 games
Yeh we then draw with the mighty France
and win the group.
With all that **** from above I think we did very well and their are a lot of positives.
1) Hart in goal, goal is sorted for next 15 years. End of.
2) Defence is sorted for next 10 years - Johnson Cahill Lescott Cole then after 2014 something like Walker/Smalling/Cahill/Baines (for 2016 then Gibbs/Robinson)
3) Wilshire/Rodwell/P Jones/Milner/Johnson/all the youth
4) Roooonnnnneeeeey/Carroll/Welbeck Not great but there we go, these are our cards.
1) Failed to qualify for Euro 2008
2) Terrible at the WC 2010
3) Capello rage quits and leaves us in a mess
4) Terry race row
5) Rio Ferdinand saga - pick me I am black zomg racists :/
6) Wilshire Walker, Smalling injured - can't try youth team now.
7) Rooney suspended for 2 games
Yeh we then draw with the mighty France
and win the group.With all that **** from above I think we did very well and their are a lot of positives.
1) Hart in goal, goal is sorted for next 15 years. End of.
2) Defence is sorted for next 10 years - Johnson Cahill Lescott Cole then after 2014 something like Walker/Smalling/Cahill/Baines (for 2016 then Gibbs/Robinson)
3) Wilshire/Rodwell/P Jones/Milner/Johnson/all the youth
4) Roooonnnnneeeeey/Carroll/Welbeck Not great but there we go, these are our cards.
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My issue with rooney was how many shots he had on target last night. And against the Ukraine.
its pointless debating about how good or not someone is if they cant prove it by playing well or doing the things that they need to do.
look at balotelli, yes he squandered a few shots, but he actually worked the keepr a bit too.
Sad but true and ill say again, Rooney peaked on his UTD debut and hasnt really matched that kind of performance ever since. And he's been at UTD for 6-7 years!
And for england he's never come close to have a decent game in a tournament.
its pointless debating about how good or not someone is if they cant prove it by playing well or doing the things that they need to do.
look at balotelli, yes he squandered a few shots, but he actually worked the keepr a bit too.
Sad but true and ill say again, Rooney peaked on his UTD debut and hasnt really matched that kind of performance ever since. And he's been at UTD for 6-7 years!
And for england he's never come close to have a decent game in a tournament.
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He also had the likes of Cassano, Pirlo and Montolivo providing for him, Rooney had....well.
I doubted Johnson from the start but i have to say that he looks that he has almost overnight become a defender!
Milner playing out wide to "protect" him was a waste. His best games for us have come in the centre although his best performance imo was at RM with Richards behind in the 1-6 so
....
Lescott i think did well in the tournament as a whole which was nice to see as a lot of people think Kompany does all the work so it was good to see him play well himself.
A formation change and gradual progression of players moving out/in is needed and i think Roy will oversee that well.
Fingers crossed Cleverely, Wilshere, AOC, Smalling, Jones, Walker, Richards and so on can keep themselves fit and really push themselves into the team next season.
Milner playing out wide to "protect" him was a waste. His best games for us have come in the centre although his best performance imo was at RM with Richards behind in the 1-6 so
....Lescott i think did well in the tournament as a whole which was nice to see as a lot of people think Kompany does all the work so it was good to see him play well himself.
A formation change and gradual progression of players moving out/in is needed and i think Roy will oversee that well.
Fingers crossed Cleverely, Wilshere, AOC, Smalling, Jones, Walker, Richards and so on can keep themselves fit and really push themselves into the team next season.
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He's been excellent for Liverpool for almost two seasons. Still makes the odd mistake like any defender but he's far more positionally aware than he used to be and doesn't just rely on his pace. Unfortunately for him he's been labelled so will never get the recognition his defending now deserves from some idiots (Ollie Holt I'm looking at you pencil neck)/media sheep
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He was good in 2004.
Indeed, surprise of the tournament (along with Gerrard), both exceeded my expectations by a long way, while Johnson had a few dodgy moments of switching off when CF's drifted between him and the CB, he always got back and made the tackle
Ashley Cole is our only world class player (especially when playing for England) Joe Hart has for some reason been massively over rated, heard commentators comparing him to Casillas
He's obviously a good 'keeper for his age but he has some very clear faults that he needs to improve, palms far too many shots out into his box into dangerous areas, his kicking has some way to go, he still flaps at crosses (had a few vs. France) etc. Great potential and already a good 'keeper, just a very familiar case of being overrated too early in his career (same for Wilshere, Walcott, Ox, Rooney etc.)
Yep that's why I never agree with buying a great player at 21 then saying when they reach their peak they will be awesome. They won't they usually just join a better side, especially English players. Very few get substantially better like Ronaldo or Henry did.
Rooney would frighten me less now than when he was 18/19. His finishing, pace, passing have certainly got worse not better. His temperament is the only thing that's got better.
People keep banging on about Rodwell, are these people actually watching him play? I'm more than happy for the over inflated hype to build in the hope we flog that pony for £20m to some unsuspecting numpty.
Oxy made a great point about the negativity and issues we had leading up to the tournament, fair point. It's still not going to be a reason why we still hump the ball right back to the opposition though. Had we played like we did for that 20 minute spell against Italy and lost 2-0 I'd find it a much better out look going forward that getting ****ed all over and hanging on for pens.
He was still an Everton player then, that's how far back it was that he was actually good for England. As I said he hasn't improved at all since leaving Everton, he's worse in a far far better team.
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10 years he has now been playing for England, 29 goals. A measly 2.9 goals per year. He should have absolutely smashed the England record by now in 10 years.
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As someone (I think it was Drunkenmaster 
) pointed out before, Rooney has lost the 'danger' that he once had.
He's still a very fine player, but a few years ago he could just 'do' amazing things, he still does now and again, but he's a much calmer person now and that hasn't made him better in my opinion.
It's also not helped by the fact that he plays as some kind of striker-come-midfielder, mainly due to the Man Utd midfield being sub-par against top sides.
) pointed out before, Rooney has lost the 'danger' that he once had.He's still a very fine player, but a few years ago he could just 'do' amazing things, he still does now and again, but he's a much calmer person now and that hasn't made him better in my opinion.
It's also not helped by the fact that he plays as some kind of striker-come-midfielder, mainly due to the Man Utd midfield being sub-par against top sides.