Greenlizard0 Weekend Football Thread ** spoilers ** [10 - 11th November 2012]

No he isn't that bad, he certainly has potential. What gets me is that he just doesn't look like he cares this season. It's like we've already given him the big contract and regular football and he just thinks he doesn't need to work for it any more.

He lacks commitment to the cause, aggression, and just sheer drive.

Countless times a match there are times where if he had the same kind of drive that the top players have he could reach a loose ball, get his head on a cross, get to that tap in or win that header.

He's got pace and strength and ability on the ball, just no.......ummf!
 
Ability wise and physically Welbeck is better than Hernandez, but Hernandez is sharper in front of goal and has a much better work ethic which in the makes Hernandez a far better football player.
 
He lacks commitment to the cause, aggression, and just sheer drive.

Countless times a match there are times where if he had the same kind of drive that the top players have he could reach a loose ball, get his head on a cross, get to that tap in or win that header.

He's got pace and strength and ability on the ball, just no.......ummf!

Good summary imo.

Welbeck fits into the growing group of players we have that are capable of brilliant things but are far too inconsistent (not sure whether it's a case of poor ability or attitude). It's the likes of Hernandez that are less flashy but far more effective that win you games and titles.
 
lol at Dowd saying he put his arm up and out. :D

Yeah, that was possibly the worst decision so far this season and he's a **** if he still defends it.
Wilshere was quoted earlier as saying they need a miracle to win the PL and that was as near to one as it comes and they still couldn't cash in on it. It's not a miracle they need now, it's more than that.
 
Podolski would likely have been sent off if he tried to take the penalty, what with having been subbed by that point :p

Can't remember if he took penalties at Everton but being off the pace the entire game, someone having a bad game should basically never take a penalty, though conversely if that could be described as one of Giroud's better games, what would then happen to his confidence if he missed that penalty himself?

Personally i would have gone Arshavin, Verm, Giroud and Arteta if none of those guys would step up.

EDIT;- our current form book puts us on course for a 55 point finish this year, which last season would have seen us in 7th just ahead of Liverpool.

Obviously games are different and you play different teams at different times. Last year though our home form at the same stage was 5 wins and 1 loss, this year its 2 wins, 2 draws and a loss. Last season our away form was worse at this point but we also had a very hard run of away games which we've yet to match this season. We're now 3 points behind where we were, and considering the team we have and crap defence I just can't see us gaining that back. If Spurs happened to win tomorrow we'd be 12 points off the top and 4 points off 6th, if we lose next week we could be 6 points off 6th place quite easily.

Giroud did look better today, which is a positive, but just about everyone else looked worse. The biggest problem is, as usual that our defence simply looks clueless, they have done for several years. One game with huge mistakes, even 3-4 games with terrible form but a decent defence to get back to form is one thing, but our defence hasn't looked good fullstop for years, and I can't see where we'll magically get our defence working. Wenger needs to either bring in a defensive coach(Bould clearly hasn't made the slightest changes) and give over defensive responsibility to them completely, or we need a new manager. I mean City look pretty dodgy defensively so far, but we've seen them be excellent only last season, if they can get back to where they were last season they won't have a problem. Arsenal, if we get back to last seasons defensive form, is barely above what we have now.
 
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DIMITAR. It's a real privilege seeing him in a Fulham shirt.

Seriously sloppy goals for us to concede, no idea what Hughes was doing for the second in particular.

On another note an Arsenal fan was in the away end; got chucked out the moment they scored the first; was seriously odd to see it.
 
I think berbatiov does best when hes not under constant pressure. at fulham hes okay to miss the odd one and put a couple away where hed get insulted at utd for doing hte same thing.

Hope hernandez gets the goal bonus for all 3 he deserves iot for regrouping 3 points there
 
Not understanding the Wellbeck hate at all

He's a local lad which is something a lot of teams wouldn't mind having. Yeah he's going through a bit of bad form but he really is nowhere near as bad as what people are saying he is.

Id sy hes better outside the box on the ball thasn hernandez, but as a striker he lacks composure and that killer finish that hernandez has shown.
 
The penalty wasn't that bad to be honest.

It wasn't hit with power and was in the single most saveable spot in the goal. Slow = down the middle or bang in the corner, or its extremely saveable, power, pretty much anywhere but still best as far away from the keeper as possible. Half way between the keeper and post is stupidly saveable especially when not hit with major power. If a goal keeper doesn't dive far, he'll still easily reach it, if the gk dived for the post, it will still hit his body/legs most likely, it was a very very poor penalty, one that screamed no confidence(slow and not risking going over or past the post).

I think berbatiov does best when hes not under constant pressure. at fulham hes okay to miss the odd one and put a couple away where hed get insulted at utd for doing hte same thing.

Everyone at Utd gets insulted for doing badly in a single game, berbatov neither got better nor worse after being insulted, he was brilliant in the vast majority of his games, if he however scored a couple, then didn't score, you all went mental about what little he did. It wasn't goals today that was important, he held it up till he had support, passed brilliantly, scored when required, created goals and created chances, he did this for you every game. Beyond Utd fans thinking 30mil instantly meant he'd score more than anyone else every season, he was great in most of his games, you guys just found a variety of ridiculous reasons to think he was crap because he didn't score loads.

His game is deep striker setting up the game, where he is just massively better than Rooney. One of Utd's best seasons in recent history were with Berbatov playing deeper and Rooney having his best scoring season playing as a proper striker without peeing around deep, that is Rooney's strength and Berbatov's. Top player, criminally under appreciated by Utd fans.

Id sy hes better outside the box on the ball thasn hernandez, but as a striker he lacks composure and that killer finish that hernandez has shown.

Welbeck's build up play is crap, his composure is hilariously poor, Hernandez before this season was awful in his build up play and very good finishing, this season his hold up play has been almost astonishingly improved, and his crossing and quite a bit of his passing. As with Nani a few years ago I'll say the same thing, 2 out of 2 and a bit seasons, he was poo in his all around game, a full season being good and another season not back to his old self(like Nani did) then I'll change my mind, a few months of playing better as yet means not an awful lot.

He has been dramatically improved though and if he can maintain that you finally have a useful player, currently he is miles better than Welbeck.

Those who are saying Welbeck shows potential and his build up player/physicality shows potential, they don't. A flukey back heel once a season doesn't make a player, he's been completely rubbish in 95% of the games he's played so far, doesn't show any potential for improvement and starting him over Berbatov was a monumental screw up. Considering you lost the title on goal difference, I laugh at the idea Utd started Welbeck most of the season over Berbatov.

EDIT:-

Last season
Welbeck 23 starts 7 subs, 9 goals, 4 assists 80 shots.

Berbs, 5 starts 7 subs 7 goals, no assists, 16 shots.

This season
Welbeck 5 starts 3 sub 1 goal 1 assist 16 shots

Berbs 6 starts 1 sub, 5 goals, 3 assists 24 shots.

Fulham haven't lost when he started, the only game they lost he came on half way through in his first appearance, Fulham were vastly improved in the second half and all three goals conceded were in the half he didn't play. He has been simply outstanding for them, home and away and every single goal or assist he has provided has resulted in Fulham either drawing or winning a game so far.
 
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It wasn't hit with power and was in the single most saveable spot in the goal. Slow = down the middle or bang in the corner, or its extremely saveable, power, pretty much anywhere but still best as far away from the keeper as possible. Half way between the keeper and post is stupidly saveable especially when not hit with major power. If a goal keeper doesn't dive far, he'll still easily reach it, if the gk dived for the post, it will still hit his body/legs most likely, it was a very very poor penalty, one that screamed no confidence(slow and not risking going over or past the post).



Everyone at Utd gets insulted for doing badly in a single game, berbatov neither got better nor worse after being insulted, he was brilliant in the vast majority of his games, if he however scored a couple, then didn't score, you all went mental about what little he did. It wasn't goals today that was important, he held it up till he had support, passed brilliantly, scored when required, created goals and created chances, he did this for you every game. Beyond Utd fans thinking 30mil instantly meant he'd score more than anyone else every season, he was great in most of his games, you guys just found a variety of ridiculous reasons to think he was crap because he didn't score loads.

His game is deep striker setting up the game, where he is just massively better than Rooney. One of Utd's best seasons in recent history were with Berbatov playing deeper and Rooney having his best scoring season playing as a proper striker without peeing around deep, that is Rooney's strength and Berbatov's. Top player, criminally under appreciated by Utd fans.



Welbeck's build up play is crap, his composure is hilariously poor, Hernandez before this season was awful in his build up play and very good finishing, this season his hold up play has been almost astonishingly improved, and his crossing and quite a bit of his passing. As with Nani a few years ago I'll say the same thing, 2 out of 2 and a bit seasons, he was poo in his all around game, a full season being good and another season not back to his old self(like Nani did) then I'll change my mind, a few months of playing better as yet means not an awful lot.

He has been dramatically improved though and if he can maintain that you finally have a useful player, currently he is miles better than Welbeck.

Those who are saying Welbeck shows potential and his build up player/physicality shows potential, they don't. A flukey back heel once a season doesn't make a player, he's been completely rubbish in 95% of the games he's played so far, doesn't show any potential for improvement and starting him over Berbatov was a monumental screw up. Considering you lost the title on goal difference, I laugh at the idea Utd started Welbeck most of the season over Berbatov.

EDIT:-

Last season
Welbeck 23 starts 7 subs, 9 goals, 4 assists 80 shots.

Berbs, 5 starts 7 subs 7 goals, no assists, 16 shots.

This season
Welbeck 5 starts 3 sub 1 goal 1 assist 16 shots

Berbs 6 starts 1 sub, 5 goals, 3 assists 24 shots.

Fulham haven't lost when he started, the only game they lost he came on half way through in his first appearance, Fulham were vastly improved in the second half and all three goals conceded were in the half he didn't play. He has been simply outstanding for them, home and away and every single goal or assist he has provided has resulted in Fulham either drawing or winning a game so far.

Bore off with your constant drivel slating players who do not play for your team.
 
some united fans on here whine so much :/

Enjoyed the game yesterday, I had to sit in the Holt so had to remember to match y emotions to the home crowd. Someone hugged me when the 2nd went in for villa and I had to clench my fists for a second ;) I enjoyed it far more when we came back though. Bit of overdramatic booing etc.

We were very static and I thought Valencia had a poor game on the whole, I think we must have had a good 60% possession in the first half but none of that translated into a clear chance or sustained pressure. Hernandez was very good when he came on though, he's improved his general play dramatically from last season in my opinion. Last season I thought that, at times, he barely looked like a professional footballer but this year he's developed other aspects while still keeping his goal scoring instincts. He's a fantastic option to have.
 
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