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Intel demos XeSS super resolution -open-AI-AMD/Nvidia can use it

Rroff said:
I'm using a Philips 436M6 (G-Sync compatible) alongside a Dell S2716DG (G-Sync FPGA) currently - I'm generally pretty happy with the adaptive sync on the Philips but at the end of the day it is no G-Sync w/ FPGA and it is one of the better adaptive sync implementations aside from only having a 48-60Hz refresh range - some monitors are worse (including ones with the full refresh range).

I don't get how eagerly so many posters in this section settle for second best - not jumping on the nVidia G-Sync train fine but like with FSR, etc. so many seem to settle, with a lot of bigging it up, for an inferior version with very little demand for the technology being the best it can be and that makes no sense to me.

Adaptive sync for instance is based on pushing features like panel self refresh and other technologies unrelated to adaptive sync but happening to have some overlap with needed functionality into a type of use they weren't originally designed for and while it works there are a lot of improvements which could be made if it had been designed from the ground up towards these ends.
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So much this. People are not getting that the module usually gives a better experience. I had a Predator 4k 32 inch with a Gsync module and even down in the 30s it made a huge difference. I then got the CP437KP which was Gsync compatible over 48hz which for me is pointless given that at 4k Gsync was a life save for super intensive games which hover around the 40fps mark. Ive now got an LGCX48 as a my monitor and while its Gsync compatible over 40hz now, which is better, its still not as smooth as that module. As much as I love my CX I wish it had one. Its the single thing I would wish for to add to this panel.
 
oldestgregg said:
So much this. People are not getting that the module usually gives a better experience. I had a Predator 4k 32 inch with a Gsync module and even down in the 30s it made a huge difference. I then got the CP437KP which was Gsync compatible over 48hz which for me is pointless given that at 4k Gsync was a life save for super intensive games which hover around the 40fps mark. Ive now got an LGCX48 as a my monitor and while its Gsync compatible over 40hz now, which is better, its still not as smooth as that module. As much as I love my CX I wish it had one. Its the single thing I would wish for to add to this panel.
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All depends on personal needs and preferences. I had Acer Predator (forgot exact model) 1440p IPS with gsync module, then changed to LG gsync compatible (certified) and LG behaves better for me. Not only panel itself is better and reacting faster but I see no difference in smoothness at all (and I am very sensitive for it) - though I never ever drop below 60FPS (but even 60 is NOT smooth for me - I am used to seeing min. 85 these days).

It all really depends on what quality of panel and electronics inside one gets - cheap freesync monitors usually are not great but the better ones (especially certified by NVIDIA as gsync compatible) often behave at least as good as the ones with gsync module. Worth remembering is that the module is actually behind in features comparing to freesync/gsync-compatible good monitors, e.g. it doesn't support HDMI 2.1 etc.
 
Tinek said:
All depends on personal needs and preferences. I had Acer Predator (forgot exact model) 1440p IPS with gsync module, then changed to LG gsync compatible (certified) and LG behaves better for me. Not only panel itself is better and reacting faster but I see no difference in smoothness at all (and I am very sensitive for it) - though I never ever drop below 60FPS (but even 60 is NOT smooth for me - I am used to seeing min. 85 these days).

It all really depends on what quality of panel and electronics inside one gets - cheap freesync monitors usually are not great but the better ones (especially certified by NVIDIA as gsync compatible) often behave at least as good as the ones with gsync module. Worth remembering is that the module is actually behind in features comparing to freesync/gsync-compatible good monitors, e.g. it doesn't support HDMI 2.1 etc.
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Yeah I get it but I think that the most noticeable part of Gsync for me was when I was down into the 40s and 50s, which you are right isnt smooth these days, but did feel smoother with the module.
 
oldestgregg said:
Yeah I get it but I think that the most noticeable part of Gsync for me was when I was down into the 40s and 50s, which you are right isnt smooth these days, but did feel smoother with the module.
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Doubling of frame rate, exactly the same happens with FreeSync and Low Frame Rate compensation (LFC) but this is only certified for FreeSync displays meeting the FreeSync Premium and Premium Pro standards.

You are referring to the standard FreeSync monitors which were around at launch that don't support this feature or the FreeSync range does not fall within the >2x requirement for LFC.

What is Low Framerate Compensation?
Low framerate compensation (LFC), allows FreeSync technology to work when the framerate falls below the minimum refresh rate of the display. When the framerate drops below the minimum refresh rate of the display, frames are duplicated and displayed multiple times so that they can sync to a refresh rate that is within the displays refresh rate range. For example, a display with a 60 – 144Hz refresh rate, would be able to sync the frames of a game running at 40 FPS, by doubling them so that the display could sync and run at 80 Hz. A display with LFC effectively results in the removal of the minimum refresh rate boundary. All displays in the FreeSync Premium and FreeSync Premium Pro tier are certified to meet mandatory LFC requirements.

If you think that a Gsync module at 40-50 FPS will be smoother on the same monitor than using FreeSync Premium/Pro on the same monitor, you are mistaken.
 
LtMatt said:
Nope, Overdrive only adjusts the monitors overshoot setting and that can be adjusted on almost all displays in this day and age.
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The G-Sync module has dynamically tuned variable overdrive which reduces ghosting and overshoot as the frame rate/refresh changes - most FreeSync monitors have fixed overdrive (usually tuned for the highest refresh) or a more basic implementation of adaptive or dynamic overdrive. The FPGA gives you more ability to predict pixel changes in a way that isn't possible with a standard monitor scaler.

Gets a bit complicated as well as the monitor technology (panel type) and performance have an impact there as to how noticeable the difference is.

It will have minimal impact on smoothness - in fact can actually work against it as the changes are more distinct but can significantly improve the experience at lower frame rates in terms of how clear the image is perceived.

LFC on FreeSync in theory can make things smoother than G-Sync with the FPGA and can be useful in that respect for things outside of gaming but comes at a cost to responsiveness - for pure gaming use the G-Sync FPGA can be a bonus there but it can come at a penalty for all around monitor use where some things might feel slightly stuttery in comparison due to the less consistent frame timings.

How smooth things feel at fluctuating lower frame rates will largely come down to panel to panel and if they aren't feeling smooth with FS on vs G-Sync then the panel implementation is probably quite poor to start with before you even get to those technologies.
 
LtMatt said:
Doubling of frame rate, exactly the same happens with FreeSync and Low Frame Rate compensation (LFC) but this is only certified for FreeSync displays meeting the FreeSync Premium and Premium Pro standards.

You are referring to the standard FreeSync monitors which were around at launch that don't support this feature or the FreeSync range does not fall within the >2x requirement for LFC.

What is Low Framerate Compensation?
Low framerate compensation (LFC), allows FreeSync technology to work when the framerate falls below the minimum refresh rate of the display. When the framerate drops below the minimum refresh rate of the display, frames are duplicated and displayed multiple times so that they can sync to a refresh rate that is within the displays refresh rate range. For example, a display with a 60 – 144Hz refresh rate, would be able to sync the frames of a game running at 40 FPS, by doubling them so that the display could sync and run at 80 Hz. A display with LFC effectively results in the removal of the minimum refresh rate boundary. All displays in the FreeSync Premium and FreeSync Premium Pro tier are certified to meet mandatory LFC requirements.

If you think that a Gsync module at 40-50 FPS will be smoother on the same monitor than using FreeSync Premium/Pro on the same monitor, you are mistaken.
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So if I have a monitor now that does not kick in Gsync under 48hz ,theres no difference with a monitor that has Gsync below 48hz?
 
oldestgregg said:
So if I have a monitor now that does not kick in Gsync under 48hz ,theres no difference with a monitor that has Gsync below 48hz?
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I'm not sure if 'G-Sync compatible' has an LFC feature. Perhaps it doesn't, you are using a LG CX OLED right?

I am using the same display and can confirm LFC kicks in when FPS drops below 40 with FreeSync.

See this article here.

The supported frequency range for AMD FreeSync Premium in LG 2020 TVs is 40-120Hz. Below that range, LFC (Low Framerate Compensation) kicks in.
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humbug said:
And pay $150 for a lump of hardware that does nothing but heat up your display? Then you're a fool.
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Exactly. I have a Dell S2721DGF 144Hz monitor and have used it on AMD and Nvidia cards and the motion is buttery smooth on both. Not sure how a more expensive hardware Gsync monitor would be any better.
 
oldestgregg said:
Yeah I get it but I think that the most noticeable part of Gsync for me was when I was down into the 40s and 50s, which you are right isnt smooth these days, but did feel smoother with the module.
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I personally didn't notice the difference in that regard between my LG C1 OLED and my Dell S2716DG Gsync monitor and of course the former has a far superior panel with much better response times.

Framerate doubling seems to start at around 45 FPS on the LG whereas I think it's 30 FPS on the Dell with the GSync module, so perhaps that's what you are feeling.
 
Looking forward to games that support this, Intel have the clout to push a standard where AMD are lacking. That XeSS works on everything could be a massive success for everyone (except Nvidia tryhards maybe).

Hopefully reviewers start testing all these upscaling technologies in motion, rather than pixel peeping 400% cropped screenshots
 
d_brennen said:
Looking forward to games that support this, Intel have the clout to push a standard where AMD are lacking. That XeSS works on everything could be a massive success for everyone (except Nvidia tryhards maybe).

Hopefully reviewers start testing all these upscaling technologies in motion, rather than pixel peeping 400% cropped screenshots
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Unless they are pushing ray tracing hard, I'm not a fan personally of any of these upscaling techniques. Though they can be useful for those on lower end hardware.
 
Wrinkly said:
Rather than argue about G-Sync benefits, why not simply google it?
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I had in the past Acer Predator IPS 1440p screen with G-Sync module and then switched a bit till I ended up happy with my LG Ultrawide G-Sync Compatible/FreeSync Pro. Out of these 2, I would pick LG every single time but it's not because of it having G-Sync module or not - it simply has MUCH better panel. G-Sync module monitors usually have good panels too, whereas cheap Freesync ones tend to have cheap panels with high reaction times and just not good in general.

If anything, I really like NVIDIA's G-sync compatible program, as they're very strict in testing monitors and I can be sure that if I buy one with their sticker on it, it will work great both with AMD and NVIDIA GPUs, with no flickering (that instantly disqualifies such monitor on their tests), low reaction times etc.
 
Tinek said:
I had in the past Acer Predator IPS 1440p screen with G-Sync module and then switched a bit till I ended up happy with my LG Ultrawide G-Sync Compatible/FreeSync Pro. Out of these 2, I would pick LG every single time but it's not because of it having G-Sync module or not - it simply has MUCH better panel. G-Sync module monitors usually have good panels too, whereas cheap Freesync ones tend to have cheap panels with high reaction times and just not good in general.

If anything, I really like NVIDIA's G-sync compatible program, as they're very strict in testing monitors and I can be sure that if I buy one with their sticker on it, it will work great both with AMD and NVIDIA GPUs, with no flickering (that instantly disqualifies such monitor on their tests), low reaction times etc.
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I settled on a LG-32GP850 for now as I realised I will need a custom desk built for the wide panels. It's been great with a 3080 so far, but lacks the variable overdrive.

I've been very much against G-Sync in the past due to it locking people in. I'm very happy to see Nvidia now offering adaptive sync support on newer modules for AMD and presumably Intel in the future.
 
Wrinkly said:
I settled on a LG-32GP850 for now as I realised I will need a custom desk built for the wide panels. It's been great with a 3080 so far, but lacks the variable overdrive.

I've been very much against G-Sync in the past due to it locking people in. I'm very happy to see Nvidia now offering adaptive sync support on newer modules for AMD and presumably Intel in the future.
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I haven't had issues with reaction times of current panel even with lower FPS - it's just very good in very wide range of refresh rates. Variable override is mostly useful for panels that actually need it but good modern panels seem to be working just fine without it. Which is great for everyone, really - but costly.

Same thoughts about g-sync and in general any tech that takes away my freedom of choice. I like to play around with both "camps" (and soon Intel too), and I don't want to change monitor each time I swap GPU, as that would be just silly.
 
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