oh lawdy, i'm going to have to sift through his post history, i know from memory he does not believe white people to be superior, so that's a pretty fundamental defining point that doesn't match. bear with me
Is it ok to be proud to be white?
- Thread starter rubberduck
- Start date
Here we see the insidious face of modern 'liberal' racism.
The belief that some examples of politics an culture that devopled in majority white countries are a representative themselves of 'whiteness'.
Cheesy's statement is very different to the (somewhat true) statement...
'white people (currently) dominate culture and poltics (in the west)'
Rather it implies (most concerningly with poltics) that there is an inherently 'white' way to deal with poltics and express culture.
Some of the most successful societies have been thoose that have embraced parts of other cultures (which is rather different to being destroyed by or consumed by another culture and doesn't require any significant immigration or demographic change).
Take for example countries like South Korea and Japan that incorporated elements of 'western' culture and politics into their own countries and turned from hermit states into modern exporting nations with high standards of living.
The belief that there is an inherently 'white' (and therefore a multitude of other ethnicity based and mutually exclusive) poltics and culture is the insidious face of "progressive" racism.
It is this sort of thinking that leads to educated, well spoken black people who have the wrong poltics in places like the UK and USA being called all sorts of rather nasty names often by people who laughably may claim themselves to be anti racists/ fascists.
ok, i've found a statement to the effect "britain should remain white and governed by white people" the basis seems to be that
a) it's always been white. shrug at this.
b) white people will be treated poorly should they lose control of government. I find that hard to argue against that concern given that white people are already treated poorly by a government elected by majority whites.
if i am to accept wikipedia's opening definition of white supremacy "White supremacy or white supremacism is the racist belief that white people are superior to people of other races and therefore should be dominant over them." i'm sruggling to meet the conditions.
a)white people superior. NO, said words to effect does not believe white to be superior.
b) because of said superiority, whites should be dominant over non-whites. NO, said whites needed control over government to avoid oppression. no indication that such power is for the purpose of dominating non-whites.
the outcomes may be the same but the intention is what counts, no? fill me in if I missed something important.
a) it's always been white. shrug at this.
b) white people will be treated poorly should they lose control of government. I find that hard to argue against that concern given that white people are already treated poorly by a government elected by majority whites.
if i am to accept wikipedia's opening definition of white supremacy "White supremacy or white supremacism is the racist belief that white people are superior to people of other races and therefore should be dominant over them." i'm sruggling to meet the conditions.
a)white people superior. NO, said words to effect does not believe white to be superior.
b) because of said superiority, whites should be dominant over non-whites. NO, said whites needed control over government to avoid oppression. no indication that such power is for the purpose of dominating non-whites.
the outcomes may be the same but the intention is what counts, no? fill me in if I missed something important.
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Splitting hairs here.
i added an edit, that there's no mention whatsoever that this is for the purpose of dominating the non-whites.
you're making an unfair inference
Quite clearly, you have utterly failed to grasp what was being discussed, and have wasted an awful lot of words demonstrating it.
I suggest going back and reading properly
I'm really not.
He's suggesting that whites should retain dominance to protect their own interests. He acknowledges that currently other races face discrimination as minorities, but thinks whites should be protected from that reversing. They deserve it due to historic achievement that earned the right. White exceptionalism.
not supremacist yet
still not supremacist
heritage (not heredity, scuse) and in group preference. still not supremacism.
now you keep using exceptionalism and I did ask you to define a difference between supremacy and exceptionalism as google gave me no joy. are you ready to explain what you mean yet?
Exceptionalism is the belief that something is better or more deserving. It is exceptional.
White supremacy carries the exceptional belief, but also the philosophy that whites should be dominant as a result.
To be honest, there's not a lot between the two other than exceptionalism being a bit softer, avoiding causing so much offense in discourse.
You're still splitting hairs, by the way
he said he doesn't believe white people are better than non-whites and he made no expression of interest in dominating non-whites. I think you've just got some hate tinted lenses on.
I don't think so.. .
I think I quite accurately summoned up your post you didn't say for example "white people (currently) dominate (western) culture and politics" rather you used the phrase 'whiteness'
I. E you believe theres some sort of inherent 'white' way to express culture and carry out politics (and implicitly a multidue of other ethnic based and to varying degrees mutually exclusive ways)
You can try and squirm your way out of it you want but you have been caught out and I suspect you now know it.
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Caporegime
- Joined
- 30 Jul 2013
- Posts
- 29,671
You are so weird.
Using racist language (itsybitsy) now are we? Hoooooooweeee
Anyway, no you’ll find it’s quite difficult to make a self improving society work among predators, drought and war. Which is exactly why sub Saharan Africa isn’t leading the pack, so shall we tumble down that spiral together? Or do you want to stop now.
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This threads taken an interesting turn from when I last posted.
There's a lot of blending of race defines culture and government talk.
I think its easy to say European governments are superior to African ones as most Europeans have abandoned tribalism in favour of nationhood and are not as fragmented.
That's 100% not a racial white, supremacist statement. However if you are inclined, both sides would use it for or against.
Also it's so weird how Japs is considered racist but Brits isnt.
Good old ww2. Still giving us nonsense to get wound up about years later.
I do like that Japanese example. They did stand Upto round 1 of western cultural imperialism, although they finally succumbed post ww2 and occupation.
Does anyone get anxty if I say 300 years of European culture is superior in every single aspect to that of an Amazonian rainforest tribe?
I've changed my opinion slightly I am "happy"to be white living in a region of the world were white people are naturally dominant.
I'd also be happy to be "yellow" or "brown" if I lived in China or Africa. Chances are I'd know no better, live my life in complete happiness and not have to deal with the constant BS of white guilt and the sin's of my father's from 300 years ago where everyone was still dominated by the fear of religion and using it to either line their pockets or control minds.
The rise of supremacist views is directly correlated to the rise over the past 20 years of opposite factions of near Marxist ideology.
Social media takes the nonsense of both sides, magnifies and fabricates it by 100000x to make it look like either extreme opinion is actually important, rams it down your throat until you are sick of all it and would quite happily buy an "assault rifle" and go shoot a bunch of Nazis or Marxists or both of you got lucky.
I do blame social media.
It is the both the biggest curse and liberational blessing on humanity since monotheistic beliefs.
You can feed BS directly into someone's pocket 24/7 and warp and control them through censorship and manipulation of info. People lap this up, with cat photos, brainwashed into believing whatever is the cultural narrative of that month.
Oh lordy in losing it
Off to buy 10000 rounds of 5.56 for my ww3 supply bunker.
There's a lot of blending of race defines culture and government talk.
I think its easy to say European governments are superior to African ones as most Europeans have abandoned tribalism in favour of nationhood and are not as fragmented.
That's 100% not a racial white, supremacist statement. However if you are inclined, both sides would use it for or against.
Also it's so weird how Japs is considered racist but Brits isnt.
Good old ww2. Still giving us nonsense to get wound up about years later.
I do like that Japanese example. They did stand Upto round 1 of western cultural imperialism, although they finally succumbed post ww2 and occupation.
Does anyone get anxty if I say 300 years of European culture is superior in every single aspect to that of an Amazonian rainforest tribe?
I've changed my opinion slightly I am "happy"to be white living in a region of the world were white people are naturally dominant.
I'd also be happy to be "yellow" or "brown" if I lived in China or Africa. Chances are I'd know no better, live my life in complete happiness and not have to deal with the constant BS of white guilt and the sin's of my father's from 300 years ago where everyone was still dominated by the fear of religion and using it to either line their pockets or control minds.
The rise of supremacist views is directly correlated to the rise over the past 20 years of opposite factions of near Marxist ideology.
Social media takes the nonsense of both sides, magnifies and fabricates it by 100000x to make it look like either extreme opinion is actually important, rams it down your throat until you are sick of all it and would quite happily buy an "assault rifle" and go shoot a bunch of Nazis or Marxists or both of you got lucky.
I do blame social media.
It is the both the biggest curse and liberational blessing on humanity since monotheistic beliefs.
You can feed BS directly into someone's pocket 24/7 and warp and control them through censorship and manipulation of info. People lap this up, with cat photos, brainwashed into believing whatever is the cultural narrative of that month.
Oh lordy in losing it
Off to buy 10000 rounds of 5.56 for my ww3 supply bunker.
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I'm afraid I completely disagree with you. You can be proud that you own a particular car no matter how you obtained it.
I suppose the real question is why shouldn't it be OK to be proud of being White?
After all, it seems to be fine to be proud of being Gay/Trannie/Black/Scottish/Welsh/Irish/Muslim/Vegan/whatever.
Indeed it seems to be fine to have parades, representative organisations, even SIG associations and clubs (Even within the public sector EG http://www.nbpa.co.uk/ and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Association_of_Muslim_Police) and of course special awards ceremonies (EG http://beta.mobo.com/ )
It seems at the only thing one is not supposed to be proud of these days is being White/English! (Oh, and Male of course. White, English and Male is the hat-trick for not really being supposed to be proud about anything these days)
:/
After all, it seems to be fine to be proud of being Gay/Trannie/Black/Scottish/Welsh/Irish/Muslim/Vegan/whatever.
Indeed it seems to be fine to have parades, representative organisations, even SIG associations and clubs (Even within the public sector EG http://www.nbpa.co.uk/ and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Association_of_Muslim_Police) and of course special awards ceremonies (EG http://beta.mobo.com/ )
It seems at the only thing one is not supposed to be proud of these days is being White/English! (Oh, and Male of course. White, English and Male is the hat-trick for not really being supposed to be proud about anything these days)
:/
This is the essence of it. The "It's Okay To Be White" and a lot of this debate is because abuse is coming from the same source: people feeling attacked for their skin colour. The mainstream media, Western academia and social networking platforms are a continual assault on people for being White. White privilege, White this, White that. A lot of people who happen to be White are now feeling what other groups have often felt and are having the same natural reaction: many are saying it's okay to be White, that they aren't ashamed of it and have pride in the achievements of White people generally. Just as any other group does. And a minority take it further into full on supremacy positions for whatever personal factors have made them do so.
The only way to deescalate these tensions is to stop this obsessive focus on race. Either by the media stopping it or people ignoring said media. Skin colour doesn't matter. Culture and values matter.
"I'm not white and therefore my intentions are obviously good and I have no agenda of my own...." seems to be the default narrative in the media these days!
I think we should arrange a "Men's March", "Pro-British" or a "Straight Pride Parade"! It's weird how these terms would likely be considered negative, offensive and discriminatory whereas the opposite is somehow considered 'progressive'and actively encouraged?
I think we should arrange a "Men's March", "Pro-British" or a "Straight Pride Parade"! It's weird how these terms would likely be considered negative, offensive and discriminatory whereas the opposite is somehow considered 'progressive'and actively encouraged?
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I often wonder the mindset of the prolific far left and right posters in these kinds of threads. Do you think you're going to change the minds of each other with all of these dull circular arguments? And 76 posts by a single poster in a thread of 600 posts, have a word with yourselves and how you spend your time.