"Just stop oil"

Its basically not going to happen. There are too many countries that depend on polluting or their very way of life would be completely changed if we actually did what was necessary. Add in the fact that many of the decision makers won't even be around to suffer the consequences of their actions and its very unlikely.

And for those emerging countries, I can see that they have a point too. All of the current major world economies got to where they are today by utterly destroying the climate and now we are trying to pull up the ladder to less industrailized nations and saying "tough luck". I can see why those countries continue to act the way they do (although to be clear, I don't agree with it either).

We strictly prohibit other countries from having clean nuclear energy, but offer them no alternatives than burning coal / gas either.

Although I'm glad to see that the new leader of Brazil has vowed to stop the deforestation of the Amazon. It's a step in the right direction.
 
I think its completely reasonable to suspect distractions based on ******* causing a nuisance.
You think its completely reasonable to suggest the accident occurred was because they were taking "avoiding action" to a protestor despite no news outlet saying that was the case?

Ok.
 
I think its completely reasonable to suspect distractions based on ******* causing a nuisance.
Distracted or not the lorry driver is still at fault, there are distractions every time you drive a vehicle it is the responsibility of the driver to manage the distractions and drive safely otherwise fiddling with the radio or shouting at the kids would be an acceptable excuse for running over old ladies.
 
And for those emerging countries, I can see that they have a point too. All of the current major world economies got to where they are today by utterly destroying the climate and now we are trying to pull up the ladder to less industrailized nations and saying "tough luck". I can see why those countries continue to act the way they do (although to be clear, I don't agree with it either).

We strictly prohibit other countries from having clean nuclear energy, but offer them no alternatives than burning coal / gas either.

Although I'm glad to see that the new leader of Brazil has vowed to stop the deforestation of the Amazon. It's a step in the right direction.
This was my view as well... and kind of still is............ but a friend of mine countered me saying something similar to the above with the following..... i have not fact checked the numbers but this sounds plausible too.

================================

While there may be some truth that western countries have added to climate change.... it is also true that, other experts have suggested that the reason Pakistan experiences such terrible flooding is because they have cut down all their trees. Pakistan has the highest rate of deforestation in the world. When their nation was created in 1947, 33% of the total land mass was covered by forests; now that area is only 5%. Because of the lack of trees, the rain runs straight off the mountains into the silted up reservoirs which then overflow.

In addition, Pakistan has always had major floods, many just as catastrophic as the recent one. The 1950 flood, for example, killed twice as many people as the 2022 flood within a much lower population. Not every natural disaster can be blamed on the United Kingdom, gratifying and lucrative though that accusation may be.

Pakistan is already one of the UK's biggest recipients of aid. In 2019/20 they received around £302 million from our heavily indebted country, spanning areas including human development, climate and the environment. Most British people would consider that quite a generous gift to a nation which has its own nuclear weapons and a space programme. Pakistan also has more than a thousand coal mines. I do wonder whether they have any concerns about their impact or was it just British coal mines which caused a problem?

Plus, the present population of Pakistan is 225 million (up from 65 million in 1970) which will inevitably add to pressure on the environment.

The proposition, is that Pakistan should now receive "loss and damage" compensation from UK for the "cost" of historic emissions. How is that bill to be calculated exactly?

On the list of "developing countries" with their hand out is China. The country which has emitted more carbon dioxide over the past eight years than the UK has since the start of the Industrial Revolution.
 
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Distracted or not the lorry driver is still at fault, there are distractions every time you drive a vehicle it is the responsibility of the driver to manage the distractions and drive safely otherwise fiddling with the radio or shouting at the kids would be an acceptable excuse for running over old ladies.
agreed, but cant ignore the mass disruption and distraction of their being people climbing overhead gantry's and trying to distract and disrupt people through their signage.
You think its completely reasonable to suggest the accident occurred was because they were taking "avoiding action" to a protestor despite no news outlet saying that was the case?

Ok.
Who's reaching now....
I think its completely acceptable and reasonable to suggest an incident has occurred due to the nuisance these protestors are causing. Hell there's 40 pages here of people agreeing that their methods are going too far and could have serious consequences on themselves and others.
 
agreed, but cant ignore the mass disruption and distraction of their being people climbing overhead gantry's and trying to distract and disrupt people through their signage.

Who's reaching now....
I think its completely acceptable and reasonable to suggest an incident has occurred due to the nuisance these protestors are causing. Hell there's 40 pages here of people agreeing that their methods are going too far and could have serious consequences on themselves and others.
Whats a reach?
 
agreed, but cant ignore the mass disruption and distraction of their being people climbing overhead gantry's and trying to distract and disrupt people through their signage.

Who's reaching now....
I think its completely acceptable and reasonable to suggest an incident has occurred due to the nuisance these protestors are causing. Hell there's 40 pages here of people agreeing that their methods are going too far and could have serious consequences on themselves and others.
Someone climbing a gantry shouldn’t cause a massive distraction for a trained professional driver. Especially in a rolling roadblock. In a rolling roadblock you should be even more alert as there’s an obvious hazard. The lorry driver here clearly wasn’t paying attention.
Since we are putting protesters (who are highlighting an issue the government accept is real and an issue) in prison, and journalists in handcuffs, hopefully this driver will also be imprisoned for their crimes.

Sad news that the police arrested and detained a journalist yesterday. Complete abuse of power and just a sign of what’s to come with our authoritarian government and their bill of “rights”.
 
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Whats a reach?
I dont really fancy going back and telling you what you replied with every time nor go round in circles like this, but just for comedy sake this one and only time, again you have reached to the conclusion that;
"You think its completely reasonable to suggest the accident occurred was because they were taking "avoiding action" to a protestor despite no news outlet saying that was the case?"

This is not what I was suggesting what so ever and have no point in this thread confirmed that I believe they were avoiding a protestor. I used the words distracted from ******* climbing gantry's and putting up additional disruptive signage.
Someone climbing a gantry shouldn’t cause a massive distraction for a trained professional driver. Especially in a rolling roadblock. In a rolling roadblock you should be even more alert as there’s an obvious hazard. The lorry driver here clearly wasn’t paying attention.
Unless you were there and know exactly what was displayed, how can you identify that it was NOT a distraction for them. Would you be saying the same thing if it wasnt a lorry driver and just a person on their commute to work?
 
I dont really fancy going back and telling you what you replied with every time nor go round in circles like this, but just for comedy sake this one and only time, again you have reached to the conclusion that;
"You think its completely reasonable to suggest the accident occurred was because they were taking "avoiding action" to a protestor despite no news outlet saying that was the case?"

This is not what I was suggesting what so ever and have no point in this thread confirmed that I believe they were avoiding a protestor. I used the words distracted from ******* climbing gantry's and putting up additional disruptive signage.
Right but thats was the poster said and thats what we were replying to isnt it.
 
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I dont really fancy going back and telling you what you replied with every time nor go round in circles like this, but just for comedy sake this one and only time, again you have reached to the conclusion that;
"You think its completely reasonable to suggest the accident occurred was because they were taking "avoiding action" to a protestor despite no news outlet saying that was the case?"

This is not what I was suggesting what so ever and have no point in this thread confirmed that I believe they were avoiding a protestor. I used the words distracted from ******* climbing gantry's and putting up additional disruptive signage.

Unless you were there and know exactly what was displayed, how can you identify that it was NOT a distraction for them. Would you be saying the same thing if it wasnt a lorry driver and just a person on their commute to work?
Yes, of course I’d say the same. Replace lorry driver with driver if you want. But it was a lorry driver, the pictures show that so not sure what your point is…
I don’t have a vendetta against lorry drivers…
 
not the point I was arguing and or agreeing with though.
So again, your line was a complete reach as it had nothing to do with my reply or view. Thanks for clearing that up.
Right you just replied to someone who said it was a stretch then you've changed your point to absolute nonsense.

"but how can you say he wasnt distracted!"

lol
 
The idea that first world countries have polluted horrendously by todays standards on their way up is also largely rubbish. The difference in population size and ability to pollute when we were growing vs now isn't even remotely comparable. We also didn't have insane populations like hundreds of millions or billions doing this.

The populations of some of these countries is completely unsustainable and a large reason for the huge emissions and damage to the environment.

We have to take a portion of the blame now because we are driving demand that creates large amounts of pollution but countries with over a billion people in them are not going to change to clean living in the next 20-50 years.
 

Good. Hopefully the first of many, and hopefully the court backlog means they stay there for many weeks.
FhE5aMsXoAEQ7Ma

:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
 
Where has it been reported the lorry was taking "avoiding action"?

Was just reporting on it live. I am a member of a HGV traffic group on Facebook. Best way to get traffic updates with all this rubbish going on but when you get the info live sometimes it can be a little off but at least I know there is an issue there and can react.

Well this is just a lie. Care to edit it?
Just Stop Oil protests: Police officer hurt amid M25 disruption https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-63565808


Indirectly? That’s a stretch. Sounds like the the lorry driver was entirely at fault by driving too close to the lorry in front.

Perhaps but it wouldn't have happened if they were not there. Driving a lorry is not easy. You have very little training on what is a massive killing machine with huge blind spots and left to learn on the job. One second of lapse can be fatal and after all we are all human. If you are driving on the M25 day in day out auto pilot can take over and when something like this is thrown into the mix then accidents can and will happen. An average lorry has no less than 6 mirrors that need to be monitored all the time. A split second is all it takes.

It is easy to blame the Lorry driver when the general public do not know what it takes to drive one. You sit in your office and day dream for a second and nothing happens. You do that in a lorry and it is game over. The level of concentration needed is of a completely different level compared to the vast majority of jobs.

It sounds to me that two lorries and a police motorbike were involved in the collision and the lorry was trying to avoid the police bike, perhaps because the motorbike was in the lorries blind spot and didn't see him in the mirror and then there was a collision as a result of it.

Fact is this wouldn't have happened if those protestors were not there.
 
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It’s only a matter of time until there is a serious accident. Hopefully only the protestors are those harmed.

Franky, I'm surprised it took this long before something like this happened. But I thought it would have been one of the protesters accidentally getting run over or someone dying in the back of an ambulance trying to get to a hospital
 
And for those emerging countries, I can see that they have a point too. All of the current major world economies got to where they are today by utterly destroying the climate and now we are trying to pull up the ladder to less industrailized nations and saying "tough luck". I can see why those countries continue to act the way they do (although to be clear, I don't agree with it either).

While I see their point, I highly doubt the UK was pumping out anywhere near as much pollution as India and China are doing right now during the height of our industrial revolution
 
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