North Korea
- Thread starter terley
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Soldato
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I think it is the other way round as Erdof says:
China and NK have an old and out dated relationship. The China of today is not the China of yesterday. NK has not moved on from being politically and economically isolated but China has and has done so in a spectacular way. China does not want to involve itself into any conflict and imo would rather see NK dealt with neatly then help it out as an ally in any conflict. Even with threats looming and fairly aggressive actions, China keeps a fairly passive position.
China now relies on global economic relationships to continue developing as a economical superpower. The last thing they want to do is rock the boat.
It continued to give aid and support to NK only to keep a buffer between a significant military force (the US and SK) and them. That said, as China has changed, relations between the US and them have improved significantly and there is little hostility between them. I think if the US - SK mutual defence treaties were to suddenly disappear and the US promised to reduce their forces in the far east, then China would jump at the chance of 'liberating' the North Koreans by dividing up the land and pushing the ever disputed Chinese-NK border out some more. Unfortunately real life is hardly ever so neat and China is worried they would suddenly get hoards of NK refugees after a short but expensive and messy war.
It's double standards sure but it's a double standard I know I can live with. What's the alternative? Everyone having them. Seriously, you think that will end well?
Erm, you do know how laws are made in the first place right? They aren't just plucked out of the air.
NK are the equivalent of some lunatic neighbour who've had altercations with almost everyone on the street in the past. Someone forgot to invite them to the street bbq. They spend their days frothing from the mouth shouting how they want to kill you all. Driving by all the houses at night revving their engine and smashing windows with rocks. Now they're in the shed having bought lots of nails and gas canisters and are tinkering away.
You'd be cool to live next to them right?
Soldato
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Hardly, NK are the small kid that talks big but has no intention of doing anything until a big kid comes along and keeps pushing (to seem like a big kid) until they are forced to so they dont look like the small kid they are.
As far as laws go, they only really work if you enforce them.
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A better analogy would be the guy on the street who was traumatized by a home invasion, so now has a beefy security system and owns a dozen shotguns.
I highly doubt China would retaliate against the US or it's Allies for attacking North Korea.
China are definitely conflicted but they have too much to lose is this escalates, we all do to be fair which is why I don't think the US will do anything.
Can people stop making stupid analogies. There's no need. North Korea and South Korea are split, they are no longer a country following World War 2 and the Korean War. South Koreans live in a free Democratic society that allows people to work, travel and prosper. These are values we need to support. It is beyond stupidity for people in this thread to some how believe the West are the people doing wrong, when the North Korean people are starving because their psychotic murderous dictator of a leader is paranoid over another war, so has decided to make nuclear weapons and threaten South Korea, Japan and America. You're defending the wrong side you complete morons.
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So many US President haters you mean?
It says something when British people seem to hate the US and its President so much they seek to defend the shenanigans of a despot running a dangerous show of self aggrandisement.Err, or have I got them mixed up..... before someone asks?
And brainwashed his kids into believing he is a God. Complains loudly when you have friends over, and practices firing his shotguns over your back garden.
Soldato
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China seems to be in a bit of an odd position - they've clearly lost a lot of patience with NK but are kind of reluctant to do anything other than give NK some pointed hints which haven't worked and now seem to be kind of resigned to riding it out.
The important part you're missing is that the Korean war never ended, there is just a ceasefire in place. This is the reason NK devotes more of it's GDP to defence than any other country, because half a century ago the USA invaded their country, raped and murdered their way across the peninsula and partitioned off the southern half, and they are are terrified that if the ceasefire fails that the USA will return again unless they become strong and develop the ability to defend themselves.
Soldato
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China's odd position is to do with their history. China and NK bled together and incurred huge losses fighting side, albeit many decades ago. While China has moved on somewhat and has changed, it was NK last big international interaction which lead to a ongoing relationship. Since then China has given aid and some tech to them. The current NK people have only ever known one ally and that is China, even though it is not the China that exists today, the NK people do not know that. They have been told that their bigger, stronger successful and mighty brother has always stood by them. To the NK people, they have fed them, clothed them and equipped them, albeit poorly. I can see why China is finding it difficult to outright announce they no longer want to stand with them.
I think China is waiting for NK to overstep vs the US and then shrug saying 'we suggested every other solution, we cant help you now'.
Do you genuinely believe that KJU, a man educated at an expensive private school in Switzerland and who has access to the entire internet and global media, believes that America would wish to invade North Korea if they weren't trying to create ICBM's and Nuclear weapons? Or do you think perhaps maybe he's using the pretext of a potential invasion to keep his population scared and loyal to him, so he can maintain his power and no doubt luxurious life style? I know critical thinking can be difficult for some but try and guess the more likely scenario.
Well considering the US were threatening/bullying them for decades before they started working on missiles/nuclear program... >.>
Don't forget, before going to school in Switzerland for a time, he still grew up in NK and received the usual indoctrination, while in Switzerland he wasn't allowed to associate with the locals at all and doesn't even speak English (which may explain leaving school with no qualifications lol).
Soldato
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Indeed. How many countries has NK invaded or destabilised. How many countries has America invaded or destabilised. America and South Korea hold military exercises every year close to the border. As an expert on NK said on the radio this morning, part of NK's stance is warning the US that invading will be painful. The original Nuclear non Proliferation Treaty limited nuclear weapons to five countries but since then Israel, India and Pakistan have nukes and not much is said about them. Also noted on the radio prog was that the border was the usual couple of civil servants arbitrarily drawing a line on the map separating these areas into countries. Like so many areas of the world this has led to complications and wars.
Well considering he went to an English language school I doubt he didn't learn English or know it before going there. You are of course making excuses for a murderous Dictator who is happy to watch his country starve because of things that happened 70 years ago. He has access to the internet and Google translate, he has people around him who no doubt speak English, he is fully able to comprehend that America would have no interest in losing thousands of soldiers fighting a war in South East Asia against a country that wasn't trying to develop nuclear weapons.