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OcUK Ryzen 5 9600X and Ryzen 7 9700X review thread

Joxeon said:
CPUs can still play an important role even at the high end when using heavy RT and upscaling.
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I understand they can impact fps lows but looking at tech power ups benchmark graph the 9700x gets barely 5% more than my old 5600x at 4k and about 20% more at 1080p.

No doubt x3d variants of this gen will be impressive but I imagine my money would be best spent on a gpu next time I look to upgrade something.
 
RavenXXX2 said:
If the none 3d zen 5 chips are barely any faster than zen 4, the 3d zen 5 chips will hardly beat out the zen 4 3d. Kind of pointless this zen 5.
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This is where I disagree. For games that already benefit from a larger L3, those games will realise the ipc gains of zen5 and will perform in the 10%+ range. But for games that already don’t benefit notably from the larger L3 and rely on the fabric, they will be quite similar to zen3 x3d. Looking forward to seeing that data a lot.
 
TrixP10 said:
well they should have a lot more power headroom. wait and see
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Can we reduce the level of common sense in future posts please? I’m really struggling for orientation now...

I do have a theory the a second CCD might resolve at least some of the odd performance behave, let’s wait and see.
 
pBay said:
AMD did suggest some x3d improvements were on the cards although that was before we realised their slides were full of nonsense....
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My thoughts precisely; they were promising "new 3d cache architecture improvements" and "full feature x3d overclocking" and "good gaming performance gains"

However the person who said this is the same who said the 9700x is faster in games than the 7800x3d... so now I can't trust these statements
 
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I'm of two minds here, as I mentioned earlier in the thread. The indication is there may have been some changes in the product over earlier information and guides [potentially due to the nm process they were designed for vs released on], hence the underwhelming release, but looking at the Linux/Server/Web orientated benchmarks, there are areas where Zen 5 is CLEARLY stronger in compute than Zen 4, we're just not seeing that in gaming. MAYBE due to the IO die bottleneck.
If that IS the case, the 3DVCache gaming parts may still be rather good, due to the VCache allowing far more data to be store close to the processing cores, to mitigate the latency, and potentially over improvements elsewhere too; plus the 3DVcache parts so far have seemed noticeably less memory bandwidth concerned than other Zen parts anyway, plus potentially of other improvements elsewhere, maybe even a refined IO Die given they're arriving a bit later.

Whatever they do, it'd be nice if the x3D variants allow the Zen 5 core to show its strengths more in gaming and general day to day tasks, it clearly DOES have improvements, just in areas we either currently don't need, or aren't seeing the benefit from for XYZ reason. I have to wonder if the two stage branch prediction is perhaps adding too much latency for gaming tasks, at least without the benefit of the VCache to hold low level engine code etc? Either way, until those parts arrive, we don't know how the new architecture will benefit from the 3D VCache, and whether for us it'll basically be more of the same as the 7800X3D, maybe the same but cheaper, or alternatively noticeably faster as the additional cache allows the Zen 5 changes to stretch thier legs in gaming also.
 
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Just hope the reviews tomorrow make a bit more sense having more normal power targets...could be interesting....or not at all :cry:
 
Alexrose1uk said:
I'm of two minds here, as I mentioned earlier in the thread. The indication is there may have been some changes in the product over earlier information and guides [potentially due to the nm process they were designed for vs released on], hence the underwhelming release, but looking at the Linux/Server/Web orientated benchmarks, there are areas where Zen 5 is CLEARLY stronger in compute than Zen 4, we're just not seeing that in gaming. MAYBE due to the IO die bottleneck.
If that IS the case, the 3DVCache gaming parts may still be rather good, due to the VCache allowing far more data to be store close to the processing cores, to mitigate the latency, and potentially over improvements elsewhere too; plus the 3DVcache parts so far have seemed noticeably less memory bandwidth concerned than other Zen parts anyway, plus potentially of other improvements elsewhere, maybe even a refined IO Die given they're arriving a bit later.

Whatever they do, it'd be nice if the x3D variants allow the Zen 5 core to show its strengths more in gaming and general day to day tasks, it clearly DOES have improvements, just in areas we either currently don't need, or aren't seeing the benefit from for XYZ reason. I have to wonder if the two stage branch prediction is perhaps adding too much latency for gaming tasks, at least without the benefit of the VCache to hold low level engine code etc? Either way, until those parts arrive, we don't know how the new architecture will benefit from the 3D VCache, and whether for us it'll basically be more of the same as the 7800X3D, maybe the same but cheaper, or alternatively noticeably faster as the additional cache allows the Zen 5 changes to stretch thier legs in gaming also.
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I'm hoping the X3D versions will be better as that was the chip I was intending to upgrade for but if not then it'll be down to a fight between the cheaper 7800X3D or if intel can come good with arrow lake.
 
Yes, I'd also been interested in 9800X3D as a good switching over point to AM5, as even at 5GHz OC, I'm starting to feel a bit limited in certain scenarios by the 6 cores of my 12400 and loathe to throw UK prices at a 12900K or similar, and 13/14th gen are no longer a good upgrade path given all the issues emerging.

Will wait and see, the way it's looking, the 9800X3D will either be REALLY good, or pretty dissapointing lol
 
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I think, hope, wish, the X3D will be a better product, as mentioned if the IO is the problem the vcache mitigates some of that and we could see the *actual* performance unleashed, maybe.
 
Maybe it’s transitional. Intel’s problems are at least partially caused by jamming as much voltage through the chips as possible to produce competitive performance. AMD have produced a line on a level with predecessors (and lest we forget people were #ahem underwhelmed with the leap from 13 to 14 gen intel) but with significant power (and therefore heat) improvements. Rather than amp it up to the max then they’ve left as is maybe for people to do it themselves (and run the risks I suppose).
 
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I'm hoping to hold out until AM6/whatever Intel have then (assuming the issues/efficiency are resolved/drastically improved) and Zen 5 seems to be confirming that's the best option. It will be a harder wait if another generation of chips launches on AM5 but who knows at this point.
 
Kirby Wurm said:
I'm hoping to hold out until AM6/whatever Intel have then (assuming the issues/efficiency are resolved/drastically improved) and Zen 5 seems to be confirming that's the best option. It will be a harder wait if another generation of chips launches on AM5 but who knows at this point.
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AMD have publicly said AM5 until at least 2027 now I believe, so I'd be very surprised if there's not at least 1 to 2 more generations on AM5.
 
ZXSpekky48k said:
Maybe it’s transitional. Intel’s problems are at least partially caused by jamming as much voltage through the chips as possible to produce competitive performance. AMD have produced a line on a level with predecessors (and lest we forget people were #ahem underwhelmed with the leap from 13 to 14 gen intel) but with significant power (and therefore heat) improvements. Rather than amp it up to the max then they’ve left as is maybe for people to do it themselves (and run the risks I suppose).
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It's not a hard line to draw that maybe they've looked at everything going on in team blue, and looked at each other and gone 'eco...' this time around, in tandem with underlying changes being fantastic for servers etc where eco is a big deal. The temperature drops were pretty significant which is a big deal for servers running high core density, massive numbers of server units, and having to deal with high power AC to cool all of it.

I don't even want to think how much power somewhere like Equinix or any other data centre drinks at a given moment, given the sheer volumes of racks, equipment and cooling.

20 degrees and 50watts less times several hundred makes a pretty huge difference overall, not just in actual server pull, but also in the cooling systems to keep the server rooms at optimum temperatures.

Hopefully the x3D stuff is at least more consumer aligned/customised, I can't imagine the two step branch prediction might not have a slight latency penalty already. Look at Pentium 4, it's deep pipelines were a nightmare if anything went off, although I'm going way back now!
 
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Alexrose1uk said:
AMD have publicly said AM5 until at least 2027 now I believe, so I'd be very surprised if there's not at least 1 to 2 more generations on AM5.
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AMD want to dramatically increase core count with Zen6 though (16c ccd), so it'll be tough to keep it on AM5 imo. Just imagine if Zen5 is the underwhelming dogpile we're left with on this platform :D :p
 
Famous AMD fanstore, Mindfactory, is reporting they've so far sold fewer than 50 Zen5 CPUs

Demand for the Zen5 CPUs is extremely low from desktop users and gamers. Keep in mind, Mindfactory usually sells 5000 CPUs per week, of which 70% are AMD models, and yet less than 50 sold are Zen5

Where are all the people claiming Zen5 efficiency is a major selling point? Why aren't you buying Zen5 in droves? Where is everyone? Hello??
 
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