Scottish Elections Result

[Biohazard]

You might see it but it would never pass in a million years, only the clueless idiots would vote for a completely independant Scotland.

Given the state of the Union, I'd be inclined to say that only an idiot would vote against it.

Too small, too daft and too poor, huh?

 

[Biohazard]

I suppose it depends what you do for a living really, if you are in business an independant Scotland would only be a bad thing,

Shame 200 of Scotland biggest and brightest business leaders all signed an open letter professing SNP governance and policy?

if you sit and home picking up your dole and thinking all day about how England have brought Scotland down then it might seem like a good idea at the time,

Scottish nationalism and progress has little to do with odd emotive notions towards England, nor has it really anything to do with England directly at all.

but when you then realise your state life wont be anywhere near as comfortable and your free health care and prescriptions and education has to end you would probably change your tune as we dont have the resourses to be a country in our own right.

Of course we do, you've just swallowed the nonsense that we are too poor, too daft and too small.

Absolute poppy ****.

 

[Biohazard]

It'll be interesting to hear the SNP reaction when they hold the independence vote and get a resounding "awa n bile yer Heidi!" from scots.
It is the cornerstone of their whole purpose so what do they do after that?

I wouldn't count your chickens on that one quite yet, but if the electorate are not convinced the issue would be sidelined for decades at best.

The SNP would continue however, Labour clearly aren't up to anything and Scot's still don't trust a Tory.

They don't trust a labour en masse either it would seem.

I'm not really surprised the other parties have never allowed a vote on it as they never have any faith in the great unwashed electorate to make big decisions.

This is where it gets silly.

Why on earth did the unionists actually vote the referendum bill down going through parliament when they knew the conditions were ripe for it to fail?

Instead they ran about saying we don't have a democratic right to decide our future etc scaremongering and lying, where as if they met it head on the likelyhood is independence would now not be registering in the political theatre.

An SNP majority will be interesting as they will stand or fall on their policies whiteout having all the other parties ganging up to throw out half their policies and then crowing about how they have failed to deliver on their promises.

Indeed.

 

[Biohazard]

Did 200 of Scotlands biggest and brightest business leaders sign an open letter professing they want an independant Scotland?

I think my answer is clear enough?

When that is a manifesto pledge for the party they just gave their support to, it is indirectly yes.

Can I ask what you do for a living?

I work for Westminster on reserved issues

 

[Biohazard]

You make the insinuation that 200 business leaders would vote for an independant Scotland.

I think given their strong support, I wouldn't say it is too far off the mark, no. But it isn't a direct endorsement, no. More indirect.

It doesnt mean anything of the sort. I have been happy with the SNP in the last term, I was happy to vote for them in this election but as a business owner and someone who employs 14 people, I DONT want an independant Scotland.

It all rather depends on your business and fears regarding seperation to be honest with you..

By voting for SNP it doesnt mean you agree that independance is the way forward, all it means is having a vote and letting the people decide once and for all what they want and then hopefully nationalist morons can stop banging on that its what everyone wants.

If you are talking from the non business electorate point of view I agree there are some curious disconnects that take place in Scottish/UK elections and voting practices/intentions as result of the field.

However, I would add that the nationalists aren't morons for banging on that's what everyone wants; there has been clear support for a referendum as shown by polls (even from Labour for all of 2 days before a U-U-U-turn).

Just not independence.

 

[Biohazard]

I dont have any problem with a referendum and if a majority of Scottish public vote for it (not the majority of people voting) then so be it, the problem is its not a burning issue for most people in the country (how many people even bothered to vote for devolution compared to the overall electorate).

That is a poor comparison to be honest with you. If people couldn't be bothered voting either way, they don't count.

The problem the SNP have with independance, they expect to be able to just march off with the North Sea oil because its in Scottish waters and im sure it wont be any where as easy as that, we goto war with Iraq and Afghanistan over oil yet Salmond expects Westminster to just roll over and have its tummy tickled when it comes to north sea oil, its not going to happen.

Yes we would technically and oil is just a fraction of the case; and England would not invade Scotland for claiming its own resources.

 

[Biohazard]

Everyone counts, if someone doesnt vote for independance then their vote should be counted as not wanting it. you should need a clear majority of people wanting it to be the case.

You need a clear majority of those who take part in the franchise; to set such undemocratic terms are very very unlikely in the Scottish parliament.

Im not saying England would invade Scotland of course thats ridiculous, but why should England instantly lose out because of a vote?

So England is the net beneficiary then?

Nice of you to say so.

There would be agreements put in place more than likely to split the oil revenues which would put a big hole in the proposed budgets of an independant Scotland.

Why would Scotland give away it's resource? I very much doubt that would be in the negotiations, and oil revenues are only part of the economic case.

 

[Biohazard]

Great result in my constituency of Glasgow Anniesland with SNP winning by seven votes. Finally after years of New Labour we might get some change here and good to see the LibDems humiliated as well.

I genuinely hope this can bring some change for Glasgow too.

For far too long Labour have taken your cities support for granted while ignoring the problems at the same time to propel themself towards Westminster.

It ended last night.

 

[Biohazard]

Ill turn it around on you, why would the remainder of Britain give away its resource that it currently enjoys?

Upon independence it wouldn't be Britain's any longer, and as we stand it is still Scotland's oil on the whole anyway, even after the theft of 6000 square miles of Scottish North Sea to England..

Britain wouldn't be giving anything, Scotland would be reclaiming.

Who cares what britain thinks or wants in this scenario? It really isn't the issue at hand.

As for undemocratic terms, these were the very terms from the election in the 70's.

Election?

You mean the '79 referendum?

 

[Biohazard]

Taking oil out of the equation, what resourses do Scotland have to support the country?

So apart from oil, Scotland is a basket case economy is it?

Given you yourself run a business, surely you must be able to open your eyes more than Scotland's only resource is oil?

If you genuinely have to ask, I'm shocked your in business so to speak.

 

[Biohazard]

Yes, the 1979 referendum for devolution. The vote was won but not passed because of the turnout. If you took that as an example, just over 1m people voted for devolution in a population of 5m, it would be ludicrious to have independance if there was a similar turnout and vote.

The only referendum to have such a stipulation, and to be honest with you mark it done Westminster, the UK and the Establishment absolulely no good in the long run.

Who cares what Britain thinks or wants? Well, I imagine the rest of Britain would!

Irrelevent.

Scotland wouldnt be reclaiming oil, its not like we had an oil industry when we were a seperate entity before

Irrelevent.

the oil was found as a unified country

Irrelevent.

its naive to expect the rest of Britain to just accept its Scotlands if independance is voted for.

Irrelevent

There is nothing Britain could really do, certainly not in the long term in that eventiallity, no.

There would be a split of the oil for some years to come if it happened.

I very much doubt it, unless England is going to share its resources with Scotland? Oh but hang on, aren't we independent of each other now?

 

[Biohazard]

What's the report that says Scotland gets a larger share of the pie than England? I'm having a total brain fart atm.

What pie?

Oil or UK spending.

It's the hidden-from-the-Scot's-for-30 years McCrone report you really want to look at

 

[Biohazard]

Surely the fact that only 2.3 million of Scottish voters pay income tax is a slight concern? Or that you're due to become 3rd most state dependent country in the world in 2012.

With a population of 5? No.

If anything state depedancy is a legacy of Westminster's economic flundering policy and lack of directed economic stimulation in Scotland.

Those tory forecasts are under dispute, at present it is no where near like it.

I think that in the long term Scotland could become a properous independent country, it's the short/medium term that could be very rough.

Absolutely.

 

[Biohazard]

You’ve summed up Scottish politics very well.

To you and England perhaps, and this very attitude is exacly why the UK is pulling itself apart.

There is no unity in order to have a Union.

 

[Biohazard]

Not really seeing as England isn't on the Security Council.. See the problem there for the UK if Scotland did leave? There's no UK anymore.

Partly why I don't support independence.

And that is exactly why the Establishment fears that outcome so greatly.

It isn't even the 'trivial' amount of money, but the loss of presense and pretence to the UK-English state internationally.

 

[Biohazard]

But the point still stands that a large state dependancy and relatively small proportion paying income tax would be very painful for Scotland initially if they become independent. Although I guess that does depend on how the oil issue is resolved.

Yes, and the point remains that if we continue to be tied to Westminster economic policy Scotland and the other UK fringes will continually be at the detriment of poor policy and lack of microeconomic control outside London.

Does anyone know exactly how the oil tax/revenue would work if Scotland became independent?

We both keep our own.

How would the UKCS be split?

Civil service?

Through negotiation.

What about companies registered in England/Britain but extracting oil in an independent Scotland's waters?

If they do not move location the corporation tax receipts would stay in that country. Oil and petroleum extraction and production duties would be Scotland's.

 

[Biohazard]

It'd be interesting to see how the UK/Great Britain titles would be split, seeing as Scotland is part of both. Time for new titles? Also I wonder how it'd affect membership of the EU/UN/security council etc.

Sounds like a bit of a minefield, which hopefully we'll never have to go through.

If we don't the UK is destined to collapse in on itself with debt.

 

[Biohazard]

I have never in my life been a supporter of the conservatives. I believe they favour the rich and grind down the poor. And as a working class citizen, I dont believe they have my best interests at heart. I'm willing to concede I'm not an expert on politics, so thats purely a personal opinion.

And the Lib Dems got into bed with them when they SHOULD have formed a coalition with Labour, so they've soiled themselves in my eyes.

Labour refused to work with anyone, a rainbow coalition could have stopped it but they couldn't bring themself to do it.

You have, yet again, Labour to thank for the Conservatives getting in down south.

 

[Biohazard]

First bit is the usual nonsense that you hear people spout about something they don't understand. But at least you're relatively honest about your lack of knowledge. And you didn't mention the milk or mines. But I imagine you're not far off.

I can understand your response, but you also have to aknowledge the apparent toxcitity of Conservative legacy here though?

I can't blame people too much for having a 'misunderstanding' from your point of view, if you get me... the conservatives have failed to realign and re-brand themself and shake off their past in Scotland.

 

[Biohazard]

Dont think "irrelevent" would really wash with westminster somehow

It would if I was leading the negotiations.

I actually don't think Westminster would act like such, in the event of a yes vote we are going to be neighbours for a very long time afterwards, with economic and social connections still vibrant it would be increadibly short sighted of the London establishment.