Snowden files 'show massive UK spying op'

Nate--IRL-- · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:04

Chris344 said:
If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to worry about.

I'd like your credit card details so..... you've nothing to hide.

Nate

scorza · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:04

So I see that Edward Snowden has left one shining beacon of freedom, democracy and human rights (China) for another (Russia). We might spy on our citizens but at least we don't poison them with Polonium 210.

StriderX · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:11

scorza said:
So I see that Edward Snowden has left one shining beacon of freedom, democracy and human rights (China) for another (Russia). We might spy on our citizens but at least we don't poison them with Polonium 210.

No we just beat them senseless instead (manning).

But in seriousness, if i were in this man's position, I would go to any nation that seems the safest, I doubt he really wanted to go to Russia, but he has no choice.

scorza · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:17

StriderX said:
No we just beat them senseless instead (manning).

By "we" I meant the UK really, I've started threads in the past criticising the treatment of Bradley Manning but I'm not aware of him being beaten, I thought it was just mental abuse.

Meridian · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:18

scorza said:
So I see that Edward Snowden has left one shining beacon of freedom, democracy and human rights (China) for another (Russia). We might spy on our citizens but at least we don't poison them with Polonium 210.

Perhaps because all the "nice" countries would just hand him back to the Americans for a politically-motivated trial and a life sentence (or even death, although that's probably unlikely). Any port in a storm etc.

Nate--IRL-- · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:19

scorza said:
By "we" I meant the UK really,

I don't think the UK has very clean hands with regard to how has conducted itself in this area in the past TBH.

Nate

MrMoonX · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:20

scorza said:
So I see that Edward Snowden has left one shining beacon of freedom, democracy and human rights (China) for another (Russia). We might spy on our citizens but at least we don't poison them with Polonium 210.

where would you go, pretty much any other western democracy would hand him back to the USA, plus he wasn't in China he was in Hong Kong

Xordium · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:20

gillywibble said:
Oh indeed, I live a very comfortable life, not really much more I could ask for. But ultimately, that is not the point.

If I were a successful Jewish business man in Germany in the 1930's, I could have said exactly the same.

You really think they are going to gas you?

scorza · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:22

Meridian said:
Perhaps because all the "nice" countries would just hand him back to the Americans for a politically-motivated trial and a life sentence (or even death, although that's probably unlikely). Any port in a storm etc.

Well tbf in all probability Snowden has broken US law - why shouldn't he be tried?

StriderX · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:28

scorza said:
Well tbf in all probability Snowden has broken US law - why shouldn't he be tried?

He probably should, but considering the possible breaches of constitutional rights in other countries...i don't know.

Xordium · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:29

soundb0y said:
Comfort and shelter are still not an acceptable excuse for total removal of privacy and other inherent rights.

I agree which is why I would challenge more if there was a total removal of privacy and other inherent rights. As it stands even with this there is not.

StriderX said:
What is the greater good?

Look around at this country. look around at the things we are exposed to look around other countries ... simple. We live in a little bubble here and for that I am grateful.

StriderX · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:31

Xordium said:
I agree which is why I would challenge more if there was a total removal of privacy and other inherent rights. As it stands even with this there is not.

Look around at this country. look around at the things we are exposed to look around other countries ... simple. We live in a little bubble here and for that I am grateful.

Never mind, you were actually quoting Splodge, I apologize.

gillywibble · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:41

Xordium said:
You really think they are going to gas you?

You really think they thought that would happen?

soundb0y · 23 Jun 2013 at 10:43

Xordium said:
I agree which is why I would challenge more if there was a total removal of privacy and other inherent rights. As it stands even with this there is not.

Look around at this country. look around at the things we are exposed to look around other countries ... simple. We live in a little bubble here and for that I am grateful.

Not yet. Obviously they can't suddenly take it all away in one go but can't you see that the softly softly approach is just as bad if not worse, as the majority of people can't even see it happening, and as with some of the idiots here even think it is necessary / beneficial.

[TW]Fox · 23 Jun 2013 at 11:13

MrMoonX said:
he wasn't in China he was in Hong Kong

With geography skills like that it's a stretch to expect us to assume credibility in the rest of your opinion in this thread

dowie · 23 Jun 2013 at 11:15

soundb0y said:
Not yet. Obviously they can't suddenly take it all away in one go but can't you see that the softly softly approach is just as bad if not worse, as the majority of people can't even see it happening, and as with some of the idiots here even think it is necessary / beneficial.

yeah man - anyone who disagrees is an idiot and as a casual observer like the rest of us you're totally in a position to determine whether or not various intelligence programs are beneficial or not... they're taking away our freedoms

the worst bit is every time you leave the country you have to give someone a small book called a passport containing your personal data... not like some general meta data but your actual personal data!!!! I mean its crazy they get your full name, your date of birth, your religion... tis like soviet russia. Then worse still they scan you, and scan all your belongings... sometimes they even put your through a full body scanner or just get you to take everything out of your bag. Why are they passively spying on everyone!!!!

StriderX · 23 Jun 2013 at 11:21

[TW]Fox;24501981 said:
With geography skills like that it's a stretch to expect us to assume credibility in the rest of your opinion in this thread

Well legally, its a different place...but you know.

[TW]Fox · 23 Jun 2013 at 11:24

It's a Special Administration Region of... China. It's in Mainland China. It has a seperate legal system but it's still physically located in China, if you are in Hong Kong you are therefore in China.

MrMoonX · 23 Jun 2013 at 11:26

[TW]Fox;24502030 said:
It's a Special Administration Region of... China. It's in Mainland China. It has a seperate legal system but it's still physically located in China, if you are in Hong Kong you are therefore in China.

as above legally its a different place and is recognised as a separate administrative entity and is not under the Chinese government :rolleyes:

asim18 · 23 Jun 2013 at 11:27

[TW]Fox;24502030 said:
It's a Special Administration Region of... China. It's in Mainland China. It has a seperate legal system but it's still physically located in China, if you are in Hong Kong you are therefore in China.

Erm. According to a quick Google and Wiki read to confirm what my Chinese friend told me 2 years ago, Hong Kong is not in mainland China and not physically located in China.

What you're saying is a bit like saying Scotland is in England.