I have seen that said a few times but I doubt they will. Rosberg might try the old suspension on Thursday as they will have plenty of time to study the data before qualifying on Saturday. As for schumacher, I can't see him going back. Monaco is all about a pointy front-end and traction out of the slower corners, and that is what the longer wheel base was designed to bring so it would make no sense to go back to the old system.
Spanish Grand Prix 2010, Circuit de Catalunya - Race 5/19
- Thread starter Glaucus
- Start date
I have seen that said a few times but I doubt they will. Rosberg might try the old suspension on Thursday as they will have plenty of time to study the data before qualifying on Saturday. As for schumacher, I can't see him going back. Monaco is all about a pointy front-end and traction out of the slower corners, and that is what the longer wheel base was designed to bring so it would make no sense to go back to the old system.
i dont think it will be that predictable, red bull was so fast in Spain because of the great down force in the medium/high speed corners, Monaco is very different.
remember last season, everyone thought Hamilton would get pole in a much worse car than the brawns because of the much slower corners.
One interesting thing that I noticed in this race was that the top 4 would've been:
2 RedBulls, Alonso and Hamilton (if you remove any failures and screw ups in the pit lane).
I think it would be fair to say that this year, the top 4 in the WDC will include those 4 names (unless we get a ridiculous amount of wet races, which will allow Button to sneak in).
Another thing that E.Jordan pointed out was that when Alonso asked who he regards as his main title rivals, he mentioned the 2 RedBulls and Hamilton - not Button (even though Button is the current leader) or Massa.
Although Hamilton is now on the backfoot, I can see Hamilton finishing ahead of Button by the end of the season - he is too good not to.
In theory Vettel should win this year's title (massive car advantage), but I still stick by my pre-season prediction of Alonso - the guy is the best driver in F1 and is in a competitive car, so has a good chance of negating Vettel's car advantage.
2 RedBulls, Alonso and Hamilton (if you remove any failures and screw ups in the pit lane).
I think it would be fair to say that this year, the top 4 in the WDC will include those 4 names (unless we get a ridiculous amount of wet races, which will allow Button to sneak in).
Another thing that E.Jordan pointed out was that when Alonso asked who he regards as his main title rivals, he mentioned the 2 RedBulls and Hamilton - not Button (even though Button is the current leader) or Massa.
Although Hamilton is now on the backfoot, I can see Hamilton finishing ahead of Button by the end of the season - he is too good not to.
In theory Vettel should win this year's title (massive car advantage), but I still stick by my pre-season prediction of Alonso - the guy is the best driver in F1 and is in a competitive car, so has a good chance of negating Vettel's car advantage.
Yep. But the best car (BrawnGP) actually got pole position.
Although BrawnGP were the best car last year, the advantage of RedBull (in qualifying at least) is much greater.
I would place RedBull's advantage over the competition similar to Williams' advantage in 1992 and 1993. Taking 1992/3 as the reference, Williams got pole positions in both those years, despite Senna (the Monaco master), attempting to outqualify the Williams.
and of course you can trust EVERYTHING Alonso says
If anything the person that could easily be your most direct threat is ALWAYS your team mate (due to very few teams going through a season with 100% finishes on both cars)
and everyone here knows how anti button you are so thats no surprise
If anything the person that could easily be your most direct threat is ALWAYS your team mate (due to very few teams going through a season with 100% finishes on both cars)
and everyone here knows how anti button you are so thats no surprise
because Hamilton stacked it.
im not saying redbull will not be up there, it just wont be a clear cut as spain was.
i reckon schumacher will get a decent quali at monaco, its all about the exit of the corners and schui did very well in spain by keeping button behind him even with mclarens greater straight line speed because schui got good exits from the last corner.
also i don't think vettel is going to run away with the championship, button did it last year by using the huge car advantage and winning all the races in the first 1/3 of the season, neither red bull has made this happen due to reliability mostly.
Last edited:
Me being anti - Button, has nothing to do with what Alonso said, unless you are suggesting that I told him to say this???
Furthermore, I think we have already seen that Alonso has put Massa firmly in his place and Alonso has no need to fear Massa.
Yep, I'd go along with that.
I can still see the RedBull on pole, by a good margin over the next non-RedBull car.
In qualifying at least, to be 1s ahead over the next car is ridiculous and although they won't be 1s ahead of the next non-RedBull car, they will be comfortably ahead.
I can't actually remember the last time a team qualified 1s ahead of their competitors. Perhaps someone can dig out this statistic? I remember in 1992, 1993 (Williams) and again in 2004 (Ferrari), those teams dominated, so it may well be in those years.
I thought it was obvious it was your opinion I was referring to not Alonso's
That is by no means a "fair" comment - seeing as the amount of dry races Button won last year - edit or very competitive in - (when not arguably the best car, or when JB would "sneak" in implying luck rather than anything else)
If Alonso had been stuck behind Schumi would you be so disparaging against him - I would bet you wouldnt (as has been discussed in earlier threads it seems 2 - 3s adv is needed for one car to easily overtake another and even in race trim I doubt Ferrari has that over Mercedes)
Soldato
lol @ Button whinging at MSC for "squeezing him", and "weaving all over the place"!! He's not going to just let you slip past is he? 
You couldn't get past him because you weren't good enough son!!
You couldn't get past him because you weren't good enough son!!
because its impossible to overtake without a mistake by the lead driver or without 3s advantage!!! (let alone without having any rev counter / etc on his wheel )
MS is well renouned for weaving in breaking areas - always done it, always will
Damn. I never knew Hill ever managed that. Which race was this?
Had Button not had a problem when he pitted, he would still have come out behind Alonso. The top 4 would've included the 2 RedBulls, Hamilton and Alonso, which on a dry track, with no "incidents", is the current status quote, on a dry track.
Obviously, as Button has shown, when it rains, he can make some inspired strategy calls, which allows him to jump ahead. On a dry track though, in absolute speed terms, after the RedBulls, only Hamilton and Alonso are capable of coming close to them. Button would get left behind, which is what was happening before he got stuck behind MS.
Caporegime
I don't really know why people keep describing Button's call in Australia as "inspired". He'd destroyed his tyres, and been humiliatingly passed by his teammate like he was a backmarker. He didn't come in because of a genius call, he came in as a complete gamble and got lucky. Malayasia was a good call, but one good call is not a track record of inspired calls.
Caporegime
- Joined
- 18 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 33,188
Personally I don't believe strategy is what helped Button, in one race he simply fluked into an early pit call, it wasn't strategy as such, he had just been passed, rather easily, by Hamilton, his tyres weren't shot, he didn't have an inspired idea. He was just so slow that there wasn't another choice, run around in dirty air unable to catch/pass those infront, or pit. The fact that the pit stop fluked into being the best decision of the race is neither here nor there.
He was easily outpaced in qualifying, he was easily outpaced in the race. Before he got stuck behind Schumi he was CLEARLY much slower than Hamilton and completely unable to catch up. Wasn't he some 65seconds down on Webber when Hamiltons tyre/rim/whatever failed, had he not been stuck behind Schumi, frankly I think he'd still have been 30-40seconds down, he didn't have nearly Hamiltons pace while in the same car, and thats been the same all year.
Before Hamilton and Webbers ill advised pitstop Hamilton was gaining ground on Button hand over fist.
Button's been INCREDILY lucky with OTHER events around his race decisions, alone, none of his "strategy" would have worked at all, thats pure luck, his driving alone hasn't gotten him anything this season. Hamilton with a crap load of bad luck should have been 1 point behind Button after this race, but then more bad luck.
The Red Bull's if they had any reliability, would be off streaking ahead like Brawn did last year. I think Webbers a decent driver, I think Vettle's a decent driver, but if everyone was in a McClaren I don't think they'd be in the top 4 in most races while Hamilton and probably Alonso would be 1st/2nd.
Thats really all that happened last year to Button a car that was not marginally faster than the others, but so far ahead its rather a joke.
He was easily outpaced in qualifying, he was easily outpaced in the race. Before he got stuck behind Schumi he was CLEARLY much slower than Hamilton and completely unable to catch up. Wasn't he some 65seconds down on Webber when Hamiltons tyre/rim/whatever failed, had he not been stuck behind Schumi, frankly I think he'd still have been 30-40seconds down, he didn't have nearly Hamiltons pace while in the same car, and thats been the same all year.
Before Hamilton and Webbers ill advised pitstop Hamilton was gaining ground on Button hand over fist.
Button's been INCREDILY lucky with OTHER events around his race decisions, alone, none of his "strategy" would have worked at all, thats pure luck, his driving alone hasn't gotten him anything this season. Hamilton with a crap load of bad luck should have been 1 point behind Button after this race, but then more bad luck.
The Red Bull's if they had any reliability, would be off streaking ahead like Brawn did last year. I think Webbers a decent driver, I think Vettle's a decent driver, but if everyone was in a McClaren I don't think they'd be in the top 4 in most races while Hamilton and probably Alonso would be 1st/2nd.
Thats really all that happened last year to Button a car that was not marginally faster than the others, but so far ahead its rather a joke.
I agree that Hamilton passed him with ease, but then Hamilton is probably the best overtaker in F1, at this moment in time, so its hardly surprising.
What Button did though was to switch to tyres which no other driver on the track did. Had Hamilton come in for tyres, at that point in time, I'm sure he would've gone for the safe option. At the time everybody, including Martin Brundle, was thinking that Button had made a massive mistake. As events unfolded, we all realised that it was a very risky, unconventional call, but an inspired one, as that call alone, allowed him to win.
He then made a good call in damp conditions in Malyasia. Both races he won, on merit, without any extraordinary events to assist him.
The pattern is that he is able to match/beat Alonso, Hamilton, et all, in damp/wet conditions, by making good strategic decisions. In the dry though, Hamilton, Alonso and the Red Bulls would tear him to peices.
read what I said not what you think I said (or are you just posting rubbish I havent even suggested)
I never said Button would have come out ahead of Alonso - what I said was that IF Alonso had come out behind Schumi its unlikely because of the cars involved that even the MIGHTLY Alonso in a Wonderful Ferrari (well according to you anyway) would have got past Schumacher at Barcelona
Not only that but its pointless not including failures as it looks like Red Bull have already suffered in this regard (although yesterday SV did very well to get to the end with little/no brakes) and Hamilton and Button had different degrees of failure in the McLaren, so one way or the other this championship could still be (and may very likely be ) decided on failures
Given that the McLaren still isnt set up to JB's liking I personally think he is doing all right in comparison to Hamilton, when in free air (on a dry track) or quali there isnt that much between them if anything.
There will always be tracks more suited to one driving style and other circuits for the other (given the tyres they have to use this season)
Well - I will listen to actual racers and others who actually have experience of F1, who genuinely believe it was inspired - but like a few others around here, carry on disparaging anything decent JB does just because its him (no doubt if it had been "one of the greats" doing the same call - no one would be able to forget it , Ever)
Last edited: