Yep agreed, I'll see what happens with "Super" and prices. I may then pick up a 5700XT (AIB) and wait it out for Navi 20. In retrospect I should have hung onto my 1070 longer but it would only lose money over time so no perfect solution.
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** The AMD Navi Thread **
- Thread starter subbytna
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Yep agreed, I'll see what happens with "Super" and prices. I may then pick up a 5700XT (AIB) and wait it out for Navi 20. In retrospect I should have hung onto my 1070 longer but it would only lose money over time so no perfect solution.
OCUK do an exact 1:1 dollar to pound conversion. Every single time.
Associate
Which means the product is then a lot more expensive in the UK, where taxes are already hitting us pretty hard as it stands!
Soldato
Brainwashing brought argumentum ad hominem also. Lets not forget.
Instead of trying to make an argument, they attack the person who wrote it, branding him a fanboy. See this very discussion.
Questioned one fake slide, and the only response was I am against the slide because I am an AMD fanboy. That the slide is fake, with no credible source, completely out of the window.
"Super" prices going to be high in reality. Lets not forget, if Nvidia "rumours" are correct, dropping the price by $100 of the MSRP means a lot of things.
MSRP for the RTX2070 is $500 ($600 the FE), RTX2080 @ 700 (800 for FE). Nvidia for all it's worth, could say they drop $100 the MSRP of the FE, and the brainwashed will applaud.
Kepler was no better either. Both the Titans and the 780Ti sold many times more, each, than the far cheaper, and after 3 months more powerful, R9 290X.
Their main argument was that the higher prices would be paid off by electricity savings...... When pointed at them that it would take 25 year (780Ti) and 45 years (Titan B) to pay off through the energy savings, assuming using the card 100% speed, for 8 hours per day, 365 days per year, was brushed under the carpet attacking me as AMD fanboy. (when I had GTX780 and no AMD card since the ATI 9500 11 years back).
I don't know man. AMD managed to have around 50% market share at one point. But I suppose if they can make more profit with 20% market share then that is what they should do. I just hope Intel does come in and competition heats up a little as AMD seem to be happy just matching Nvidia's prices and making a decent profit themselves these days rather than trying to compete on price. Can't blame them, but I don't have to like it. Their current strategy will likely keep me buying more Nvidia cards though sadly and if you look at my GPU history link in my sig I have had many AMD cards. Can even ask AMDMatt, bought a few of him alone
Soldato
I don't know man. AMD managed to have around 50% market share at one point. But I suppose if they can make more profit with 20% market share then that is what they should do. I just hope Intel does come in and competition heats up a little as AMD seem to be happy just matching Nvidia's prices and making a decent profit themselves these days rather than trying to compete on price. Can't blame them, but I don't have to like it. Their current strategy will likely keep me buying more Nvidia cards though sadly and if you look at my GPU history link in my sig I have had many AMD cards. Can even ask AMDMatt, bought a few of him alone
Given Intel's pricing mentality, more likely they will try to kick AMD out of the market, than combat Nvidia. And with AMD out of the GPUs, trust me, you going to pay £2000 for mid range GPU before 2021 is out.
Associate
That would be the deathknell for PC gaming. No sane person will pay that for a mid range card, and I'd argue that no sane person will pay that for a graphics card full stop.
Personally, I would be switching to consoles if prices ever went that high, and that's something I thought I would never even consider!
Caporegime
£380,LMAO. £360 is bad enough!!
The RX5700 and RX5700XT are overpriced just like almost all the Turing cards. The RX5700 is going to be at least £60 more than an RTX2060,or more like £80 more if we have 1:1 pricing,and the RX5070XT is literally the same price as the overpriced RTX2070,which pushed up the price of the 70 series cards to new highs. $449 will equate to £425 to £450 over here.
Both companies can clear off at that pricing IMHO. We need another competitor as this is becoming a cartel now.
In late 2018,you could get a GTX1080 for as low as £430 to £450,and V64 at launch for £450. This new "gen" is just an excuse in making overpriced card pricing even more mainstream. Best thing is not buy any of them at current pricing otherwise people are justifying what Nvidia did,just because AMD matched it and are "the good guys". Anyone buying a £400+ RX5700XT or RTX2070 has literally validated Nvidia making a product like a RTX2070 at that kind of price. Soon,people shouldn't moan if the RTX3070 and RX6700XT are £500+ cards next year.
What is the RX480 competitor going to be,if the RTX2060 competitor costs £60 to £80 more and is only 10% faster,a card which is GTX1660TI speed for more money?? This is destroying mainsteam gaming now.
That is what AMD said only in 2016,and these metrics were true of last year,looking at what market research companies also said.
So people might as well get a Vega56 now at this rate.
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You sure about that? The AMD defence force here are saying none of us ever bought AMD; we all just wanted AMD to lower the price of nV cards.I used to always buy ATI/AMD as they provided better price for performance. Now apart from the recent Vega deals they have not been doing this, certainly not on release anyways. I remember how the 4870 shook things up when it came out. It beat the 8800 GTX with easy and cost £200. Those were the days...
So I think you must be mistaken.
I also need to figure out why I have so many false memories of owning AMD cards. Clearly I'm in denial.
Caporegime
Let's look at some other measurements then.
The RX480 launched at $240.
Let's say the RX5700XT is double the speed,at $449,that is barely an improvement in performance/$ after 3 years as there is a 1.8X price increase.
If we use the AMD numbers for the RX5700 against the RTX2060,it would make the RX5700 2.2X faster than a $180 RX470,but it costs $379 which is a 2.1X price increase,which again is barely an increase in performance/$ either.
This is Turing all-over again. At least Nvidia was trying to add ray-tracing to justify this,even if it runs a bit crap,so hence why people didn't feel the pricing was worth it. The RX5700/RX5700XT don't even have that party trick to fall back on,and even if it did,it still would be no better than Turing.
Now if we look at streetprices for the previous generations instead of RRPs and things look even worse.
I had mates looking to upgrade their Polaris based cards,and their interest has just evaporated. They mostly have been using AMD cards too for the last few years.
If someone wanted RX5700XT level performance,they might as well got a RTX2070 9 months ago for similar money.
The RX480 launched at $240.
Let's say the RX5700XT is double the speed,at $449,that is barely an improvement in performance/$ after 3 years as there is a 1.8X price increase.
If we use the AMD numbers for the RX5700 against the RTX2060,it would make the RX5700 2.2X faster than a $180 RX470,but it costs $379 which is a 2.1X price increase,which again is barely an increase in performance/$ either.
This is Turing all-over again. At least Nvidia was trying to add ray-tracing to justify this,even if it runs a bit crap,so hence why people didn't feel the pricing was worth it. The RX5700/RX5700XT don't even have that party trick to fall back on,and even if it did,it still would be no better than Turing.
Now if we look at streetprices for the previous generations instead of RRPs and things look even worse.
I had mates looking to upgrade their Polaris based cards,and their interest has just evaporated. They mostly have been using AMD cards too for the last few years.
If someone wanted RX5700XT level performance,they might as well got a RTX2070 9 months ago for similar money.
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Caporegime
Hardly changes anything.
So an RTX2070 is double an RX480 at 1440p,and AMD rates an RX5700XT as 5% faster than an RTX2070. So slightly more than twice as quick as a $249 RX480 for a 1.8X increase in price.
The same difference as before for the RX470 against the RX5700(RTX2060 with 10% more performance),ie,2.2X performance for a 2.1X increase in price.
Its the same issue as Turing. GTX1070 started at $380. RTX2070 cards started at $499.The RTX2070 was 39% faster than a GTX1070,but the minimum RRP was 31% higher.
But the RRPs are not the street prices of these cards now. Now in the UK market a Vega56 is as low as £236. Decent aftermarket cards are £270.
If the AMD figures of RTX2060+10% are correct,then it makes the RX5700 only 22% faster than a reference Vega56,and between £124 to £144 more expensive,ie,52% to 61% more,and £90 to £110 more than an aftermarket Vega56.
You can get a Ryzen 5 2600 and a Vega56 for the same price as an RX5700.
Using the AMD figures of RTX2070+5% for a RX5700XT,it makes it 38% faster than a reference Vega56 for between £189 to £214 more which is 80% to 91% higher in price,and between £155 to £180 more for the aftermarket models.
You can basically get a new Ryzen 5 3600 or a Ryzen 5 2700 and a Vega56 for the same price as an RX5700XT.
If you are on an RX480 or GTX1060,its better to buy a Vega56 and get 50% to 55% extra performance now,and hold off from an RTX2070 or RX5700/RX5700XT.
Even an RTX2060 is better than an RTX2070 or RX5700/RX5700XT in terms of value.
This whole new generation from AMD and Nvidia are a joke in terms of price/performance. If people buy these cards,then forget about mainstream price/performance progression. People will stick with their old cards,or buy new cards which are hardly an upgrade over other mainstream cards which are a few years old. 10% improvement a year or slightly better is rubbish.
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Associate
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- 1 Aug 2017
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I would like to upgrade my GTX 970, but not at these prices from either AMD/Nvidia. I want a 100% increase if i upgrade, not 15-20% for the same price i paid for the 970 at the time.
Prices are just getting out of hand, the GPU market really needs another competitor.
I don't want to go back to console, but if this nonsense continues with the GPU market, Project Scarlet (120fps/VRR/4K compatibility) along with game pass is looking extremely tempting at this point.
All the AAA games will be developed for next gen consoles anyway, so what's the point in spending stupid money on a GPU when the devs won't even take advantage of the hardware.
Prices are just getting out of hand, the GPU market really needs another competitor.
I don't want to go back to console, but if this nonsense continues with the GPU market, Project Scarlet (120fps/VRR/4K compatibility) along with game pass is looking extremely tempting at this point.
All the AAA games will be developed for next gen consoles anyway, so what's the point in spending stupid money on a GPU when the devs won't even take advantage of the hardware.
Genuine Cool, the 2080ti with a 19% improvement is good.
I never get the idea of comparing the 2070 to the 1070, they could name the 2070 the Titan or the 2030, be daft comparing it to those cards (previous Titan or 1030), instead look at price, so 1070 or 1070ti to 2060, though that shows rtx and not much performance improvement
Doubt it. Hardly anyone will buy at that price. There are only so many Kaapstad's out there you know...
Intel joining can only be a good thing imo. We need competition in this space. AMD don't want to compete no more, just reduce risk and maximise profits, hence the current silly Navi pricing. Ridiculous really.
Yeah. I don't get this loyalty to one company business. I am loyal to me and my pocket. Too many people here choose sides which I find a little silly.
Genuine Cool, the 2080ti with a 19% improvement is good.
I never get the idea of comparing the 2070 to the 1070, they could name the 2070 the Titan or the 2030, be daft comparing it to those cards (previous Titan or 1030), instead look at price, so 1070 or 1070ti to 2060, though that shows rtx and not much performance improvement
You can easily get 15%+ improvement just by overclocking the standard 2080ti anyway so if a super does come maybe just grab the original if it gets a nice price cut
I to expect the ps5 and Xbox one 2 to be faster than the 5700 xt. I fully belive that’s what the console makers want however whether they get it I don’t know. I can tell you that no one is going to put the 225w 5700xt into a console so the TDP needs to come down
These consoles are going to launch as native 4K 60fps machine that runs games on equivalent to PC’s medium to high settings - maybe this could actually be done with the 5700xt with heavy optimisation but the 225w tdp is still very high
It’s actually a pity Nvidia can’t compete in the console space because their 7nm EUV chips are due to be able to offer a 5700xt type performance in 100w +-10w which would be perfect, you could launch a slim console on day one instead of a giant box like you’d need with a 5700xt
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Soldato
Impressive console performance always comes more from the developers being able to optimise for a known spec, than from the console actually containing a top-tier part.
Soldato
Consoles aren't going to use the current Navi 5700XT. This GPU was supposed to come out last year also.
As for mid high settings, some games like the last Tomb Raider, look better on XbX HDR than most high end PCs using RTX2080 on Ultra settings. Sure 30fps 4K, but it doesn't matter on TV. To get 60fps you need RTX2080Ti FTW3 Ultra (heavily factory overclocked) with DLSS on (so upscaling 2560x1440 not true 4K) to hit 60fps.
And that's a $1500 GPU against a console for less than $350. There is a 4.3x price difference for not 4.3x the performance.
Also if we start digging we would find that neither the RTX2080/RVII are great value for money over the Vega 64 atm.
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