Poll: The EU Referendum: How Will You Vote? (May Poll)

[Tunney]

I've not seen anyone say they don't want a particular group coming in, just that the overall numbers are too high.

Oh really? Lots of people in this thread saying that don't want Turkish people coming here. Lots of people saying that don't want Middle Eastern refugees coming here.

 

[Schlong&Stable]

declining population is extremely bad, and is the elephant in the room. as ours and everyone else's economics are still based on massively expanding populations. which is why I always laugh when people go but that economic policy worked 50 years ago.

in the short term, we absolutely need immigration, in the longterm we need to change economic policy as the world population will stop growing.

The "short term" is by definition, short. The problem with mass immigration is the impact is long term: we'll be dealing with it long after the "short term" motives are forgotten.

Within our lifetime automation, robotics and so forth is going to put a lot of people out of a job, mostly in the working classes. Most of the immigrant labour we bring in is low skilled or unskilled (working class). Why would we want to expand this sector of our population and exacerbate future problems?

I'd rather lose £1000 a year now than see massive social unrest in twenty years.

 

[Glaucus]

yet more wrong assumptions, short term by definition isn't short. it's relative.
and you would be seeing a lot more social unrest when the economy collapses for a long period due to population decline.

 

[trackrat]

Roll on June 23rd, lets get it over with.

We have both*sides making outrageous claims about stopping in or voting out.

As no country has left the*EU before, no politician or business leader can offer advice as to what will happen if we exit the EU, all they can do is speculate.

Osbourne and Cameron are using figures to there own end and trying to use scare tactics.

The Brexit campaign are also using pie in the sky arguments.

As far as immigration is concerned, I doubt it we will see much difference for a couple of years even if we do exit.

I personally will be voting for an exit, because I am old enough to have voted in the first referendum which was to join a common market for trade, not to be ruled from Brussels.

Whether voting out is the right way to vote as far as the younger people of this country and there future are concerned I just do not know.

 

[Glaucus]

I personally will be voting for an exit, because I am old enough to have voted in the first referendum which was to join a common market for trade, not to be ruled from Brussels.

.

where's that advert for it, which showed it was far more and advertised more than that.

 

[scorza]

There's no reason to think that we need to concrete over Cornwall. The UK is simply not that urbanised, and the scale of population increases we're talking about don't necessitate anything of the like. So... no, no-one thinks we should be concreting over Cornwall to build housing because no-one thinks its necessary.

I dunno - to keep pace with the current levels of net migration the UK needs to build a new city the size of Cardiff every year. Of course, this won't literally mean building a new city but rather expanding our current towns and cities with even greater urban sprawl. So while we probably won't be concreting over Cornwall (there's a rather influential chap who owns a lot of land there) we may well end up losing the current green spaces between major conurbations that exist at the moment.

Going high-rise again offers a potential solution, but so far no-one seems to be able to re-assure we won't see the same sort of social problems associated with going up.

 

[zom247]

According to the remain party now that Man Utd have sacked LVG we are going to lose over 300,000 UK jobs

 

[trackrat]

where's that advert for it, which showed it was far more and advertised more than that.

If you have the time read this, http://www.vernoncoleman.com/howthebritishmedia.htm
It seems nothing has changed, still crap coming from politicians on both sides.

 

[thep02]

Behold our almighty Sith Lord Boris pushing an In voter away.

Best post of the thread, vote with Borris or ya dead.

 

[Mr Jack]

I dunno - to keep pace with the current levels of net migration the UK needs to build a new city the size of Cardiff every year. Of course, this won't literally mean building a new city but rather expanding our current towns and cities with even greater urban sprawl. So while we probably won't be concreting over Cornwall (there's a rather influential chap who owns a lot of land there) we may well end up losing the current green spaces between major conurbations that exist at the moment.

Urban space covers less than 7% of UK land. Even if we housed an extra ten million people and maintained the same degree of urbanisation, it would only tick up to 8% of UK land.

 

[iamtheoneneo]

Submitted my complaint to the BBC Trust today. Not normally one to complain but **** my life their coverage on BBC Online is crazy bias.

Whether voting out is the right way to vote as far as the younger people of this country and there future are concerned I just do not know.

Exactly no one has a clue what's going to happen. We can only vote on what we feel is correct given the current political climate, in many ways it has absolutely nothing to do with money. The wheels after all, will continue to slowly grind. Economies dont just collapse overnight as Osborne would have you believe.

 

[cainer]

Jedi Boris

 

[robfosters]

Urban space covers less than 7% of UK land. Even if we housed an extra ten million people and maintained the same degree of urbanisation, it would only tick up to 8% of UK land.

Be interesting to know how much of the remaining 93% is farming and commercial land.

 

[Schlong&Stable]

yet more wrong assumptions, short term by definition isn't short. it's relative.
and you would be seeing a lot more social unrest when the economy collapses for a long period due to population decline.

Did you take a breath between accusing me of making assumptions and then making one yourself? But you're right, these are assumptions and no one knows what will happen to the economy.

We do know the direction of travel in technology though: automation, robotics, AI and so forth. These will continue to erase human jobs, and what will replace them? There's only so many designers and engineers needed.

 

[thep02]

Why?

Too many sexy dark haired brown eyed tanned girls around causing road accidents or fights to name but two.

 

[Schlong&Stable]

Urban space covers less than 7% of UK land. Even if we housed an extra ten million people and maintained the same degree of urbanisation, it would only tick up to 8% of UK land.

Yes, if you want to live in Mega City 1.

 

[scorza]

Urban space covers less than 7% of UK land. Even if we housed an extra ten million people and maintained the same degree of urbanisation, it would only tick up to 8% of UK land.

The problem with that statement is that the urban space isn't evenly distributed across the UK. It's all crammed in to the South-East corner of the UK - namely from Gtr Manchester/West Yorkshire downwards. The vast majority of the ~330k new arrivals in this country are going to be living and working in the red areas on this map:

Spoiler

So yeah, while a statistician can say an extra 10 million people will only urbanise an extra 1% of UK land, the fact there's an unspoilt wilderness in the Highlands of Scotland probably isn't much consolation to your average working family who live somewhere like Northampton who've just lost the green space where they used to walk their dogs every day.

 

[Mr Jack]

The problem with that statement is that the urban space isn't evenly distributed across the UK.

Yes, it's certainly the case that local effects can be greater but my point remains: the UK is not heavily urbanised and will not become heavily urbanised. We're not even talking about becoming as densely populated as Belgium or Holland. Of course, if you live in a city you'll be surrounded by city but that doesn't mean that there isn't green space out there and whether you've green space near you in the city is down to city planning not total population.

(Incidentally, what is that actually a map of?)

So yeah, while a statistician can say an extra 10 million people will only urbanise an extra 1% of UK land, the fact there's an unspoilt wilderness in the Highlands of Scotland probably isn't much consolation to your average working family who live somewhere like Northampton who've just lost the green space where they used to walk their dogs every day.

There's plenty of green space in Northampton and there's no reason for that to change. Maintaining greenspace for people to enjoy and use is a matter of sensible planning and ensuring that developments are managed so that parks, etc. are part of the planning process.

 

[Mr Jack]

Be interesting to know how much of the remaining 93% is farming and commercial land.

What do you mean by commercial land? If you're talking about industrial estates, or shopping malls, etc. then that is included in the 7%. Most of that 7%, by the way, isn't built on. Farming uses about 70% of the UK's land area.

 

[Schlong&Stable]

What do you mean by commercial land? If you're talking about industrial estates, or shopping malls, etc. then that is included in the 7%. Most of that 7%, by the way, isn't built on. Farming uses about 70% of the UK's land area.

But most of that farm land is not suitable for housing anyway. Heck, some of the 7% is not suitable for housing.