Poll: The EU Referendum: How Will You Vote? (May Poll)

[Metallifux]

Has everyone seen Vote.Leave's spectacular toys-out-of-the-pram tantrum because ITV have had the gall to set up a debate between Cameron and Farage, look at this quote:

"The Establishment has tried everything from spending taxpayers money on pro-EU propaganda to funding the IN campaign via Goldsman Sachs.

"The polls have stayed fifty fifty. They're now fixing the debates to shut out the official campaign.

"ITV is led by people like Robert Peston who campaigned for Britain to join the euro.

"ITV has lied to us in private while secretly stitching up a deal with Cameron to stop Boris Johnson or Michael Gove debating the issues properly.

"ITV has effectively joined the official IN campaign and there will be consequences for its future - the people in No10 won't be there for long".​

Spectacular! (Incidentally, it isn't true that Preston campaigned for the Euro, and Vote.Leave's pretence of being "anti-establishment" is hilarious).

I have no idea which clown wrote that but it is spectacularly bad.

 

[Metallifux]

In August 2015, it was revealed that the university was paid approximately £40,000 for a "glowing report" for Camila Batmanghelidjh's scandal-hit charity, Kids Company.[57] The study was used by Batmanghelidjh to prove that the charity provided good value for money and was well managed. However, the university did not disclose that the study was funded by the charity and claims made by the report have since been discredited."

Now there's a glowing endorsement if ever I saw one.

 

[Chris Wilson]

I'm told that LSE students don't wear a cap and gown on their last day, but instead pose in those paper Guy Fawkes masks.......

 

[Mr Jack]

I have no idea which clown wrote that but it is spectacularly bad.

Radio 4 are saying it was sent by Dominic Cummings, Vote.Leave's Campaign Director.

 

[Mr Jack]

Corrupt known hot bed of left wing, multi national activists, with a history of anti establishment protest could very easily be trumped by local anecdotal information:

This Brexiter insistence on smearing every institution that points out the economic realities is getting desperate. The LSE is one of Britain's top rated universities, internationally recognised, and with one of the best Economics departments in the UK; attempting to paint it as a left-wing stooge just makes you look foolish.

How about instead of engaging in ad hominem attacks you try and argue with the actual facts?

 

[Mr Jack]

London School of Economics study, it's either wrong, not fully researched or it does not reflect the same in the north.

Nothing In our location seams to confirm what the study says.

Why do you say that? How have you determined the influence of immigration relative to other factors that affect employment and wages?

 

[[TW]Fox]

Why do you say that? How have you determined the influence of immigration relative to other factors that affect employment and wages?

Because anecdotes trump research. Didn't you get the memo?

 

[Metallifux]

Radio 4 are saying it was sent by Dominic Cummings, Vote.Leave's Campaign Director.

In my opinion he needs replacing.

 

[Chris Wilson]

The actual fact is the LSE is proven corrupt Is it possible to make an ad hominen attack upon an institution, I don't believe it is!

 

[Mr Jack]

The actual fact is the LSE is proven corrupt Is it possible to make an ad hominen attack upon an institution, I don't believe it is!

You're attempting to smear the organisation rather than engage with the actual arguments. That form of argumentation is termed ad hominem. It's a particularly irrelevant example of ad hominem because, of course, your smears have nothing to do with the people who actually produced the report.

 

[Metallifux]

You're attempting to smear the organisation rather than engage with the actual arguments. That form of argumentation is termed ad hominem. It's a particularly irrelevant example of ad hominem because, of course, your smears have nothing to do with the people who actually produced the report.

Broken Rhetoric of Economically FlummoXed Idiots and Thugs

You insult thugs. Brexiteers can't compete with poor, low skilled Eastern Europeans that have basic English skills and they're afraid of homeless Syrians who are running for their lives. That's not exactly thug life, is it?

Just a couple of the guys on your side.

 

[bloodiedathame]

For consideration: Is it better to be ruled by one corrupt and backward governing body (our Government), or two (our Gov and the European Parliament)?

 

[Chris Wilson]

Here is what the EU plan as a robust guard against illegal immigrants, and people here suggest that no way will migrants into the EU be given special treatment. If this blatant attempt to circumvent basic law and order doesn't show how they plan on "handling"the migrant crisis I don't know what does:

"Meanwhile, the Council of Europe has warned that doctors, teachers, social workers and landlords should not report illegal immigrants to the Home Office because it would breach their human rights.

Its guidelines said ‘firewalls’ should be created to prevent them sharing with the immigration authorities details about failed asylum seekers or those who have sneaked in unlawfully.

If adopted, the recommendations would make it much more difficult for immigration enforcement teams to track down and remove illegals.
There has been little love lost between IDS and Sir John since, as a backbencher in the early 1990s, Mr Duncan Smith was one of a group of rebels who fought a long parliamentary campaign against the Major government's decision to sign up to the Maastricht Treaty


Analysts believe more than a million foreigners are here in the UK unlawfully. Measures introduced by the Government mean anyone accessing education, hospitals, social services, housing or work must have their immigration status checked.

Landlords who fail to check whether they are renting to illegal immigrants could face five years in jail and firms who employ illegals can be fined up to £2,000 a person.

But the anti-discrimination panel of the Council of Europe, the 47-nation parent body of the European Court of Human Rights, said yesterday that this would violate human rights laws.

A Home Office spokesman said: ‘The Home Office would not accept or support any recommendation which would bar public officials or private service providers from reporting suspected illegal immigrants.

‘There are specific arrangements in place for the Home Office to be notified where illegal immigrants seek access to benefits or local authority social services.’ "

 

[MookJong]

A section of a report into BBC bias:

http://www.iea.org.uk/sites/default/files/in-the-media/files/BBC%20Bias%20Chp%203.pdf

News-watch – a monitoring organisation that tracks flagship news programmes such as Radio 4’s Today programme – has found that voices in favour of Britain’s exit from the EU tend to be under-represented relative to those in favour of continued membership. In this instance, the relative bias against voices in favour of EU exit is exemplified by comparing their coverage with public opinion polling, which shows between a third and half of the public being in favour of EU exit at any given time.

Fresh News-watch analysis commissioned for this chapter has sought to combine all News-watch survey sample data on Radio 4’s Today programme between March 2004 and June 2015 In the monitored sample, the Today programme included 4,275 guest speakers on EU themes. Just 132 of these (3.2 per cent) were identifiably in favour of Britain’s withdrawal from the EU.

I guess there are many reasons why it might be slanted this way. But seeing as around 50% of the population are now looking to Brexit this is quite interesting.

 

[Mr Jack]

Just a couple of the guys on your side.

If I was feeling pedantic I'd point out that neither of those are actual ad hominems, merely insults. To be an ad hominem you have to carry on to argue that your opponents argument is wrong because of the insult, i.e. "Mary smells of poo and wee" is not an ad hominem whereas "Mary smells of poo and wee so her opinion about market economics is wrong" is an ad hominem.

But that's largely by-the-by. It's undeniably the case that some people on both sides of the argument have engaged in ad hominem arguments, and that both sides have at times descended into mere insult. Hell, I'll hold my hands up and admit that while I try to keep a more rational tone I've done it myself at times.

 

[Metallifux]

If I was feeling pedantic I'd point out that neither of those are actual ad hominems, merely insults. To be an ad hominem you have to carry on to argue that your opponents argument is wrong because of the insult, i.e. "Mary smells of poo and wee" is not an ad hominem whereas "Mary smells of poo and wee so her opinion about market economics is wrong" is an ad hominem.

But that's largely by-the-by. It's undeniably the case that some people on both sides of the argument have engaged in ad hominem arguments, and that both sides have at times descended into mere insult. Hell, I'll hold my hands up and admit that while I try to keep a more rational tone I've done it myself at times.

You could but at it's most basic it is attacking the person and not the argument.

 

[Captain]

I think the majority will vote to stay in, kiss goodbye to ever having another vote.

 

[VincentHanna]

Why would you ever get another vote? This is the vote and if the majority vote to stay then that's it.

 

[Mr Jack]

The ONS has published their report on the difference between the number of NI numbers allocated and migration figures. They conclude that, as previously suggested, the difference in attributable to short-term migration in which people come to the country for a short period, work, and then go home.

 

[Danthus]

Surely you need an NI number to be paid?