The first "proper" Kepler news Fri 17th Feb?

[spicypixel]

A succinct summary of my predicament as well.

Oh god, never a truer thing said, even got a 7970 on pre order to try and hedge the bets.
Either leaks come out soon ish or it gets delivered, either way I lose.

 

[ALXAndy]

Don't try and stop me!

I'll have Fonejacker ready.

Haha great ep/s they were. Really funny.

 

[N19h7m4r3]

Argh, just want to buy a new card but 7900 series is too expensive and the 580/570 aren't worth it.

I feel the same way, although I hear people are having some Problems still with Hazro monitors and AMD cards. So I'll just have to wait for Kepler to come out.

 

[spankingtexan]

Well if the GK104 doesn't at the very least match the 7970 for performance then nvidia are goint to look very silly after stating they were underwhemled with 7970.

 

[ALXAndy]

Well if the GK104 doesn't at the very least match the 7970 for performance then nvidia are goint to look very silly after stating they were underwhemled with 7970.

They didn't quite say that. They said they were underwhelmed with Tahiti (being AMD's 28nm in general).

If the 104 does compete with the 7970 then I completely agree with them. There is no way that 104 should come close to Tahiti, as Tahiti is AMD's "Balls out all out" 28nm.

104 is not Nvidia's, their high end stuff comes later in the year. If 104 does beat the 7970 then they were right, Tahiti is indeed very underwhelming considering 104 is Nvidia's cheap stop gap until the big guns come later in the year.

What we do need to find out (and we will, sooner or later) is just how much of Tahiti AMD held back for a rainy day.

Because they literally could have opened just enough of it up to get a commanding lead over the 580 and saved the rest for later.

Which is not very nice, so they better hope the 104 doesn't trash the 7970 as it will make a lot of AMD owners see AMD in a different light.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Considering they are not that far off each other in die size and probably transistor count,I don't see why a GK104 could not be faster than an HD7970,especially considering the clockspeeds of the HD7900 series. For one thing we don't know if the GK104,is the compute light version of Kepler and the GK110 is the full fat GPU. The same was seen with the GF114 and GF110. Tahiti is the GPU that AMD is going to use as the basis of its professional cards so there is a lot of added functional in the cards which is probably useless for gaming. Pitcairn OTH does not have this impediment and for its relative performance is a much smaller GPU.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Here is a leaked screenshot:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums...orce-GTX-780&p=5067211&viewfull=1#post5067211

I would take it with a large grain of salt after looking at the amount of transistors(6 billion).

 

[LeJosh]

3gb of vram?

:\

 

[dave_beast]

Fake, memory bus, transistors and vram don't add up.

 

[drunkenmaster]

They didn't quite say that. They said they were underwhelmed with Tahiti (being AMD's 28nm in general).

If the 104 does compete with the 7970 then I completely agree with them. There is no way that 104 should come close to Tahiti, as Tahiti is AMD's "Balls out all out" 28nm.

104 is not Nvidia's, their high end stuff comes later in the year. If 104 does beat the 7970 then they were right, Tahiti is indeed very underwhelming considering 104 is Nvidia's cheap stop gap until the big guns come later in the year.

What we do need to find out (and we will, sooner or later) is just how much of Tahiti AMD held back for a rainy day.

Because they literally could have opened just enough of it up to get a commanding lead over the 580 and saved the rest for later.

Which is not very nice, so they better hope the 104 doesn't trash the 7970 as it will make a lot of AMD owners see AMD in a different light.

Essentially nothing you've said there is correct.

Tahiti isn't AMD's 28nm, it's the 7970/7950, 7970 is not AMD's balls out 28nm, GK104 is almost the same size and most certainly the same "ballpark" area in terms of diesize and general speed target. Nvidia's "balls out" core will be over 500mm2, tahiti is just over 350mm2, gk104 just under, Pitcarn/gk106 are both significantly smaller. If Nvidia can come close to AMD finally on performance/mm2, there is no reason AMD should be miles ahead with a similar die size.

We'll have to see where GK104 ends up, if it has stuff stripped out of it and isn't designed for top end compute performance while AMD's is, then realistically a similarly sized core with compute vs a core without shouldn't come that close in performance. In reality the gk104 is unlikely to have much if any compute functionality stripped out.

GK104 isn't a stop gap, its a card, nothing more or less, its out first and the big one is out late, its not a stop gap, the bigger one won't replace it which is what "stop gap" would suggest. Likewise Tahiti isn't underwhelming, even the best case scenario rumoured doesn't have GK104 much ahead of Tahiti at a similar die size.

As for how much of Tahiti AMD held back, they didn't they can release a higher clocked version and they did likely bring it out at lower clocks to not be too high power and they likely will release a new version(or an 8series) near "big kepler" which will increase performance by increasing power usage.

ALso no, they couldn't literally have just opened up enough of Tahiti to beat the 580gtx. No one makes a 360mm2 core, to have any less than the maximum amount possible of it working, because they'd MAKE MORE MONEY by making smaller cores with nothing disabled, and yes, they'd upset every customer who bought one and later found out. It's why(massive problems aside) no company has ever done that on purpose, its just flat out stupid.

 

[xsistor]

They didn't quite say that. They said they were underwhelmed with Tahiti (being AMD's 28nm in general).

If the 104 does compete with the 7970 then I completely agree with them. There is no way that 104 should come close to Tahiti, as Tahiti is AMD's "Balls out all out" 28nm.

104 is not Nvidia's, their high end stuff comes later in the year. If 104 does beat the 7970 then they were right, Tahiti is indeed very underwhelming considering 104 is Nvidia's cheap stop gap until the big guns come later in the year.

What we do need to find out (and we will, sooner or later) is just how much of Tahiti AMD held back for a rainy day.

Because they literally could have opened just enough of it up to get a commanding lead over the 580 and saved the rest for later.

Which is not very nice, so they better hope the 104 doesn't trash the 7970 as it will make a lot of AMD owners see AMD in a different light.

+1

 

[ALXAndy]

3gb of vram?

:\

It may be borrowing system memory?

It's supposed to apparently.

 

[LeJosh]

It may be borrowing system memory?

It's supposed to apparently.

I doubt it would be reported in GPU-z, especially since 512 bus width should be 4GB.

 

[ALXAndy]

Essentially nothing you've said there is correct.

I read a psychological study a couple of months ago about people who argue on the internet.

A common trait is to quote what some one said, completely dispel it in one swoop and then proceed to rattle on about what you think, ignorantly dispelling everything the other person had said.

Basically you say something like "That is a load of crap" and then proceed to write your own essay, thinking you are completely right as you go.

That's why I won't even bother to reply to what you have said, as it seems that common courtesy doesn't exist to you.

Have a nice day.

 

[TheRealDeal]

I read a psychological study a couple of months ago about people who argue on the internet.

A common trait is to quote what some one said, completely dispel it in one swoop and then proceed to rattle on about what you think, ignorantly dispelling everything the other person had said.

Basically you say something like "That is a load of crap" and then proceed to write your own essay, thinking you are completely right as you go.

That's why I won't even bother to reply to what you have said, as it seems that common courtesy doesn't exist to you.

Have a nice day.

He did have some good points though. The gk104 is rumoured to be of similar size and power usage comparing to tahiti. So if its around the same speed or a little faster then to me its not surprising. The 7970 has a lot to give through clock speeds so nvidia only need to clock there part higher along with there new turbo system giving a small bump then gk104 could well be faster. When we see them both overclocked and maxed it should tell us where both gpus stand.

If tahiti came in at over 500mm2 and it was beaten from gk104 then i would be really surprised.

 

[LeJosh]

It would be interesting to see what tahiti could do at 500mm2. Considering the GPGPU performance of the 7970 is pretty good compared to a 580.

Just wonder how good it will compare to GK104/110.

 

[bagaante]

Hopefully some actual news tommorow

 

[ALXAndy]

He did have some good points though.

He may well have. But addressing some one in such a rude manner tends to have them completely not bother reading anything else they said.

Any way, enough of this gay banter.

Back to Kepler !

 

[Jakus]

ALso no, they couldn't literally have just opened up enough of Tahiti to beat the 580gtx. No one makes a 360mm2 core, to have any less than the maximum amount possible of it working, because they'd MAKE MORE MONEY by making smaller cores with nothing disabled, and yes, they'd upset every customer who bought one and later found out. It's why(massive problems aside) no company has ever done that on purpose, its just flat out stupid.

I think You will find most cores have errors and they build in a certain redundancy to allow the chips to be salvaged, hopefully this means they get more "full spec" cores and greater yields.
Functional Cores not making spec will be graded and used in lower spec cards.

example, Nvidia did not make a GTX570 core and a GTX580 they made the best GF110 core they could but the failed cores would go into the lesser card.

I would think without doubt with this new 28nm process AMD just like ALXandy said would have held back quite conservatively so potentially they should have a bit in reserve with the best cores.

 

[The Slayer_UK]

I read a psychological study a couple of months ago about people who argue on the internet.

A common trait is to quote what some one said, completely dispel it in one swoop and then proceed to rattle on about what you think, ignorantly dispelling everything the other person had said.

Basically you say something like "That is a load of crap" and then proceed to write your own essay, thinking you are completely right as you go.

That's why I won't even bother to reply to what you have said, as it seems that common courtesy doesn't exist to you.

Have a nice day.

I dont want to get into an argument here as i find what you say very interesting but what you said in this post you did to me the other day


I said this

Originally Posted by The Slayer_UK View Post
to be honest they dont have to give us any info and with them not giving us any info is actually creating more of a buzz or getting us talking about it more than if they were to give us specs.

I bet NV are laughing thier heads off looking at forums that have a load of rumoured specs and release dates that havent even come from them.

at the end of the day it will come out when NV want it to and not a day before they will charge what they want too

then you replied with this

It does make me LOL how you seem to think that a company can treat people as it wishes, treat them like idiots, sit and laugh at them and still live in the hope that people will buy their products.

It doesn't work like that you see, not in the real world.

A couple of years ago I placed an order with an OCUK competitor. I bought a product that had a large label on the box that said "SUPPORTS AMD PHENOM FX PROCESSORS".

However, when it arrived it did not support mine and was as dead as a dodo.

I sent the board back and was told that I now had to pay £15 for both ways shipping and pay a £10 "testing fee".

I asked them to show me where on their website or on the box or in the manual that it may not support MY Phenom FX processor and they couldn't. They just said that that was that. Not only that but I ended up spending £4 on phone calls to their 0870 number paying to fix a problem that wasn't my problem. I heard them in the background laughing and joking and thinking it was funny.

That's cool. Not only did I never buy anything from them again (paying more to deliberately get it somewhere else) but I also wrote an article for a website that I write for posting all of the evidence.

At first they tried to bully the site's owner and make him take down my "review" but he refused as they had no legal grounds to do so. What I had said was perfectly true and correct, that "other" company had simply underestimated who I was and the clout I could have for writing reviews of websites and products.

No doubt they lost more business, as I then went ahead and disclosed information of how they had tried to backtrack and bully people into retracting the truth.

When you are in business you can conduct yourself however you like. You can post crap talk (like "Wow ! isn't Tahiti underwhelming !") you can post fake pictures, you can post products made from wood. You can lie about availability and you can basically act however you want to.

However. Given that it is a business and not something you are laying on for free you really need to be careful about burning your customers. After the Fermi debacle I had vowed never to trust a word they said and never to force myself to go without because of what they said. In that time they lost a loyal customer, as up until that point I had not bought a AMD/ATI card in nearly a decade.

Fermi cards did not sell and stocks plummeted.They also alienated Intel with their arrogance and that cost them dearly too. Intel merely responded back by saying "Sorry, no more Intel socket licenses for you we will take that business thanks !" and did. Nvidia no longer make motherboards.

So whilst I do find it humorous that you think that Nvidia can treat people how they want with such disregard and reckless abandon I promise you now their arrogance will cost them.

Look at what is happening to GAME right now. That is what happens when you get above your station and think you can act and treat people however you want to.

They will quite rightly be starved into administration as a reward for how they treat people.

Karma. What goes around comes around.

The bold part you basically was rubbishing what i have said and was in directly saying it was a load of crap then you proceeded to write an eassay thinking your completly right

As i siad i dont want an argument but just becarefull as sometime your posts seem to come off the wrong way and again as i said i do enjoy reading yours and others posts are you are all very experinced in computers