The muslims are at it again

HEADRAT · 14 Feb 2007 at 21:48

VIRII said:
in which case both positive and negative numbers should be considered to get a true answer....

Ah OK no respect or recognition for those that did die then, just an equation.

VIRII said:
I still await your explanation as to WHY I should respect peoples religious beliefs...... nice diversion though..... I'd like an explanation though.

So if you don't respect somebodies beliefs what do you use:-

The colour of their skin
Their sexual orientation
How much money they earn
Are they are Man of Honour

what do you choose to respect in people?

You seem to pretty disgusted about the Muslim approach to homosexuality so does this mean you agree and support homosexuals? Maybe you don't like homosexuality and were just using it as another way of knocking Muslims?

HEADRAT

VIRII · 14 Feb 2007 at 21:53

HEADRAT said:
Ah OK no respect or recognition for those that did die then, just an equation.

So if you don't respect somebodies beliefs what do you use:-

The colour of their skin
Their sexual orientation
How much money they rarn
Are they are Man of Honour

what do you choose to respect in people?

You seem to pretty disgusted about the Muslim approach to homosexuality so does this mean you agree and support homosexuals?

HEADRAT

As everyone is an individual I'll treat them as such.
I don't have a formula for it. I respect people whose actions deserve respect.
Colour, sexual orientation, salary etc are irrelevent. How they treat other people is not.

I take the view that some people are homosexual and they are not an affront to God, they do not deserve to be stoned to death, they are not evil and did not chose to be gay.
I've met some gay people who are great and some who are utter morons. Once again they are individuals and are all different. I mentioned it before - my Wife works within the "Arts dahhhlliing" so I have met a lot of gay people lol, acting seems to attract them.

Do you know what the muslim approach to homosexuality is? Google it, watch a few hangings, a few stonings. Tell me you respect it...

HEADRAT · 14 Feb 2007 at 21:55

So what would happen if you knew somebody for a while and respected them then found out they were Muslim, obviously being part of his religion he starts to talk to you about maybe "converting", would you still respect him?

Obviously this goes for many other major religions

HEADRAT

VIRII · 14 Feb 2007 at 21:58

HEADRAT said:
So what would happen if you knew somebody for a while and respected them then found out they were Muslim, obviously being part of his religion he starts to talk to you about maybe "converting", would you still respect him?

HEADRAT

Yup. My best mate is a muslim, I work with a lot of muslims, some came to my wedding as invited guests........

HEADRAT · 14 Feb 2007 at 21:59

But isn't their a religion an affront to your beliefs?

HEADRAT

VIRII · 14 Feb 2007 at 22:02

HEADRAT said:
But isn't their a religion an affront to your beliefs?

HEADRAT

Depends how they go about it

There is a world of difference between Abu Hamza and B&W for example.
I respect B&W, he is articulate, sensible, provides good debate and is a muslim.
Abu Hamza on the other hand (or hook) I detest.

cleanbluesky · 14 Feb 2007 at 22:05

VIRII said:
Depends how they go about it
There is a world of difference between Abu Hamza and B&W for example.
I respect B&W, he is articulate, sensible, provides good debate and is a muslim.
Abu Hamza on the other hand (or hook) I detest.

Strangely enough I would have said exactly the same about B&W - seems a thoroughly decent, honest and unpretentious bloke.

Raz · 14 Feb 2007 at 22:06

VIRII said:
Depends how they go about it
There is a world of difference between Abu Hamza and B&W for example.
I respect B&W, he is articulate, sensible, provides good debate and is a muslim.
Abu Hamza on the other hand (or hook) I detest.

Hasn't B&W turned away from Islam, or was that someone else? You like Muslims who don't follow/believe in Islam I take it?

I'm a bit hurt you didn't use me

HEADRAT · 14 Feb 2007 at 22:07

But you have stated stuff like:-

VIRII said:
State sanctioned legalised muslim paedophilia? Should I respect that too I wonder

so how do you rationalise that with being friends who believes in Islam and it's teachings, if I felt as strongly as you I would find it very hard!

cleanbluesky · 14 Feb 2007 at 22:08

Raz said:
Hasn't B&W turned away from Islam, or was that someone else? You like Muslims who don't follow/believe in Islam I take it?

I think he has his own interpretation rather than merely having 'turned away'

VIRII · 14 Feb 2007 at 22:10

Raz said:
Hasn't B&W turned away from Islam, or was that someone else? You like Muslims who don't follow/believe in Islam I take it?

I'm a bit hurt you didn't use me

Nope B&W hasn't turned from Islam. My best mate sort of has in that he isn't a very good muslim, he is a good person though and that matters a lot more.

I don't believe in Islam, indeed I think that a lot of people around the world are suffering terribly because of it. The world would be better off without it altogether. Indeed we only need one simple guideline in life -"treat others as you wish to be treated". No need to face east, pray, bow, learn reams of text etc, etc. Just be nice to people and everything is fine.

VIRII · 14 Feb 2007 at 22:12

HEADRAT said:
But you have stated stuff like:-

so how do you rationalise that with being friends who believes in Islam and it's teachings, if I felt as strongly as you I would find it very hard!

Because in reality there are lots of shades of muslim just as there are many shades of christian.
Not all muslims believe in beheading people, not all muslims think alcohol is a sin, not all muslims believe women to be chattel etc.

HEADRAT · 14 Feb 2007 at 22:13

VIRII said:
"treat others as you wish to be treated". No need to face east, pray, bow, learn reams of text etc, etc. Just be nice to people and everything is fine.

Amen to that

VIRII said:
Because in reality there are lots of shades of muslim just as there are many shades of christian.
Not all muslims believe in beheading people, not all muslims think alcohol is a sin, not all muslims believe women to be chattel etc.

Sure, but every religion has its fundemental beliefs, aren't they at odds with yours? I can't think of many religions that support homosexuality for example. At some point if you are too far away from the religion and it's teaching surely you can no longer call yourself a Muslim, Christian, Jew etc.

HEADRAT

starscream · 15 Feb 2007 at 00:06

VIRII said:
Who is imposing that culture on them?

They probably believe western capitalism is responsible. I've never been there though, so I have no idea if that is true or not.

VIRII said:
What laws are in place to ensure that culture can be established there?

No idea. But I would rather live in a country with laws designed to ensure freedom of people to practice certain cultures than one that restricts them.

VIRII said:
Is there a crime there of not sending a valentines card?

Obviously not. Relevence?

VIRII said:
Curry was not imposed on the UK. Valentines cards are not imposed on pakistan.

Of course. Logically, you will have no problem with Halal bank accounts, school diners etc. as they are not "Imposed"

VIRII said:
PC and "multiculturalism" is most certainly IMPOSED on people here.

Really? If you believe that, take to the streets and burn effigies of the symbols of multiculturalism, if you feel so strongly against it. I would have far more respect for people who make their feelings known through legal forms of protest than just moaning at it from behind a keyboard (not aimed specifically at you

)

pyro · 15 Feb 2007 at 03:35

Spie said:
Where are the whingeing lefties? They must be champing at the bit. Come on, put down that Guardian and complain dammit.

I am with these guys, the more they burn the better. How come blokes don't get the same special treatment we give our ladies every year? We have to go to the shops, see what's nice, and, if we manage to figure out the impossible algorithms behind sizes, and can afford, buy it, only to figure out she doesn't like it.

BloodWolf · 15 Feb 2007 at 03:41

Burn their exotic sheets

Stelly · 15 Feb 2007 at 08:37

Spie said:
Simply not buying a Valentine card is not enough. You must be photographed burning one, preferably shouting some religious tripe at the same time. Then you may go to heaven.

classic

Stelly

VIRII · 15 Feb 2007 at 09:25

HEADRAT said:
Amen to that

Sure, but every religion has its fundemental beliefs, aren't they at odds with yours? I can't think of many religions that support homosexuality for example. At some point if you are too far away from the religion and it's teaching surely you can no longer call yourself a Muslim, Christian, Jew etc.

HEADRAT

To some extent. The church for example is having internal issues over the subject of homosexuality. Some christians feel homosexuality is wrong, others don't, some can't decide.
One of my fundamental beliefs is that religion is man made to control people and uses a pinch of simple common sense (10 commandments) with a dash of carrot (promise of heaven) with a dollop of stick (hell) to keep people in line. Not for their eternal salvation but to ensure the people in power remain there.

So if you base your whole life on your religion and refuse to see it as anything other than the true word of god then it is unlikely that we'll be socially compatible.

If you accept that it has good bits and bad bits and has been twisted and warped by men over time to suit their own ends (eg the birth of the CoE to suit henry) and that the general message is be nice to people then we'll get along fine. If you want to kill people for having different beliefs then we won't.

Some people are more *religious* than others.

VIRII · 15 Feb 2007 at 09:28

starscream said:
Of course. Logically, you will have no problem with Halal bank accounts, school diners etc. as they are not "Imposed"

School dinners have a cost attached to them that the taxpayer is funding.
Halal bank accounts don't.

starscream said:
Really? If you believe that, take to the streets and burn effigies of the symbols of multiculturalism, if you feel so strongly against it. I would have far more respect for people who make their feelings known through legal forms of protest than just moaning at it from behind a keyboard (not aimed specifically at you )

Are you suggesting that positive discrimination doesn't exist and that it is not an aspect of PC or multiculturalism? Are you suggesting that this Govt does not promote MC? Do you REALLY believe that?

VIRII · 15 Feb 2007 at 09:29

pyro said:
I am with these guys, the more they burn the better. How come blokes don't get the same special treatment we give our ladies every year? We have to go to the shops, see what's nice, and, if we manage to figure out the impossible algorithms behind sizes, and can afford, buy it, only to figure out she doesn't like it.

You don't? I do......