Tower block fire - london

Saw the report on TV last night about Mohammed Alhajali, from his brothers who managed to escape. Absolutely heartbreaking hearing about their phone call, with Mohammed asking why they left him in the flat. Having brothers myself, I just can't imagine what they went through and are going through now. Don't think I've ever felt so upset watching a news report on TV :(.
RIP
 
ubersonic said:
Insulated cavity walls probably, concrete towers are notoriously lossy for heat, this would have (in theory) knocked quite a bit of residents heating bills.
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Sorry is this statement meant as a justification for cladding? I'm asking the 3 questions below together for a reason, ideally you'd address each if possible.

When you/they say there are problems of heat loss in some old concrete buildings, compared to what?
Are there far more efficient dwelling types (in regards to heating) for the housing of 150 people?
Over what period does the energy cost of the production of cladding of a typical tower block become surpassed by the efficiency saving for inhabitants?
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easyrider said:
I have a BA honours degree in TV and radio production. I understand how the media works.
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stand back people...... easyrider has a BA (yes that's right a BA) in 'TV and radio production' and 'understands how the media works.' I'm sorry but those of you with 'A' levels or below will just have to defer to his appeal to his own authority......

Presumably someone with a masters with a different opinon would trump his opinion?

in other news personally I have a BEng in Civil Engineering so I obviously I know how buildings 'work' so can lecture you all re that? (I haven't actually worked in civil engineering or the building industry for nearly 20 odd years but hay ho I still have the certificate!)

in other news some shamless political posturing and point scoring has been going on over the unfortunate death of the residents of the block. You could see the non to disguised glee of some people upon realising the fire had been in a tory lead council and so was an even greater opportunity to shoe horn in some good old proganda about it all being about 'cuts' and obviously down to the nasty party alone.....
 
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molinari said:
Saw the report on TV last night about Mohammed Alhajali, from his brothers who managed to escape. Absolutely heartbreaking hearing about their phone call, with Mohammed asking why they left him in the flat. Having brothers myself, I just can't imagine what they went through and are going through now. Don't think I've ever felt so upset watching a news report on TV :(.
RIP
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Just saw that myself, its awful, RIP
 
Caracus2k said:
maybe no one? Sometimes bad things happen without 'someone' automatically having to be sent to prison?

I mean like if building codes have been followed and you know like no one actually broke the law?
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If building and fire codes were properly followed I doubt this fire would have happened.
 
molinari said:
Saw the report on TV last night about Mohammed Alhajali, from his brothers who managed to escape. Absolutely heartbreaking hearing about their phone call, with Mohammed asking why they left him in the flat. Having brothers myself, I just can't imagine what they went through and are going through now. Don't think I've ever felt so upset watching a news report on TV :(.
RIP
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I thought its way too intrusive to be interviewing clearly traumatised people..its almost unbearable to watch shouldnt be broadcast
 
molinari said:
Saw the report on TV last night about Mohammed Alhajali, from his brothers who managed to escape. Absolutely heartbreaking hearing about their phone call, with Mohammed asking why they left him in the flat. Having brothers myself, I just can't imagine what they went through and are going through now. Don't think I've ever felt so upset watching a news report on TV :(.
RIP
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I can't find a news story to this effect?

It sounds like he and his brother both escaped the flat, then he went back to the flat and placed a call to his family in Syria.

Still just as tragic. Imagine escaping Syria and securing a home and a place of study here in the UK, only for this to happen... :(
 
Caracus2k said:
maybe no one? Sometimes bad things happen without 'someone' automatically having to be sent to prison?
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Tower blocks are designed to be inherently safe and allow protected passage for residents in emergency situations (such as fire), the refit of this building appeared to circumvent any fire protection and escape measures put in place (either defined by building code or best practice), this means that at some point along the design --> completion process someone didn't identify this as a possible major accident hazard, for that reason someone will be prosecuted and given the amount of fatalities odds are someone will end up in prison.
 
Firestar_3x said:
Tower blocks are designed to be inherently safe and allow protected passage for residents in emergency situations (such as fire), the refit of this building appeared to circumvent any fire protection and escape measures put in place (either defined by building code or best practice), this means that at some point along the design --> completion process someone didn't identify this as a possible major accident hazard, for that reason someone will be prosecuted and given the amount of fatalities odds are someone will end up in prison.
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the re fit of this building was not at all unusual..... you can put the pitch fork and noose down for now until an investigation has been completed and we can figure out if anyone did actually break the law?

Dunks said:
If building and fire codes were properly followed I doubt this fire would have happened.
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are fire and building codes infallible?
 
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Caracus2k said:
stand back people...... easyrider has a BA (yes that's right a BA) in 'TV and radio production' and 'understands how the media works.' I'm sorry but those of you with 'A' levels or below will just have to defer to his appeal to his own authority......

Presumably someone with a masters with a different opinon would trump his opinion?

in other news personally I have a BEng in Civil Engineering so I obviously I know how buildings 'work'?

in other news some shameless political posturing and point scoring has been going on over the unfortunate death of the residents of the block. You could see then non to disguised glee of some people upon realising the fire had been in a Tory lead council and so was an even greater opportunity to shoe horn in some good old propaganda about it all being about 'cuts' and obviously down to the nasty party alone.....
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It was sad, but far from unexpected, to see a fire brigade official was one of the first to get a not so gentle dig in about Tory cuts in a totally tenuous and pre-emptive association with this fire. It's a shame that the historically Left leaning fire brigade and its union can't even manage to go two days after a big fire without making some political comment, but historically they have always been agitators. I believe "unfortunate accident" is a phrase that has left the English language to be replaced by hostility to anyone perceived to be making any money, or being fortunate to live in a wealthy area. If the place had been left looking like a throw back to the seventies reinforced concrete era that too would have been wrong. I genuinely feel very sorry for Mrs. May, the media and the Left are in full attack mode since the intoxicating whiff of Corbyn going from total ridicule to merely losing the election.
 
Firestar_3x said:
Interesting to see who ends up in prison for this.
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No one will go to prison. The residents will blame the council, the council will blame the contractors, the contractors will blame the regulators, the regulators will fire up the lawyers and it'll be red tape a go go for 5 years after which some government department will be fined half a million which will go from one government pocket to another.
 
It's such a tragedy this. All could've been prevented if the fire was contained in the flat, like it should have been.

I'm sure heads will roll but it won't bring back the people.

I generally hate the idea of flats for similar reasons and I really can't understand how people are going to cope with this, never mind loosing your home which will take months to rebuild, they've lost brothers and other family members.. the brother who called and asked why you left me, jeez.. his brothers will blame themselves for the rest of their lifes.
 
Caracus2k said:
are fire and building codes infallible?
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Of course not, but you would think they would be robust enough to ensure a small fire caused by a fridge in a single apartment out of 240 apartments would not completely annihilate the building when correctly followed.
 
Dunks said:
Of course not, but you would think they would be robust enough to ensure a small fire caused by a fridge in a single apartment out of 240 apartments would not completely annihilate the building when correctly followed.
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The fridge hasn't been identified as the cause though yet.
 
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