*Transfer Window 2014/15 Season Rumours/Signings *AKA Man U fans listing every player under the Sun
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Wow. If that turns out to be true, then that's crazy money.
David Luiz type crazy money...
City are briefing the press as it being 40m euros so not sure who is right. Interested to see how that guy has got those figures, can't see anyone else reporting figures for the third party owners.
I have seen a few mention that just because we have paid 24m to Porto for X % doesn't mean we have paid XXm for x% to the third parties.
Either way, we have needed a CB for a while now. Mangala has all the attributes we need and has a good mix of experience at the top level for his age as well. Sometimes you just gotta pay what it is.
I have seen a few mention that just because we have paid 24m to Porto for X % doesn't mean we have paid XXm for x% to the third parties.
Either way, we have needed a CB for a while now. Mangala has all the attributes we need and has a good mix of experience at the top level for his age as well. Sometimes you just gotta pay what it is.
While we're on the subject of centre backs - Gazetta (Italian) are reporting that Chelsea have put in a 38m euro (£30.3m) bid for Benatia. That's pretty much what United were rumoured to have put in for him as well. If both are true (... appropriate amount of salt of course), then we could have a bidding war on our hands.
I kind of hope this is true... Cahill / Terry was a great partnership last season, but Benatia is a really top class CB, and transitioning him into the squad to replace Terry can only be a good thing. He's 27 so he could give five years service easily enough. We've had a good transfer window so far, making a net profit, so a £30m outlay isn't unreasonable to replace a player like Terry. I'd prefer Varane, but persuading Real to let him go will not be easy.
I kind of hope this is true... Cahill / Terry was a great partnership last season, but Benatia is a really top class CB, and transitioning him into the squad to replace Terry can only be a good thing. He's 27 so he could give five years service easily enough. We've had a good transfer window so far, making a net profit, so a £30m outlay isn't unreasonable to replace a player like Terry. I'd prefer Varane, but persuading Real to let him go will not be easy.
You just bought Zouma, no point spending so much cash on players and not trusting them.
Eh... Zouma is 19. He's an amazing player for a 19 year old, and he has the potential to be a world-class defender in time, but he's not ready for a starting place just yet.
If we don't buy another centre back this summer then he'll make a good backup / rotation player, but if we do buy someone like Benatia or Varane then he can go out on loan for a season or two and develop further. He'll (probably) still build value.
Varane made his debut with Madrid at 18 - if Zouma is as good as you say there should be no problem with him starting league games against some of the lower teams to give Terry/Chill a break.
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Top players are rarely incapable of getting decent games under their belt at such ages and playing a lot between 18-23 is important if they are ever going to be good. If you look at all the best players in the world, the ones who weren't playing more than half of the first team games in a season by 19 or 20 are few and far between. Most look plenty decent and are good enough for at least a lot of games at that age. If he's not good enough to get games now, he won't be in 2 years having still not played any games.
If he's good enough, he's good enough and needs chances to improve and gel with the team. If he's not good enough to have a chance today, there is very little reason to think he'd be good enough 2-3 years from now.
If he's good enough, he's good enough and needs chances to improve and gel with the team. If he's not good enough to have a chance today, there is very little reason to think he'd be good enough 2-3 years from now.
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Except players develop at different rates, potentially blossoming later on. Have you never played FM.
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WHy are you naming those players and in what context?
Bale made 43 appearances for Southampton at 17, 12 for Spurs at 18, 30 for Spurs at 19, 34 at 20.... etc
Henry made 2 appearances at 16, 8 at 17, 22 at 18yrs old, 48 at 19yrs old, 44 at 20yrs old.. then 38 spread across two different clubs at 21years old and 47 appearances in his first year at Arsenal at 22 years old.
So... were you suggesting these were two players who didn't play much by 19? Because it seems to me Henry played 78 games before turning 20, and Bale played 82.
DO you think Henry would have burst into big form with Arsenal at 22 had he not already played some 160 games before he joined Arsenal, I don't think so. What about Bale, do you think he'd have been sold for 80mil, if he hadn't played 248 games before he turned 24?
This is excluding internationals, which for both players isn't a huge number but still experience, add in under 21 national performances and those numbers would increase further still.
You named two guys with a huge number of games before hitting 20, the best players start playing at 16-17 for a reason. They are better at 17, they are better by 20, they are better at 28 than other players. better players are better, age doesn't really come in to it. Great players are rarely not worthy of first team games by 19, the number of players who ended up great who barely played till over 20 is very very small.
If they are actually brilliant when they start playing doesn't matter all that much, it's games, experience, improving. If you aren't getting games by 19, where is the improvement going to come from when other players are getting games at that age? Bale wasn't brilliant at 18 and 19, and 20, but he showed potential, and to be the player he is today required playing those 200 games previously at the key ages.
Look at how many players at Arsenal/Chelsea/Utd who DON'T play much between 18-23 end up leaving, stagnating, never improving beyond their potential they showed at 18-19 and end up in some non league team or maybe league two.
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It depends who else is in the side doesn' it? He's not good enough (yet) to break up the Terry Cahill partnership for the big games. He'll get plenty of game time this season though, and he'll start a few games. As he improves he'll get more time.
As for the comparison to Varane - I don't think he's quite at the level Varane was at 19. Not far off, but not quite there. Doesn't stop him from being a very promising player, or very well rounded for a 19 year old. He certainly has the potential to be world class in a few years.
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Stats are great, but Henry was trying his best to disappear off the radar when Wenger placed £10m of faith in him. He'd lost all of his confidence until Wenger moved him from the winger role to the inside forward and then striker role he has since been rightfully idolised for.
It's comfortably one of the signings of the last couple of decades, but it wasn't for his ability as a teen, more remodelling him and training into a role he suited more.
Given that, it's quite the ammunition Wenger's detractors have against Walcott's relative lack of progression since signing, as many thought he'd be in the similar mould to Henry - wide-man come striker.... as it is he's more Lennon than Henry.
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Lenny Henry?
... as for the general question of age, there have been quite a few who develop later but still became world class players. To name some obvious examples:
Drogba
Ribery
Klose
Larsson
Ian Wright (still playing Sunday league at 22).
Hell, even Frank Lampard wouldn't have had a shot at getting in a very top side by 19. Neither would Diego Costa.
By 19 you certainly hope to see signs of promise - top players who show very little talent before 20 are rare. But young players need games to develop, which is why Chelsea send so many young prospects out on loan. Some work out (e.g. Courtois), and many don't.
Drogba
Ribery
Klose
Larsson
Ian Wright (still playing Sunday league at 22).
Hell, even Frank Lampard wouldn't have had a shot at getting in a very top side by 19. Neither would Diego Costa.
By 19 you certainly hope to see signs of promise - top players who show very little talent before 20 are rare. But young players need games to develop, which is why Chelsea send so many young prospects out on loan. Some work out (e.g. Courtois), and many don't.
I agree with you to some extent. However you were talking about paying £30m to transition Benatia into the team to replace Terry in the long term. If Zouma is as good as you say, he should be doing that. I think some of the bigger clubs are too scared to put some faith in their young players, but that's a different discussion - don't want to derail the transfers thread further!
In other news, it appears Leicester might be close to signing Cambiasso. I'll be amazed if this happens - haven't seen much of him for a few years, so hope he's still got something to offer and isn't just after a final paycheck. We could do with a high quality defensive midfielder.
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No, please. The refreshing break in the Man Utd Vidal/
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