Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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For those wondering what the area will look like when the water level drops in a few days

The Germans drew maps of the area in 1943 after the last time the Russians blew the dam

You can see a large wet lands area will be uncovered and further north, the one big river will split into many smaller streams



 
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Grim5 said:
Before blowing the dam, the Russians kept the gates closed to raise the water level as high as possible

Where there is smoke there is fire

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I have been keeping an open mind on who did it. I want to avoid assuming it was Russia just because Ukraine said it was. But that looks like fairly compelling evidence. Lower the level to plant explosives. Then fill it to the top and let rip.
 
Orangeade said:
And should people then have a say in it?

I've seen nothing but pure propaganda in the press to date. Are people being given the chance of an informed choice in their support of escalation?
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Interesting, when I was reading it this morning it was Wall to wall coverage of the dastardly Russians having blown it up......in the absolute lack of information whatsoever.

Now BBC is finally adding that the Russians are accusing Ukraine of doing it. The propaganda is insane.

Hades said:
I have been keeping an open mind on who did it. I want to avoid assuming it was Russia just because Ukraine said it was. But that looks like fairly compelling evidence. Lower the level to plant explosives. Then fill it to the top and let rip.
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It wouldn't surprise me that the Russians did it, the Ukrainians did it, a third party did it or that there was accumulated damage. But hearing everyone bleat like sheep within 10 seconds of it happening is just depressing.

Also wasn't Russia meant to have destroyed oil pipes under a dangerous sea with divers. Why would they need to lower water by a couple of metres?
 
Orangeade said:
Interesting, when I was reading it this morning it was Wall to wall coverage of the dastardly Russians having blown it up......in the absolute lack of information whatsoever.

Now BBC is finally adding that the Russians are accusing Ukraine of doing it. The propaganda is insane.



It wouldn't surprise me that the Russians did it, the Ukrainians did it, a third party did it or that there was accumulated damage. But hearing everyone bleat like sheep within 10 seconds of it happening is just depressing.

Also wasn't Russia meant to have destroyed oil pipes under a dangerous sea with divers. Why would they need to lower water by a couple of metres?
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I’ve no idea of it was coincidence or not but you’re going to need a lot more explosives to blow a dam than a pipe. A huge amount more. Good luck carrying that.
Also seems to be suggestions it was ripped open from the engine room, for lack of a better term, where the turbines are thus rendering the site useless.

My guess, Russians got wind of an upcoming or already occurring advance in the region and popped it.
 
Orangeade said:
Interesting, when I was reading it this morning it was Wall to wall coverage of the dastardly Russians having blown it up......in the absolute lack of information whatsoever.

Now BBC is finally adding that the Russians are accusing Ukraine of doing it. The propaganda is insane.



It wouldn't surprise me that the Russians did it, the Ukrainians did it, a third party did it or that there was accumulated damage. But hearing everyone bleat like sheep within 10 seconds of it happening is just depressing.

Also wasn't Russia meant to have destroyed oil pipes under a dangerous sea with divers. Why would they need to lower water by a couple of metres?
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How odd.

BBC always do this. Their impartiality is well known.

Just because you can do something more difficult doesn't mean that you automatically take the difficult route if an easy one is available.
You would need more specialised explosives experts to be able to undertake the action below the water line to at/above it. It would also be more time consuming / less effective if undertaken below.
 
Goksly said:
What 2 metres? No difference...
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2 metres drop is a ridiculously huge volume of water in a dam that size.

If someone knows the surface area, you can calculate that easily.

For reference, one cubic metre of water is 1 metric tonne. The dnieper has a flow rate of about 1500 cubic m per second. That is a LOT of water- the Taff (my local river) is about 4 cu m per second.
 
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potatolord said:
2 metres drop is a ridiculously huge volume of water in a dam that size.

If someone knows the surface area, you can calculate that easily.

For reference, one cubic metre of water is 1 metric tonne. The dnieper has a flow rate of about 1500 cubic m per second. That is a LOT of water- the Taff (my local river) is about 4 cu m per second.
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Not to mention the amplifying effect of water to any explosive. That the whole reason why Upkeep(bouncing bomb) worked. It slid down the dam wall and exploded against it. Instead of needing a 10,000Kg bomb upkeep was just over 4200Kg and had greater effect. Drop the water level 2m to make it easier to fit the explosives. Fill it up again to maximises the effects.. simples.
 
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I must confess that I don't really see the point in destroying the dam. It may well stop the Ukrainian advance, but unless it destroyed a lot of vehicles and people, then all it does is delay the inevitable. This is a card the Russians can only play once. It's not like they can blow it up for a second time.
 
SpellowHouse said:
I must confess that I don't really see the point in destroying the dam. It may well stop the Ukrainian advance, but unless it destroyed a lot of vehicles and people, then all it does is delay the inevitable. This is a card the Russians can only play once. It's not like they can blow it up for a second time.
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Perhaps they're "shaping the"... internal political landscape to justify any eventual retreat from Crimea. Ie "those naughty Ukrainians stopped the water supply so we left on humanitarian grounds."

Maybe we'll never know though.
 

Photos

You can see the section on the left that the Russians destroyed on the retreat from Kherson in the 2nd photo (or first bit of the gif). All Ukraine needed to do was bridge that small piece to get a crossing of the Dnipro now its just as bad as any other sections (maybe worse because the water flow).
 
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